chessgames.com
Members · Prefs · Collections · Openings · Endgames · Sacrifices · History · Search Kibitzing · Kibitzer's Café · Chessforums · Tournament Index · Players · Kibitzing

search collections   |   new tournaments   |   vote on collections   |   editor help
Kibitzer's Cafe
< Earlier Kibitzing  · PAGE 282 OF 282 ·  Later Kibitzing>
Jul-23-14
Premium Chessgames Member
  Tabanus: Well I nominated it at Game Collection Voting. Still with time to improve the English etc.

<PMD: It would be nice to see the full names of the players> I hope the CG table on top which have the full names will be enough. As in Korchnoi - Polugaevsky Candidates Semifinal (1980).

Jul-23-14
Premium Chessgames Member
  Paint My Dragon: <Tabanus> Oh yes, I think you have mentioned that before. Hopefully, I'll remember next time!
Jul-23-14
Premium Chessgames Member
  Chessical: <Tabanus> Thank you for the rescheduled dates for Lein and prize money details form "The Times". I have used this material to complete Game Collection: Hastings (1980/81), whcih I have now nominated.
Jul-23-14
Premium Chessgames Member
  Tabanus: <Chessical> If you want to footnote it the prize 1000 L is from Golombek in The Times, January 16, 1981, page 14.
Jul-23-14
Premium Chessgames Member
  chessgames.com: We received an email showering us with praise for the invaluable Tournament Index, and then the fellow urged us to incorporate Game Collection: Hastings 1935/36 as he is a huge fan of Reuben Fine.

Just thought you'd like to know.

Jul-23-14
Premium Chessgames Member
  Tabanus: I started optimistically with Game Collection: Portoroz Interzonal Playoff 1973, but see now that information will be hard to find. Few (and perhaps incorrect) dates (from Dutch newspapers), no arbiter, not even exact venue.
Jul-23-14
Premium Chessgames Member
  Chessical: <Tabanus> The dates are:

1. Geller - Polugayevsky, September 5th 1973
2. Portisch - Geller, September 6th & 8th 1973
3. Polugayevsky - Portisch, September 7th & 8th 1973
4. Polugayevsky - Geller, September 9th 1973
5. Geller - Portisch, September 10th & 12th 1973
6. Portisch - Polugayevsky, September 11th 1973
7. Geller - Polugayevsky, September 13th 1973
8. Portisch - Geller, September 14th 1973
9. Polugayevsky - Portisch, September 15th 1973
10. Polugayevsky - Geller, September 17th 1973
11. Geller - Portisch, September 19th 1973
12. Portisch - Polugayevsky, September 21st 1973

It also has Geller losing Game 5 on time after incorrectly marking the time control at move 84 instead of 88 on his score sheet.

Source: "World Championship Interzonals, Leningrad-Petropolis, 1973" RG Wade, LS Blackstock, A Kotov. Batsford 1974. Pages 277 - 281.

Jul-23-14
Premium Chessgames Member
  Tabanus: <Chessical> Great, thanks! The Dutch newspapers lag behind two days, as I in fact suspected.
Jul-23-14
Premium Chessgames Member
  Tabanus: Dates for Hastings 1935/36:

Round 1 Dec 27
Round 2 Dec 28
No play on Sunday Dec 29
Round 3 Dec 30
Round 4 Dec 30 (!)
Round 5 Dec 31
Round 6 Jan 1
Round 7 Jan 2
Round 8 Jan 3
Round 9 Jan 4

“Dr Max Euwe … politely declined on the ground that after his gruelling championship match with Alexhine he needed a long rest.” (Evening Telegraph 27 Dec 1935 p. 8)

All from http://www.britishnewspaperarchive..... Not much else to find there except results (also in lower sections) and comments on games.

