< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 238 OF 238 ·
|Jul-20-18|| ||jessicafischerqueen: |
My dear <Noted Pacific Trench> no fear!
The newfangled clock manufacturers now offer a line of honks designed specifically to "ease in" the old folks.
Here is an audiovisual aid to help explain: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6pb...
|Jul-20-18|| ||zanzibar: The above does lead to a bit of craziness, consider that both players get into time trouble at, say, move 30, with the time control at move 40. Further assume that after move 35 Black notices both flags have fallen.|
FIDE rule 6.11 seems to suggest the game is to continue. But how are moves 36-40 supposed to be timed?
|Jul-20-18|| ||Sneaky: I touched up the player of the dayís bio based on a year old comment by alexmagnus - Lev Aronin (kibitz #37).|
Russian history isnít my strong suit, so I mention this in case more work is required.
|Jul-20-18|| ||zanzibar: I need to go to the library to get the official USCF rules, but consider the following presumably correct version:|
<Draw #5- Double Time Forfeit
If both players run out of time, it's a draw. If both players have run out of time, but there's checkmate on the board, the checkmater wins the game. Position takes precedence over the clock. >
The funny condition mentioned in the previous post is avoided, since neither player made the time-control. But the checkmate rule can lead to its own set of problems, I can imagine.
But I do get the opportunity to use checkmater!
|Jul-20-18|| ||chessgames.com: <Sneaky> Nice job, I think that's all correct now. We also added a photograph. (Actually we just duplicated the one we use for Semyon Abramovich Furman ó perhaps we can find a better one that shows Aronin's face more clearly.)|
|Jul-20-18|| ||zanzibar: <chessgames> It's a small point, but I'll make it anyways...|
Concerning the period 1918-1922, the various names of the confederation (?) are fairly obscure.
OK, Soviet Russia may be familiar due to the Russia component, but doing a search on Transcaucasia on <CG> yields one hit only:
Transcaucasia = Armenia, Azerbaijan and Georgia
I would suggest the following edit:
Current: <Lev Solomonovich Aronin was born on the 20th of July 1920 in Kuibyshev (then Samara), Soviet Russia.>
Suggestion: <Lev Solomonovich Aronin was born on the 20th of July 1920 in Kuibyshev, Russia (then Samara, Soviet Russia).>
Note: there are several Kuibyshev's in current Russia, so some disambiguation is needed (here provided by the former name I guess)
|Jul-20-18|| ||Retireborn: <z> I suppose one could do the Chessbase thing of providing the longitude and latitude of Kuibyshev. If we have the latitude to do that.|
|Jul-20-18|| ||zanzibar: <RB> I wasn't aware of that, but it does show a certain Germanic (or Wikic(?)) thoroughness.|
Might be a bit of overkill, but it does seem to cover the issue globally!
|Jul-20-18|| ||chessgames.com: <Chessbase thing of providing the longitude and latitude> Do they actually do that? How does it work? I've long said, only half-jokingly, that we could eliminate the debates of geographic nomenclature by just pinpointing games with geographic coordinates. You could still have the geographic names; we just would need a function that relies on a giant lookup table based on coordinate and date.|
<several Kuibyshev's in current Russia, so some disambiguation is needed> In my opinion, disambiguation is only necessary if you are making reference to an obscure location. I don't know much about Russian geography, but I do know Kuibyshev is an enormous city, so a reference to it is automatically disambiguated.
For example, if I said "I live 90 minutes from Miami" I am not being ambiguous. No sane person would conclude I might have meant Miami, Iowa or Miami, Oklahoma or Miami, Kansas. The fact that I said merely "Miami" is all the proof you need that I am referring to the one in Florida.
|Jul-20-18|| ||Retireborn: <z> How it works is, if you select a nation, you are offered a drop-down list of cities in that nation, and if you select from that list, the long and lat are automatically inserted. It can't do it if you type in something not on the list, of course.|
I don't use this feature myself, it would indeed be overkill for me....but I assume they've had complaints about places with identical or similar names.
|Jul-20-18|| ||Retireborn: <cg.com> As I said, it's just a pre-recorded list of coordinates for what they consider to be the major chess places. So Kuibyshev (Kuybyshev in Chessbase) is 55.467630 lat 78.332980 long.)|
|Jul-20-18|| ||Retireborn: <cg> Your Miami example reminds me of my previously stated opinion that only Greenville would possibly seem ambiguous to Americans. It isn't on the Chessbase drop down list for the US though. I suppose it has been a few years since the US ch was played there!|
|Jul-20-18|| ||Paint My Dragon: <Linares> is perhaps the commonest cause for confusion wrt chess venues. The less discerning automatically default to the Spanish city, where the super-tournaments were held, but Linares (MEX) and Linares (CHI) have also held strong tournaments over the years. |
Just to add to the confusion, I could add that Linares (CHI) is the capital of Linares province ... and that there is another city of Linares in Colombia ... but I won't.
|Jul-20-18|| ||Sneaky: <if I said "I live 90 minutes from Miami" I am not being ambiguous.> |
That's entirely ambiguous! 90 minutes by airplane? By automobile? By foot?
|Jul-20-18|| ||Tabanus: <PMD> Hmm yes, I noticed Linares MEX and Linares CHI too. At least the games are labeled Linares ESP.|
Jeez CG, remove Gildardo from Linares (1981), or I'll die.
