| page 1 of 2; games 1-25 of 45
|1. D G Fridman vs J Gustafsson
||½-½||35||2012||Dortmund Sparkassen||D02 Queen's Pawn Game|
|2. G Meier vs M Bartel
||1-0||39||2012||Dortmund Sparkassen||E04 Catalan, Open, 5.Nf3|
|3. Leko vs Ponomariov
||½-½||38||2012||Dortmund Sparkassen||D27 Queen's Gambit Accepted, Classical|
|4. Caruana vs Naiditsch
||½-½||60||2012||Dortmund Sparkassen||C45 Scotch Game|
|5. Karjakin vs Kramnik
||½-½||32||2012||Dortmund Sparkassen||C45 Scotch Game|
|6. Ponomariov vs Caruana
||1-0||36||2012||Dortmund Sparkassen||B30 Sicilian|
|7. D G Fridman vs Leko
||½-½||27||2012||Dortmund Sparkassen||E06 Catalan, Closed, 5.Nf3|
|8. J Gustafsson vs Kramnik
||0-1||27||2012||Dortmund Sparkassen||E92 King's Indian|
|9. M Bartel vs Karjakin
||0-1||34||2012||Dortmund Sparkassen||E12 Queen's Indian|
|10. Naiditsch vs G Meier
||½-½||53||2012||Dortmund Sparkassen||A30 English, Symmetrical|
|11. Karjakin vs Naiditsch
||½-½||59||2012||Dortmund Sparkassen||C67 Ruy Lopez|
|12. Leko vs J Gustafsson
||1-0||45||2012||Dortmund Sparkassen||C78 Ruy Lopez|
|13. Kramnik vs M Bartel
||1-0||50||2012||Dortmund Sparkassen||A25 English|
|14. Caruana vs D G Fridman
||1-0||52||2012||Dortmund Sparkassen||B12 Caro-Kann Defense|
|15. G Meier vs Ponomariov
||0-1||52||2012||Dortmund Sparkassen||D12 Queen's Gambit Declined Slav|
|16. Leko vs Caruana
||½-½||42||2012||Dortmund Sparkassen||C18 French, Winawer|
|17. J Gustafsson vs M Bartel
||½-½||35||2012||Dortmund Sparkassen||D45 Queen's Gambit Declined Semi-Slav|
|18. Ponomariov vs Karjakin
||½-½||46||2012||Dortmund Sparkassen||C67 Ruy Lopez|
|19. D G Fridman vs G Meier
||½-½||32||2012||Dortmund Sparkassen||E21 Nimzo-Indian, Three Knights|
|20. Naiditsch vs Kramnik
||½-½||24||2012||Dortmund Sparkassen||C43 Petrov, Modern Attack|
|21. Caruana vs J Gustafsson
||1-0||35||2012||Dortmund Sparkassen||C78 Ruy Lopez|
|22. M Bartel vs Naiditsch
||0-1||110||2012||Dortmund Sparkassen||C65 Ruy Lopez, Berlin Defense|
|23. Karjakin vs D G Fridman
||1-0||46||2012||Dortmund Sparkassen||B12 Caro-Kann Defense|
|24. G Meier vs Leko
||½-½||24||2012||Dortmund Sparkassen||E06 Catalan, Closed, 5.Nf3|
|25. Kramnik vs Ponomariov
||½-½||37||2012||Dortmund Sparkassen||D27 Queen's Gambit Accepted, Classical|
| page 1 of 2; games 1-25 of 45
< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 12 OF 14 ·
|Jul-22-12|| ||PinnedPiece: <JB: not a single one of the bottom five has defeated one of the top five yet..>|
There was a surprise upset with Bartel beating Ponomariov in rd 6...
|Jul-22-12|| ||zluria: Welp, it looks like Caruana has won his game. Bartel sure looked out of his depth here. Anyway, that means he has at least equal first. Does anyone know what the tiebreaks are?|
|Jul-22-12|| ||zluria: <Jim Bartle> Wrong, Bartel beat Ponomariov. It was his only win.|
|Jul-22-12|| ||PhilFeeley: So Caruana has won. He'll at least tie for first. Kramnik won't win this year.|
|Jul-22-12|| ||Peligroso Patzer: <PhilFeeley: So Caruana has won. He'll at least tie for first. ***>|
On page 5 of this thread can be found this comment (posted after Caruana’s second-round loss to Ponimariov): <Peligroso Patzer: Caruana seems to be off-form in this event. He was a bit lucky to escape with half-a-point yesterday; not so lucky today.>
To the extent there was at least implicit in that comment a prediction how Caruana would fare when the final standings were reckoned, it calls to mind the famous admonition of Sam Goldwyn: “Be very cautious when making predictions, especially about the future.”