Jul-23-14
Premium Chessgames Member
  zanzibar: <Dubai 2014 Blitz WC>

<CG> games with results that don't match <FIDE>'s:

1-0 = Markus Ragger -- Fabiano Caruana (R2.18) (A46) 2014.06.19 = 0-1 Gabriel Sargissian -- David Anton Guijarro (R2.19) (E60) 2014.06.19 0-1 1-0 Luka Lenic -- Gabriel Sargissian (R3.17) (A07) 2014.06.19 1-0 = Peter Michalik -- Pentala Harikrishna (R8.17) (D10) 2014.06.19 1-0 0-1 Maxim Matlakov -- Alexander Morozevich (R8.26) (A10) 2014.06.19 = 1-0 Levon Aronian -- Vladimir Potkin (R1.3) (A49) 2014.06.19 0-1 1-0 Igor V Glek -- Gabriel Sargissian (R1.32) (A07) 2014.06.19 1-0 0-1 Francisco Vallejo-Pons -- Husein Aziz Nezad (R2.49) (C77) 2014.06.19 = 1-0 Alexander Riazantsev -- Pavel Maletin (R3.29) (A06) 2014.06.19 1-0 = Nikita Vitiugov -- A Fier (R3.31) (E94) 2014.06.19 0-1 1-0 Jha Sriram -- Ahmed Adly (R4.44) (A58) 2014.06.19 1-0 0-1 Peter Michalik -- A Moussa Othman (R4.45) (A06) 2014.06.19 1-0 = Vasif Durarbayli -- A Moussa Othman (R6.49) (B06) 2014.06.19 0-1 1-0 Mohamad Naser Al Sayed -- Pavel Eljanov (R8.39) (E17) 2014.06.19 = 1-0 Alexander Morozevich -- Mohamad Al-Modiahki (R9.35) (B20) 2014.06.19 0-1 1-0 Igor V Glek -- Vadim Milov (R11.40) (A07) 2014.06.19 0-1 1-0 Ernesto Inarkiev -- Rauf Mamedov (R14.14) (C41) 2014.06.20 1-0 0-1 Mohamad Al-Modiahki -- Viktor Bologan (R16.26) (C25) 2014.06.20 0-1 = Maxim Matlakov -- Le Quang Liem (R19.9) (A34) 2014.06.20 1-0 0-1 Gabriel Sargissian -- Viktor Laznicka (R19.19) (D10) 2014.06.20 = 0-1 Shakhriyar Mamedyarov -- Radoslaw Wojtaszek (R20.5) (A45) 2014.06.20 0-1 1-0 Vasif Durarbayli -- Gadir Guseinov (R13.29) (B27) 2014.06.20 = 0-1 Peter Heine Nielsen -- Pavel Maletin (R13.38) (E60) 2014.06.20 0-1 1-0 Peter Michalik -- Peter Heine Nielsen (R14.34) (A58) 2014.06.20 0-1 1-0 Talal Hilwani -- Vladislav Tkachiev (R14.47) (A15) 2014.06.20 = 1-0 Mohamed Tissir -- Moussa Taleb (R14.51) (B25) 2014.06.20 0-1 = Abdulla Faisal -- Luka Lenic (R17.42) (B10) 2014.06.20 1-0 0-1 Alexander Goloshchapov -- Basheer Al Qudaimi (R17.46) (A81) 2014.06.20 0-1 = Mikhael Mchedlishvili -- Vasif Durarbayli (R18.34) (A30) 2014.06.20 = 1-0 Alexander Moiseenko -- Baadur Jobava (R18.36) (B07) 2014.06.20 0-1 = Husein Aziz Nezad -- Igor V Glek (R18.49) (B28) 2014.06.20 1-0 0-1 A R Saleh Salem -- Elshan Moradiabadi (R19.34) (E00) 2014.06.20 1-0 0-1 Omar Noaman Al Ali -- Jahongir Vakhidov (R19.49) (E83) 2014.06.20 1-0 = Mohamad Naser Al Sayed -- Omar Noaman Al Ali (R20.48) (D02) 2014.06.20 1-0 = Peter Heine Nielsen -- Mohamad Naser Al Sayed (R21.40) (B07) 2014.06.20 1-0 = Jahongir Vakhidov -- Isuru Alahakoon (R21.51) (D12) 2014.06.20

FIDE result on left.

I suppose I could do a comparative study with TWIC, but looking at the games, it's pretty certain the vast majority should most likely agree with the current FIDE result (OK, I admit, I'm ignoring flagging).

Now, it would be really handy if <CG> would embed the <gid> in the PGN tags. Then I could have trivially provided links instead of the spew of text.

And does anybody feel like submitting correction slips for all these games?

I don't think they should have too (which is part of the reason I'm even chasing this dog).

Jul-23-14  Penguincw: To those who it may concern:

On Jean-Pierre Le Roux, there's a typo in the bio.

