|World Cup (2017)|
Official site: http://tbilisi2017.fide.com. See also Wikipedia article: Chess World Cup 2017.
The 2017 FIDE World Cup, held 3-27 September in Tbilisi, Georgia, featured 128 players in a series of knockout matches. The early rounds had two games each, plus tiebreak games when necessary. The final was a match of four games, and two Rapid tiebreak games. (1) The finalists would advance to the Candidates tournament next year. The prize fund was $1,600,000, with the winner taking home $120,000 from the final. (2) Players received 90 minutes for the first 40 moves followed by 30 minutes for the rest of the game with an
addition of 30 seconds per move from move one. The tiebreaks consisted of two 25 min + 10-sec increment Rapid games, then if needed two 10 + 10 games, two 5 + 3 Blitz games, and finally an Armageddon game, where White had 5 minutes to Black's 4, but a draw counted as a win for Black. (1, 2) Chief arbiter: Tomasz Delega. (3)
On way to the final, Levon Aronian knocked out Daniel J Cawdery, Yifan Hou, Maxim Matlakov, Daniil Dubov, Vassily Ivanchuk in the quarterfinal, and Maxime Vachier-Lagrave in the semifinal. Ding Liren knocked out Mohamed Amine Haddouche, Martyn Kravtsiv, Vidit Santosh Gujrathi, Wang Hao, Richard Rapport in the quarterfinal, and Wesley So in the semifinal. The final match started 23 September. After 2-2 in the Classical games, Aronian won both Rapid games:
Aronian and Ding Liren qualified for the World Championship Candidates (2018) tournament.
1 2 3 4 1 2
Levon Aronian (ARM) 2799 ½ ½ ½ ½ 1 1 4
Ding Liren (CHN) 2777 ½ ½ ½ ½ 0 0 2
World Champion Magnus Carlsen also participated, and it was asked if this was to try to eliminate future challengers. Carlsen was knocked out anyway in Round 3 by Bu Xiangzhi. Else, there was a dress code controversy before Round 3 involving Anton Kovalyov (who knocked out Viswanathan Anand in Round 2) and Zurab Azmaiparashvili, the Chairman of the Appeals Committee. A take on the event by User: Sally Simpson can be found at https://www.redhotpawn.com/chess-bl...
(1) Chess24, https://chess24.com/en/watch/live-t...
(2) FIDE, http://www.fide.com/FIDE/handbook/W...
(3) FIDE, http://tbilisi2017.fide.com/princip...
| page 1 of 18; games 1-25 of 430
|1. Areshchenko vs A Demchenko
||1-0||76||2017||World Cup||B51 Sicilian, Canal-Sokolsky (Rossolimo) Attack|
|2. Ding Liren vs M Haddouche
||1-0||46||2017||World Cup||E60 King's Indian Defense|
|3. Li Tian Yeoh vs Anand
||0-1||66||2017||World Cup||B22 Sicilian, Alapin|
|4. Grischuk vs E El Gindy
||1-0||47||2017||World Cup||C24 Bishop's Opening|
|5. Changren Dai vs Kramnik
||0-1||51||2017||World Cup||C95 Ruy Lopez, Closed, Breyer|
|6. A Bachmann vs Dreev
||0-1||41||2017||World Cup||B13 Caro-Kann, Exchange|
|7. K Piorun vs Yifan Hou
|| ||½-½||40||2017||World Cup||E06 Catalan, Closed, 5.Nf3|
|8. L Bruzon Batista vs D Anton Guijarro
||1-0||45||2017||World Cup||C67 Ruy Lopez|
|9. D Dubov vs D G Fridman
|| ||½-½||36||2017||World Cup||E04 Catalan, Open, 5.Nf3|
|10. R Rapport vs E Cordova
||1-0||33||2017||World Cup||E01 Catalan, Closed|
|11. S Sevian vs Nisipeanu
|| ||½-½||21||2017||World Cup||C42 Petrov Defense|
|12. A Tari vs D Howell
|| ||½-½||29||2017||World Cup||C45 Scotch Game|
|13. E Inarkiev vs M Mchedlishvili
||1-0||29||2017||World Cup||B09 Pirc, Austrian Attack|
|14. D Sengupta vs Wang Hao
|| ||½-½||34||2017||World Cup||C50 Giuoco Piano|
|15. Bu Xiangzhi vs D Flores
||1-0||23||2017||World Cup||A04 Reti Opening|
|16. A Giri vs N Dzagnidze
||1-0||67||2017||World Cup||A27 English, Three Knights System|
|17. Adams vs T Batchuluun
|| ||½-½||57||2017||World Cup||C50 Giuoco Piano|
|18. Eljanov vs Lenderman
||0-1||57||2017||World Cup||E32 Nimzo-Indian, Classical|
|19. J Cori vs G Jones
||1-0||97||2017||World Cup||E60 King's Indian Defense|