Taking that advice to heart, I hereby wish to go on-record with a fearless prediction of Magnus Carlsen to be the winner of the 2012 Tal Memorial. I will even be so bold as to predict Carlsen’s final tournament score to be 5.5/9, half-a-point ahead of Caruana and Radjabov.
Clearly, I possess the gift of clairvoyance, especially as regards the past.
|Jul-22-12|| ||zluria: So... Karjakin has a good position versus Gustafsson, simply because White's attack is crashing down while Black's hasn't even gotten going yet. If Car-Jack wins, does he beat Caruana on tiebreaks? How does this work?|
|Jul-22-12|| ||fisayo123: Seems like after Karjakin's inevitable victory, Caruana would win on number of victories as the tie-break unless Ponomariov wins his game.|
|Jul-22-12|| ||Peligroso Patzer: <fisayo123>: What is your source for the applicable tie-break criteria? (I could not find the official regulations for this event on the offical website: http://translate.google.com/transla...).|
|Jul-22-12|| ||fisayo123: Here it is:
|Jul-22-12|| ||mrbasso: These tiebreak rules in Round-robin tournaments are all complete nonsense anyway. There is nothing better than to Blitz it out.|
|Jul-22-12|| ||Isbjorn: Meier made a mistake in a worse position and is now losing. Nice for Kramnik to finish with a win.|
|Jul-22-12|| ||Peligroso Patzer: Thank you, <fisayo123>. |
From the table you linked, I infer that the first tie-break criterion is number of games with black, then number of wins, and third Sonneborn-Berger score. Both Ponomariov and Naiditsch had five (5) games each with Black, so if either of them could win today, he would apparently prevail over Caruana.
|Jul-22-12|| ||Peligroso Patzer: <mrbasso: These tiebreak rules in Round-robin tournaments are all complete nonsense anyway. <There is nothing better than to Blitz it out.>>|
Anything is better than resorting to the abomination of blitz for any purpose.
|Jul-22-12|| ||Peligroso Patzer: <Peligroso Patzer: Thank you, <fisayo123>. |
From the table you linked, I infer that the first tie-break criterion is number of games with black, then number of wins, and third Sonneborn-Berger score. *** >
I had initially overlooked the note beneath the standings table you linked, which note provides a basis stronger than inference for the stated conclusion on tie-break rules: "<Bei Gleichstand zählt 1. die Anzahl an Schwarzpartien, 2. die Anzahl an gewonnenen Partien und 3. die Sonneborn-Berger-Wertung.>"
|Jul-22-12|| ||mrbasso: The better blitz player is the better chessplayer!
|Jul-22-12|| ||PhilFeeley: It's rare these days for a high level tournament game to go all the way to mate. Thanks to Kramnik & Meier for an entertaining game!|
|Jul-22-12|| ||Calar: So in likely case that only Karjakin and Caruana finish on 6 points each, Caruana would win 1st place due to 2nd tie-break criterion?|
|Jul-22-12|| ||parmetd: I disagree Peligroso, blitz is better than Armmageddn. That is the worst tie break!|
|Jul-22-12|| ||fisayo123: Same thing Peligroso.|
|Jul-22-12|| ||mrbasso: well, another bad day for the German players. cg to Caruana and Karjakin.|
|Jul-22-12|| ||Peligroso Patzer: I concede your well-taken point, <parmetd>. |
BTW, I do not in the least dispute <mrbasso>'s characterization of round-robin tie-break rules as “complete nonsense”, but seldom can I muster the self-discipline to forgo any opportunity to vituperate blitz, which I do genuinely deplore.
|Jul-22-12|| ||jamesmaskell: Does look like it <Calar>, Caruana and Karjakin both had same number of black games but Caruana has scored one more win.|
|Jul-22-12|| ||fisayo123: Congratulations to wonder-kid Fabiano Caruana on his first Super-Tournament victory! He has had an unbelievable year having played over 100 games and tied for second in Corus and Tal memorial. He is one of the very few teenagers to have won a super-tournament of this kind. Hardwork does pay off and there are few who work harder than Fabiano!|
|Jul-22-12|| ||Naniwazu: Caruana won! Cash in ticket for 500 chessbucks!|
|Jul-22-12|| ||csmath: <super-tournament>
Nothing to subtract from Caruana but calling a tournament with Bartel, Gustafsson, Fridman, and Mejer a supertournament is a little bit preposterous.
This is just a strong tournament with few elite players.
< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 12 OF 14 ·
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