< FM (2003); IM (2004); GM (2010.>

Jul-25-14
Premium Chessgames Member
  chessgames.com: <zanzibar> Two things, first about a post you made a few days ago at Eduardo Patricio Iturrizaga Bonelli:

<The question I have is why <CG>'s PGN for that tournament use the name <E Iturrizaga>? I think the longer name should be used.>

Here's the situation: normally we do use the longer version of the name in our PGN, but there is a maximum character length. If the string is over that length, we use the short name instead. Many of these spanish names cross over that character length.

(This entire rule is due to some mostly theoretical concerns about problems with line lengths beyond 79, perhaps an entirely paranoid stance to begin with. Plus, it just looks ugly.)

That maximum length parameter was probably set too low (at 32 characters). We just upped it to 48 and are reprocessing the PGN right now. That will include changes to Iturrizaga Bonelli and many other players. We can always change the limit again if we need to.

Second thing, about the Dubai Blitz <And does anybody feel like submitting correction slips for all these games? I don't think they should have to (which is part of the reason I'm even chasing this dog).>

I agree, nobody should have to. We need to have some sort of technology to patch up problems like this, even if they only come around seldomly.

Fortunately the problem seems to be with the results of the games, not the player identifications. (Mistaken player IDs would create a scenario where it wouldn't be clear which games maps to which, making the clean-up very tricky, if you see what I mean.)

So I think it's best if nobody martyrs themselves on this project any more than zanzibar already has. We'll try to build a tool specifically to fix this tournament and then in the future we will surely find use again for it. Then when we're done we can check against zanzibar's research and make sure that the right games got changed.

Jul-25-14
Premium Chessgames Member
  zanzibar: <Chessgames> Yes, I thought some length limit was involved.

Increasing the limit will be helpful.

But I think looking at Capablanca shows a useful breakdown. There, <CG> seems to use three names:

1) <Capablanca> - a short name.

2) <Jose Raul Capablanca> - a long name.

3) <José Raúl Capablanca y Graupera> - let's call this the formal name.

The short name is non-unique, but adequate for most listings where the context of the player's name is know (e.g. all the player's games in a tournament, etc).

The long name should be able to uniquely identify the player. That means that it might have to extend a player's name if his/her name is shared by another player. The long name goes into the PGN.

(Example from FIDE - <Fedoseev, Vladimir3>. I don't necessarily like it, but it works)

The formal name is the full legal name, and has all the bells and whistles. For <CG>'s purposes it may over-specify the player, as for Capablanca.

* * * * *

<So I think it's best if nobody martyrs themselves on this project any more than zanzibar already has.>

You may be too late on this. I'm just finishing a PGN tournament comparison program that almost automatically finds all the discrepancies between two programs.

That means it maps the names of the players (as automatically as possible, with some manual steering), and then compares colors, results and moves. Since it's a python program, listing this out is quite easy.

It also identifies any games not shared between the two PGN files, useful for finding "missed" games.

When finished, it will also write out the "twin" games with different moves, eliminating all the other matching (or almost matching) games. Then, that PGN can be loaded into SCID to quickly only those games which need comparing.

(A separate PGN can be output of only those "twin" games with different results for further processing as well).

This eliminates the tedious process of deleting identical games by hand, one at a time, with SCID's twin deletion feature. Now I can cut straight to the chase, and just look at the interesting cases directly.

I intend to make this program available to everyone as a download. I'll post an example of its usage on my blog soon.

* * * * *

One feature that <CG> could add, that would be very handy for me, would be the addition of <CG> tags to the PGN download. That means adding the player pid's and game gid as extended PGN tags. Like the recent modification to the upload, but on the download.

The idea is to have this information available for any corrections that need to be uploaded.

Of course, not everyone would what these extra tags in the PGN, so perhaps a preference option on the <CG> profile could be added to flag it.

Would this be doable, and desirable by others?

Jul-25-14
Premium Chessgames Member
  chessgames.com: Just wrote some software to reprocess the FIDE World Blitz Championship (2014) using TWIC as a source. I chose TWIC over FIDE because TWIC tends to fix all of FIDE's mistakes over time.

The idea is that the upload software can enter a kind of interactive mode where if it sees a duplicate that has a different result than the one we have, it asks the admin what to do.