|20. I V Kovalenko vs M Kravtsiv
||0-1||71||2017||World Cup||C89 Ruy Lopez, Marshall|
|21. F Vallejo Pons vs M Karthikeyan
||1-0||64||2017||World Cup||E10 Queen's Pawn Game|
|22. Li Chao vs L Krysa
|| ||½-½||113||2017||World Cup||D25 Queen's Gambit Accepted|
|23. A Pourramezanali vs Yu Yangyi
|| ||½-½||71||2017||World Cup||A45 Queen's Pawn Game|
|24. L Lenic vs Fressinet
|| ||½-½||44||2017||World Cup||D52 Queen's Gambit Declined|
|25. Kuzubov vs S Zhigalko
|| ||½-½||54||2017||World Cup||D32 Queen's Gambit Declined, Tarrasch|
| page 1 of 18; games 1-25 of 430
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< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 22 OF 132 ·
|Sep-05-17|| ||alexmagnus: <Regarding the above comment regarding "what happened to Shirov", one must remember that he's now...45.>|
The second round here features quite many players older than Shirov is. Sorted by age these are Gelfand, Dreev, Ivanchuk, Anand and Adams. And with exception of Dreev they are all higher seeds in their 2nd round matches!
|Sep-05-17|| ||Nf8: <AylerKupp> I was talking about <Carlsen "qualifying" to the Candidates by rating (due to his participation in the World Cup), <and having to be replaced if he doesn't participate>> - that's the possibility which is actually realistic and likely to have some consequences, while the possibility that Carlsen would want to participate in the Candidates is extremely unlikely and good mostly for a few jokes (which have already became rather tiresome - what happens if he wins and plays a match against himself etc. etc.).|
My point is that since he isn't considered as a potential qualifier, his non-participation would not require a replacement, which according to the regulations is supposed to be the 3rd in the final Grand Prix standings (as <devere> mentioned, according to section 2.6 of the regulations). This is also proven, btw, by FIDE's official announcement that if Carlsen reaches the World Cup finals there will be a match for 3rd place to determine a second qualifier for the Candidates - again, it indicates that Carlsen simply isn't considered a potential qualifier (otherwise his replacement should have come, again, from the GP standings).
Btw, I don't see any reason whatsoever to seriously think Carlsen would actually <want> to play in the Candidates - he's quite clearly playing in the World Cup not in order to "qualify" for anything, but mostly because he likes its special format and wants to show his superiority there. But even if he does, at worst it can be prevented by invoking section 1.5, "At any time in the course of the application of these Regulations, any circumstances that are not covered or any unforeseen event shall be referred to the President of FIDE for final decision" - his wanting to participate falling under "circumstances that are not covered."
Having said all that, the regulations are obviously lacking in their current form and should be phrased more explicitly with regard to what the World Champion can and cannot do within the cycle.
|Sep-05-17|| ||Arconax: <Marmot PFL: Someone ran 20,000 simulations (should be more like 200,000 I think) and came up with these winners -
Carlsen 13.4% (too low IMHO, I would say about 20-25%) So, Nakamura 6.8%, Caruana 6.5%, Aronian 6.4%, Kramnik 6.3%, Vachier-Lagrave 5.2%, Karjakin 4.1%, Anand 4.0% etc. total is here>|
Interesting how some players are consistently overrated, while others are (almost) always underrated. For instance, even if Wesley So at the moment has a higher ELO than Sergey Karjakin, I would prefer Karjakin's chances over So's in this tournament. Young Wesley showed terrible form in the recent Sinquefield Cup, while Karjakin is the Vice World Champion and winner of the last World Cup. A much better bet than the unreliable Filipino-American.
