| page 1 of 1; 19 games
| page 1 of 1; 19 games
< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 2 OF 2 ·
|May-28-15|| ||tmifune1966: Hey gokusano do not pontificate when your general knowledge is obviously deficient: China has 1.3 billion people, not more than 2! I would also give knight odds on Sam Sevian becoming a better player than Wei Yi.|
|May-28-15|| ||gokusano: Hehehe...sorry, my fault about the population stat. But Wei Yi is better than Sam Sevian by a mile with or without knight odds.|
|May-28-15|| ||greed and death: For quite a while, I've had the impression that most of the players from the "Chinese School" of chess right now have a style geared towards open positions and tactics, generally more so, IMO, than most European and American players. |
Playing through some of these games has strengthened this impression in my mind, but I'm curious as to whether or not other kibitzers would agree with my assessment of Chinese players' chess styles.
|May-29-15|| ||Catfriend: Really depends on the player. The older ones, Wang Hao in particular, are actually known to be quite positional. I even heard once one of them (either Wang Hao or Wang Yue) referred to as the Chinese Kramnik. |
Of course, nowadays Kramnik is far less "Kramnik-y", dry and risk-free himself!
|May-29-15|| ||siggemannen: Probably you mean Wang Yue. Wang Hao is an extremely aggressive player|
|May-29-15|| ||SirRuthless: The Chinese contingent produces the most "computer-ish" types of positions to me. Their games are largely unintelligible to me. Base on pure calculation rather than themes. If they see a weird line and it works, they go for it. Of course this is a gross generalization but it seems that way to my eyes.|
|May-29-15|| ||Appaz: He-he, it's kind of funny to watch us Westerners struggle with Chinese names.|
This simple pattern should be easy to spot for chess players, right? Two names, usually with 2-4 characters each. Still, I mix them up all the time.
I've noticed Ding Liren for some time (finally a name I can distinguish) and this Wei..uh..Ju..? Anyway, I will probably notice him soon, despite his name.
Oh, and I thought Wang Hao was the positional one, but admit that there is a 50/50 chance for being wrong.
|May-29-15|| ||fisayo123: Very few Chinese players play positionally. In fact, the only obvious one I can think of is Wang Yue, who is ridiculously positional. Chinese players are known to play attacking chess. Some of the newer, younger players have a more universal style like Wei Yi for example.|
|May-31-15|| ||guenther42: The rampant xenophobia on this site is embarrassing. Miss Scarlett's comment that "A Chinese world champion would be a disaster for 'our' game." is the most embarrassing, but a few others are cringe worthy. Who among the elite players are not "computer-ish" in this generation? Why are their games 'unintelligible'? For me, it is a joy to play through games by top Chinese players. Predicting next moves is an exercise in underestimation of their surprising aggressiveness. Their national teams are playing equal with the best in the world. Let us celebrate great chess, no matter who is doing it.|
|May-31-15|| ||HeMateMe: Wei Yi's fine endgame in his Ruy exchange game with Ding was very sharp. No Yifan in the women's side? I guess she's taking a year off from the home championship. some of the men's players will probably have to move to Europe if they want to get in enough high level tournaments to crack the top ten.|
Wei Yi may be the one who knocks off Carslen, 8 or 10 years down the road.
|May-31-15|| ||ex0duz: Wang Yue is the positional one, he doesn't mind trading queens or pieces into a 'dull' endgame where he will just outplay you after you make one or two '2nd best' moves.. i dont' think he minds a draw either. He aims mainly to play solid positional risk free chess. Aka the old Kramnik style when he was at his peak(around the time when he vs Kasparov for the world championship).|
<From March to December 2008, Wang Yue went 85 consecutive games without a loss, one of the longest streaks on record.>
I think he beat Tal for that record. However, I don't think Wang Yue currently still holds it, but i'm not 100% sure about that. Wang Yue was also China's first 2700+ player, and he almost made it to top 10 i think with something like 2750~. I think all of China's best players have yet to break 2765, or maybe even 2760, but definitely not 2765+.
Wang Hao has an aggressive style. Ding Liren is also quite aggressive, along with Wei Yi. So you can say that Wang Yue is one of a kind when it comes to China's top players.
I'm not too familiar with the other players styles, like Yu Yangyi, but i think he's more of an attacking player also, not like Wang Yue. Same as Li Chao and Ni Hua. They all like complex attacking games, whereas Wang Yue doesn't mind trading pieces into an otherwise 'dull' endgame with you.
Wang Hao seems to have really slipped, he's like JUST 2700 now after having been 2750~ for quite a while. I don't know how Li Chao managed to get 2750, he must have gotten it all from chinese leagues or something since yeah, i don't remember him in any international tournaments..?
|May-31-15|| ||jamesmaskell: The computerish style coming out is perhaps just typical of the way chess has evolved now and younger players will have grown up with them. Carlsen has commented that way and Wesley So in particular coached himself in a sense through computer use.|
Im sure I read somewhere that they train pretty hard on endgames. Certainly the elite players have very good endgame technique.
|May-31-15|| ||ex0duz: Wei Yi only gained 2.9 rating points from this tournament? haha, he's already one of the 'favourites' rating wise even though he's just 15 years old.. i think he's at that point in his career where he needs to just play supertourneys, otherwise he won't be gaining much rating points, even if he wins the tourney like in this case. Look at Jakovenko, he had one good tourney and you can gain like 30 points.. same thing went for Ding Liren(and also Wesley So). He had one good result at tata steel and he is now almost top 10.|
Wei is also more experienced in international events than most other chinese players.. and after next years tata steel, he will also have had his baptism by fire being thrown into the world of the top 10.. i can't wait to see if he can survive or not, like his brethren Wang Yue, Wang Hao and DIng Liren have shown. Yu Yangyi has had a decent showing so far, having beaten Kramnik and winning the super strong Qatar open..