The software was only a small disaster: it munged a bunch of games, forcing me to slog through the games manually. In a way that's a good thing because I got a feel for the kind of things that are misreported.

Along the way I noticed a few oddities:

• We had P Michalik vs A Moussa Othman, 2014 as being 0-1 as it would certainly appear, but FIDE says it is 1-0 and it's blitz so we'll go with that.

Carlsen vs G Guseinov, 2014 (1-0) is move-for-move identical with Aronian vs Potkin, 2014 (1/2-1/2). I don't know what going on there.

M Al-Modiahki vs Bologan, 2014 is 1-0 according to TWIC but <zanzibar> posted there saying FIDE calls it 0-1. Tentatively I've set it to 0-1.

Aronian vs Potkin, 2014 is 1/2-1/2 although as <z> has pointed out, White should win. But then again it's blitz.

Other than that, most of the changes seemed to make perfect sense. The leaderboard changed dramatically. Just giving it an eyeball comparison with the official results (http://dubai2014wrb.com/en/result/r...) it looks pretty good.

So things didn't go 100% as planned but it's a start in the right direction.

Jul-25-14
Premium Chessgames Member
  chessgames.com: <You may be too late on this.> No, I raced to do some martyrdom tonight after all. And it was a good cause: Sargissian et al get the credit they deserve. Now I just have to fix this software so the next time we need it, it actually works.

<I'm just finishing a PGN tournament comparison program that almost automatically finds all the discrepancies between two programs.> Wow, can't wait to see it.

<One feature that <CG> could add, that would be very handy for me, would be the addition of <CG> tags to the PGN download. That means adding the player pid's and game gid as extended PGN tags. Like the recent modification to the upload, but on the download.> I saw you mention this elsewhere; it's a good idea that I've honestly never given much thought. Perhaps a preference option could cause the software to spell out all of the Chessgames IDs: games, tournaments, players, games, even the occasional annotator.

Jul-25-14
Premium Chessgames Member
  OhioChessFan: <Tabanus> if it's not too late:

<Each match was 16 games, first to 8,5 would be the winner. >

8.5 And I'd sort of like "the first".

<He told that Hilgert was ready to put up $3m to finance a match against Robert James Fischer. >

"told" needs an object. "told the crowd" "told the journalists", something. "stated" would be an alternative that works with the sentence as written.

Jul-25-14
Premium Chessgames Member
  Chessical: <Chessgames.com> In the <Advanced Search> would it be possible to have a <Tournament> filter, so that all the games from a particular tournament could be recalled at one go?
Jul-25-14
Premium Chessgames Member
  OhioChessFan: Is my editing welcome? Anyway, presuming it is, <Chessical> some suggestions:

<Relations with the Soviet Chess Federation had deteriorated to a point where they would not provide the details of their nominated players until the very last minute causing publicity and organizational problems for the Congress' management. >

Needs a comma after "minute". Must have.

<There was also a perception that the Soviet authorities were no longer inclined to send their top players, and those they did send tended to do just enough without troubling themselves playing particularly interesting chess.>

This is a hard sentence to formulate. It's a conjecture of a difficult to express thought. Trying my best, I think "to do just enough" needs a little more clarification. Something like "to do just enough to justify their invitation" would be an improvement. And I'd slightly prefer adding "with", eg "without troubling themselves with playing....." "into" or "by" are also possible options. Hard to add a preposition that really captures the point under consideration, but I think the preposition is needed.

<The late offerings of Adrian Mikhalchishin (GM, 2535) and Evgeni Ellinovich Sveshnikov (GM, 2535) were declined. >

I think "The offered entries of....." would be a bit better.

<Eugenio Torre won his last game to gain undivided second place in great style with a Queen sacrifice, whilst Lein choosing to use white for a quick and blood less draw in 13 moves against Andersson to be certain of the third prize.>

I generally prefer "while" to "whilst" but not a big deal. Lein didn't choose to play White, which the sentence as formulated suggests. Maybe "whilst Lein settled for a quick and bloodless draw in 13 moves with White against Andersson....."

<Lev Alburt who had defected from the Soviet Union in 1979, won his first four games could only win one further game.>

"but could only" would be better.

<He finally fell out of contention in Round 12 losing to Andersson who had sacrificed the exchange for lasting positional pressure.>

I'd prefer "by losing" and a comma after "Andersson".