|Sep-05-17|| ||rogge: <Nf8>, precisely. Good post.|
|Sep-05-17|| ||Marmot PFL: I would favor So over Karjakin (not heavily though) partly because of a favorable path where the first really tough obstacle seems to be Naka in rd 5. |
Karjakin struggled already, and potentially has to face Radjabov and Aronian in rds 3 and 4
|Sep-05-17|| ||Arconax: <Marmot PFL: I would favor So over Karjakin (not heavily though) partly because of a favorable path..>|
In that case you may be correct. I did not consider the tournament set up, not having paid attention to it. Aronian will certainly be a handful in rd4 if Karjakin gets that far. I'm pretty sure he will defeat the Azeri Radjabov, though.
|Sep-05-17|| ||AylerKupp: <Nf8> Well, at the risk of adding to the tiresomeness (which I will, of course, attribute to "jet lag"), the fact that Carlsen is not considered a qualifier by FIDE seems to me to be FIDE's problem, not Carlsen's. Under FIDE's current qualification rules he DOES indeed qualify to play in the 2018 Candidates Tournament as a result of (most likely) having the highest average rating in the Jan-2017 through Dec-2017 plus participating in the 2017 World Cup. Then again, this wouldn't be the first time that FIDE has ignored its own rules when it suits the powers that be, and I suspect that it wouldn't be the last.|
And I missed FIDE's official announcement that if Carlsen reaches the World Cup finals there will be a match for 3rd place to determine a second qualifier for the Candidates. When and on what basis did that happen? Do you have any links to that announcement? At any rate, Carlsen would not need to reach the World Cup finals to qualify to the 2018 Candidates tournament by rating, so this announcement is not really relevant.
As far as Carlsen not having a reason to play in the Candidates, I can think of four: (1) he likes playing chess at the top level, (2) he's indicated that he hasn't been playing well lately and wants to fine-tune his game, and what better way to do that than to play in a tournament against the world's top players? (3) if he plays and wins the tournament he will have a psychological advantage against whoever his challenger is since he will have demonstrated that he's better, (4) the prize money isn't bad, $ 95,000 euros for first place. And, if he plays and doesn't do well, he can always say that he was "hiding his prep" :-)
As far as invoking section 1.5, what reason would the president of FIDE have for wanting to prevent Carlsen from playing in the Candidates Tournament? I know, FIDE can be arbitrary but he should state a reason, hopefully a plausible one. I think I've already addressed any rejection using the "unforeseen event" clause.
And, of course, you're right, the rules should be more explicit. Simply stating in the Rules and Regulations for the FIDE World Championship cycle that the World Champion is not eligible to participate in the Candidates Tournament should be enough.
|Sep-05-17|| ||tuttifrutty: Aronian, LQL.\, Wesley...on to the next round. I'm happy.|
|Sep-05-17|| ||markz: <Marmot PFL: Someone ran 20,000 simulations (should be more like 200,000 I think) and came up with these winners -|
Carlsen 13.4% (too low IMHO, I would say about 20-25%) So, Nakamura 6.8%, Caruana 6.5%, Aronian 6.4%, Kramnik 6.3%, Vachier-Lagrave 5.2%, Karjakin 4.1%, Anand 4.0% etc.>
It seems that the simulation use August rating not September rating, and use URS rating for rapid and blitz, which are in question. Taking these into account, I think the odds should be something like:
Carlsen 16%, Nakamura 8.5%, Aronian, MVL, Kramnik 6.5%, So, Caruana 6%, Karjakin 5%, Aanad 4%
|Sep-05-17|| ||tuttifrutty: <As far as Carlsen not having a reason to play in the Candidates, I can think of four: (1) he likes playing chess at the top level, (2) he's indicated that he hasn't been playing well lately and wants to fine-tune his game, and what better way to do that than to play in a tournament against the world's top players? (3) if he plays and wins the tournament he will have a psychological advantage against whoever his challenger is since he will have demonstrated that he's better, (4) the prize money isn't bad, $ 95,000 euros for first place. And, if he plays and doesn't do well, he can always say that he was "hiding his prep" :-)>|
I agree with 1..2...3.. but no. 4 reason is a stinking horse manure. Especially when he personally said...
" It's nice to be financially secure but aside from that, I don't really care much about money."