|Jul-20-18|| ||Tabanus: I put the standings table upside down, if that helps.|
|Jul-20-18|| ||chessgames.com: <Jeez CG, remove Gildardo from Linares (1981), or I'll die.> No problem, but why on earth did you put the standings upside down (with Karpov at the bottom and Gonzales at the top)? Was that some type of protest? Please don't use administrative functions that way.|
|Jul-20-18|| ||chessgames.com: As you know, events with enormous rosters, like giant opens or Olympiads, have a format where it shows a list of names, with highest rated players at the front:|
<Magnus Carlsen, Fabiano Caruana, Wesley So, Maxime Vachier-Lagrave, Vladimir Kramnik, Veselin Topalov, Hikaru Nakamura, Shakhriyar Mamedyarov, Alexander Grischuk, Ding Liren, Anish Giri, Teimour Radjabov, Sergey Karjakin, Leinier Dominguez Perez, Ruslan Ponomariov, Ian Nepomniachtchi, Pentala Harikrishna, Pavel Eljanov, Yu Yangyi, Michael Adams, Evgeny Tomashevsky, Li Chao, Wang Yue, Alexey Shirov, Wei Yi, Richard Rapport, David Navara, Radoslaw Wojtaszek, Le Quang Liem, Evgeny Ilgizovich Bareev, ... Mihail Marin, Daniele Vocaturo <plus 689 more players>>
The above example was taken from Chess Olympiad (2016).
It used to be impossible to easily find out who those other 689 unnamed players are, but I just changed that. The phrase <689 more players> is a now link which will take you to the new "unlimited view" which looks like this:
Chess Olympiad (2016)
So now you can get the complete list of all players at a certain event, even if it goes over the hardcoded display limit.
|Jul-20-18|| ||Tabanus: It helped! :)
<CG> It was indeed a protest, but I put Gildardo Garcia at the top, not Gonzales. Who btw probably should be Gonzalez (slip also sent).
|Jul-21-18|| ||zanzibar: <RB> thanks for that, learn something new everyday (or every other day, these days).|
<Sneaky> ha - touche!
* * * * *
<<chessgames> - ... <several Kuibyshev's in current Russia, so some disambiguation is needed> In my opinion, disambiguation is only necessary if you are making reference to an obscure location.>
Well, we've essentially agreed to use state names for US locations, and so a precedence has been established (sort of). Obviously we're less familiar with foreign countries, but the Soviets use oblasts (?) in a similar fashion.
Certainly, for the era where the USSR ruled the land, adding a "country" to a city might be handy...
e.g. [Site "Riga, LAT URS"]
<For example, if I said "I live 90 minutes from Miami" I am not being ambiguous.>
Unless you live in Oxford, OH. (Context is key, of course.) And consider this...
<I don't know much about Russian geography, but I do know Kuibyshev is an enormous city, so a reference to it is automatically disambiguated.>
Kuibyshev no longer exists, well, the enormous city no longer does. It's been renamed Samara since 1991.
Leading me to this emendment:
Suggestion: <Lev Solomonovich Aronin was born on the 20th of July 1920 in Samara, Russia.>
So, while still a good general discussion, for our specific example the issue is moot.
|Jul-21-18|| ||zanzibar: RE: Chess Olympiad (2016)|
We really need to tackle the collation issue at some point. Is this dump even remotely useful without being sorted alphabetically?
|Jul-22-18|| ||Tabanus: Linares (1981) did not turn up as a notable tournament for Larry Mark Christiansen.|
|Jul-22-18|| ||chessgames.com: <It was indeed a protest> Tab, I would never curtail your right to an address of grievances. You can send emails, keep posting about it, flood the Chessgames forum if you must ó but please NEVER use admin functions to create bad data on purpose. |
The fact is that Sargon hasn't done much work lately as he's involved in other matters, and we're working on training others to fill in, and I've been handling a lot of corrections lately. I'm sorry if some things are taking longer than normal.
<Linares (1981) did not turn up as a notable tournament for Larry Mark Christiansen.> It doesn't happen instantly, the headers on those player pages are recomputed regularly. You'll find it there soon, I'm sure.
<z> <<For example, if I said "I live 90 minutes from Miami" I am not being ambiguous.> Unless you live in Oxford, OH. (Context is key, of course.)> I disagree; the context is unimportant. If I were referring to Miami, Ohio I would surely say "Miami, Ohio" and not just "Miami." For the same reason, we don't consider it ambiguous to say "Kasparov" when we mean Garry Kasparov or "Fischer" when we mean Bobby Fischer. The fact that we omit the first name is all the evidence you need to reach a conclusion.
<Kuibyshev no longer exists, well, the enormous city no longer does. It's been renamed Samara since 1991.> My error, I had it backwards. Very well, it's Samara. I still don't understand why you refuse to apply for editor status. The amount of effort you spend lobbying for editors to make changes far outweighs the effort it takes to actually make them.
|Jul-22-18|| ||Stonehenge: <CG>
Can you merge the 1976 games that have
with Haifa Olympiad (Men) (1976)?
|Jul-22-18|| ||Tabanus: <please NEVER use admin functions to create bad data on purpose.> Ok, but I thought turning a wrong table upside down for a few hours was not a big deal, compared to other things. So you really think I'm creating bad data on purpose? Do you have other examples? I know tipsy has.|
< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 238 OF 238 ·
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