But Wei Yi has already beaten Nepomniatchi and Shirov at the world cup(which was coincidentally a short match format, so those were not 'fluke' wins either..). I think he's also beaten MVL too. So perhaps he's not as 'green' or wet behind the ears as i initially thought. But yeah. World Cup's knockout match format is different to tata steel's. Well see how he handles the difference in format and having to be the underdog in EVERY game.. haha
|May-31-15|| ||ex0duz: 3 of China's other '2700+ players' did not play..
Li Chao(2750~ currently and CHina's current number 2)
Ni Hua(i think he's around 2700 atm or slightly under it but he's a solid 2700 player who is a regular player on their international/olympic squads..)
And of course, Bu Xiangzhi, another solid 2700 player. Like Ni Hua, i think he's around 2700 now or just under. Used to be one of the youngest GM's in the world until Karjakin beat his record i think. And now i think Wei Yi is the worlds youngest GM?
Dunno where they are. But just goes to show you the level of Chinese chess at the moment. They have like 7 2700+ players, with more coming most likely. Soon they will be the new Russia.. haha. They've already done if for the womens, only a matter of time before it happens for the mens also.
|May-31-15|| ||fisayo123: <And now i think Wei Yi is the worlds youngest GM?>|
Sam Sevian is.
|May-31-15|| ||schweigzwang: <Wei Yi only gained 2.9 rating points from this tournament? ... 3 of China's other '2700+ players' did not play..>|
Yup, those go together. More than half his opponents were under 2600.
<Look at Jakovenko, he had one good tourney and you can gain like 30 points..>
Which tourney was that? Jakovenko gained about 13 in GP Khanty-Mansiysk. Perhaps Tomashevsky in GP Tblisi or Caruana in Sinquefield 2014 is what you are thinking of ...
<And now i think Wei Yi is the worlds youngest GM?>
Well, no, not any more, but he's clearly stronger than any GM who's younger ... and almost all who are older ...
|May-31-15|| ||alexmagnus: <Wang Yue was also China's first 2700+ player, and he almost made it to top 10 i think with something like 2750~. I think all of China's best players have yet to break 2765, or maybe even 2760, but definitely not 2765+.>|
Ding Liren's 2757 on the May 2015 list is actually the highest rating a Chinese player ever reached. Wang Yue and Wang Hao made it to 2750+ too.
|May-31-15|| ||docbenway: "A Chinese world champion would be a disaster for our game." Unfortunately the writer didn't elaborate why. Chess in China is a political tool and controlled by the state and and outside of a federation of 300,000 is played by relatively few million. Note all the players in the Chinese championship are under the magic age of 30. This isn't Logan's Run, the government retires players into coaches-they decide who plays, not the individual.
Beyond that Long Newspaper Spoon is a cold hearted, totalitarian regime that uses the shiny faces of people like Wei Yi for political hay. And this is why a Chinese world champion would be a disaster for world chess.|
|May-31-15|| ||alexmagnus: Would a Chinese world champion be forced to retire at 30 too?|
|May-31-15|| ||Conrad93: <Would a Chinese world champion be forced to retire at 30 too?>|
I highly doubt China would retire any player in the top 50.
That would just be foolish.
|May-31-15|| ||I Like Fish: brian teaser...|
|May-31-15|| ||visayanbraindoctor: <(Wang yue) he beat Tal for that record. However, I don't think Wang Yue currently still holds it, but i'm not 100% sure about that.>|
There are surely local masters and experts all throughout chess history and in all parts of the chess world who have beaten even Wang yue's unbeaten streak record. We just don't know much about them because they occurred in obscure places and eras. There's nothing to be proud of if one plays a hundred games without losing, yet makes 300 losing errors in these games, and not losing only because one's opponents also make errors that throw away their wins. What is really impressive is going through a record consecutive games in international chess events without incurring any lost position at all.
Regarding the notion that China will be producing more top class chess players because they have a larger population, it's somewhat misleading if taken out of the context that most of this large population do not know how to play Western chess. Western chess seems to be relatively well known (and even then apparently not as much as other eastern board games) only in a few north eastern provinces in China. The population base of (western) chess playing Chinese isn't that large.
I believe that (western) chess playing base of present-day China is far less than that of the old Soviet Union.
What the Chinese have seems to be a similar program to that of the Soviets- to catch any talented youngster and then give him or her state support. This program has already resulted in the Chinese dominating women's chess since the 1990s.
|Jun-04-15|| ||docbenway: More wonderful news about the wonderful Chinese government-http://www.sfgate.com/news/world/ar...|
|Jun-05-15|| ||Whitemouse: idiot, ordinary Chinese are happier than people in Iraq, Libya or Afghanistan. Some Chinese are even lot happier than natives Indians or Blacks in the US.|
|Jun-08-15|| ||wych: <ex0duz: Wang Yue was also China's first 2700+ player, and he almost made it to top 10 i think with something like 2750~.>|
Wang Yue actually did make it to the top 10 for a few months about 5 years ago. His highest official ranking was 8th (& his highest Elo rating was 2756).
<I don't know how Li Chao managed to get 2750, he must have gotten it all from chinese leagues or something since yeah, i don't remember him in any international tournaments..?>
The opposite is true. In fact he's managed to get to his current rating
entirely through playing in international events, in recent months most notably Cappelle-la-Grande, the Bundesliga & the Neckar Open.
The internal Chinese events such as the Chinese league are an Elo graveyard for the highest rated Chinese players. I don't think Li Chao has played at all in China since 2013. He has managed to avoid both the league & the national championships, which I daresay has benefited his rating.
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