I am very sure rogge...domdaniel(crybaby) and the rest of <the bad people> will now have another selective amnesia....as usual.
|Sep-05-17|| ||starry2013: Very glad Amin was eliminated, after having lost the first rapid he rather desperately claimed a win in the second based on his opponent promoting using two hands.|
|Sep-05-17|| ||ketchuplover: Sounds legit to me|
|Sep-05-17|| ||Bobby Fiske: <Sally Simpson:>and each will pick up a cheque for $10,000.
First round losers got $6,000> Do they really receive $6000 just for showing up for R1? I thought it was reserved for the winners of R1?|
|Sep-05-17|| ||Arconax: <starry2013: Very glad Amin was eliminated, after having lost the first rapid he rather desperately claimed a win in the second based on his opponent promoting using two hands.>|
As they say in Denmark: -sludder og vrøvl! This isn't skittles my friend, this is the World Cup, where a lot is at stake, money & prestige. Of course if your opponent breaks the rules, you should call him on it as Amin did.
|Sep-05-17|| ||PhilFeeley: It's good to see Kovalyov advancing, but now he faces Anand. Maybe he can catch him on a bad day ;-)|
I'm looking forward to the American vs. the Cuban next round.
|Sep-05-17|| ||optimal play: <SirBrainless> Anton Smirnov and Sergey Karjakin aren't compatriots.|
|Sep-05-17|| ||Sally Simpson: Hi Bobby Fiske.
Round 1 losers: 64 x USD 6,000.
|Sep-05-17|| ||Sally Simpson: Amin and the double hand promotion.
The terms for this event are here.
At the bottom it does state they are using FIDE rules as of the 1st July 2017.
so we go here:
Rapid play rules:
A.4.2: "If the arbiter observes an illegal move has been completed, he shall declare the game lost by the player."
The Blitz rules are condensed basically using rapid rules with a few minor changes. But it does say:
B.4: Otherwise, play shall be governed by the Rapid chess Laws as in Article A.2 and A.4. (an illegal move loses.)
And here is the rule regarding using two hands.
If a player uses two hands to make a single move (in case of castling, capturing or promotion), it shall be considered as an illegal move.
Therefore Amin possibly had a point and it may be appealed.
|Sep-05-17|| ||Arconax: <Sally Simpson: Therefore Amin possibly had a point and it may be appealed.>|
If only his grandfather Idi was still alive..
|Sep-05-17|| ||AylerKupp: <<tuttifrutty> I agree with 1..2...3.. but no. 4 reason is a stinking horse manure.>|
OK, I agree with that. I guess that we'll then have to consider reason 4 to be "gravy" in case he decides to play because of one of the other 3 reasons.
|Sep-05-17|| ||SirRuthless: <optimal play> Oops I read that as Anton Korobov who is Ukranian, just like Sergey |
|Sep-05-17|| ||Sally Simpson: HI Arconax.
Usually after a game is over it's over but Amin raised his objection at the right time. The arbiter, an employee of FIDE may have got it wrong, and if...
(notice I am using 'if' 'perhaps' and 'maybe' I'm not 100% sure)
...and if Amin appeals then I don't think they will order a blitz rematch (they might) but instead bung some him cash, an extra $4,000 which brings his purse up $10,00 the 2nd round exit fee and add back on any rating points lost.
|Sep-05-17|| ||Sally Simpson: Hi Sir Ruthless,
Don't bend the knee so easily.
compatriots. = fellow countryman. Both were born in the Ukraine so they are compatriots. The play for different chess federations.
Now get back in the ring and tell him.
|Sep-05-17|| ||optimal play: <Silly Simpson> I'm under the impression Anton Smirnov was born in Australia where he has lived all his life (although his father was born in Russia), but if it can be shown that he was actually born in Ukraine (or even Russia) then I will acknowledge that he and Karjakin could be called compatriots and apologise to <SirRuthless>.|
|Sep-05-17|| ||markz: <Sally Simpson: Therefore Amin possibly had a point and it may be appealed.>|
World cup use the classical rules. chess.com explained it as following: <However, at World Cups the same rules are in effect for all time controls, to avoid confusion for the players. Therefore, also in tiebreaks, at the first occurrence an illegal move will lead to a warning and the opponent receives two minutes extra on the clock.>
< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 22 OF 132 ·
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