<His compatriot, however, Luismar Jorge de Brito (2255) was the unknown player of the tournament. >

No need for "however".

< by going onto win the Challenger's Tournament>

on to.

<"Leonard William Barden suggested that players were conserving their energies for the Hoogoven Tournament..which started immediately after". 2. Andersson and Torre were, however, the only two Premier players participating in both tournaments.>

I'd prefer "Leonard William Barden suggested that players were conserving their energies for the Hoogoven Tournament..which started immediately after", even though (or "although") Andersson and Torre were the only two Premier players participating in both tournaments.

Jul-25-14
Premium Chessgames Member
  Chessical: <OhioChessFan:> Any suggestions to improve the text are always welcome.

I have ammended Hastings (1980/81) (1980)

Jul-25-14
Premium Chessgames Member
  chessgames.com: <Chessical: <Chessgames.com> In the <Advanced Search> would it be possible to have a <Tournament> filter, so that all the games from a particular tournament could be recalled at one go?> Premium members now have a new field called "Event is ..." with a pulldown containing the most recent 100 events. Unfortunately it doesn't work with tournaments older than that, at least not yet.
Jul-25-14
Premium Chessgames Member
  Tabanus: <Chessical: <OhioChessFan:> Any suggestions to improve the text are always welcome.> Yes of course!

And changes made.

Jul-25-14
Premium Chessgames Member
  zanzibar: <chessgames> I think TWIC = lastest FIDE, after checking.

The move-identical games you cited is a special case I had overlooked. I look for duplicate games with the same players, but failed to look for move identical games which might be mistakes.

Thanks for that heads up!

I'll check your new leaderboard and PGN later.

Jul-25-14
Premium Chessgames Member
  chessgames.com: Was I mistaken when I wrote <M Al-Modiahki vs Bologan, 2014 is 1-0 according to TWIC>? I didn't double check the file; I was just going by what the software reported.
Jul-25-14
Premium Chessgames Member
  zanzibar: <chessgames> I've switched computers, so I don't have TWIC handy... but,

FIDE for <M Al-Modiahki vs Bologan> has the result 1-0.

And since I earlier claimed TWIC agrees with FIDE, so should TWIC. So the software agrees - lets look for the more likely human error (mine in this case!).

CG had a different result of 0-1. (The download version I'm still working from 7/20). So my making a comment is appropriate - but maybe I messed up the result. Let me check...

Yes, I messed up. Apologies.

My comment was intended for the game:

M Matlakov vs Le Quang Liem, 2014

I see you've already corrected the result. I'll correct the forums.

Thanks for finding that.

Jul-25-14
Premium Chessgames Member
  chessgames.com: Great! Crowther is incredible at fixing the mistakes of official sources, I didn't want to think my decision to use his PGN was misgiven.

If we want to be completionists we can now adjust the standings in the leaderboard to precisely match the tiebreak standings on the FIDE site, at least for the visible portion of the top of the leaderboard. I'm assuming FIDE lists the tied players in some sort of S-B tiebreak order.

Good job all around. I think we all learned something from it.

Jump to page #   (enter # from 1 to 282)
< Earlier Kibitzing  · PAGE 282 OF 282 ·  Later Kibitzing>

100% Cotton Chess Puzzle Shirt
NOTE: You need to pick a username and password to post a reply. Getting your account takes less than a minute, totally anonymous, and 100% free--plus, it entitles you to features otherwise unavailable. Pick your username now and join the chessgames community!
If you already have an account, you should login now.
Please observe our posting guidelines:
  1. No obscene, racist, sexist, or profane language.
  2. No spamming, advertising, or duplicating posts.
  3. No personal attacks against other users.
  4. Nothing in violation of United States law.
Blow the Whistle See something that violates our rules? Blow the whistle and inform an administrator.


Messages posted by Chessgames members do not necessarily represent the views of Chessgames.com, its employees, or sponsors.


home | about | login | logout | F.A.Q. | your profile | preferences | Premium Membership | Kibitzer's Café | Biographer's Bistro | new kibitzing | chessforums | Tournament Index | Player Directory | World Chess Championships | Opening Explorer | Guess the Move | Game Collections | ChessBookie Game | Chessgames Challenge | Store | privacy notice | contact us
Copyright 2001-2014, Chessgames Services LLC
Web design & database development by 20/20 Technologies