| Feb-10-12 | | optimal play: After 26. xc1 it's just a king & pawn ending, and with an extra pawn all White had to do was manoeuvre around for another 30 moves without blundering. |
 |
| Feb-11-12 | | drukenknight: normally I would be skeptical of losing a game w/ 30 moves to go, however the connected passed pawns make this extremely hard to save so I dont disagree w/ you. Instead of move 26, how about move 30? I think 30...g4 may offer some hope of preventing the connected passers.. |
|
| Feb-11-12 | | optimal play: If 30...g4 then a possible continuation might be 31.Kd3 Kf6 32.e4 Kg5 33.Kc4 h4 34.gxh4+ Kxh4 35.d5 and White wins a lot quicker, unless there is a better continuation for Black? btw just to clarify my earlier post, I wasn't suggesting Black should resign after 26.Kxc1 (I know I certainly wouldn't). I guess I was just opining that from a purely theoretical viewpoint, if after 26.Kxc1 the game continued with "optimal play" then inevitably White must win. |
|
| Feb-11-12 | | drukenknight: right, I certainly see your pt. which I think is unusual because most games are not lost at that pt. but the positional problem here is crushing. I'll have to get back on your line... |
|
| Feb-11-12 | | drukenknight: I think you are right about the 30...g4 line, I think I moved too quick what if 30...Kg6 in order to threaten an outside passed pawn with by ..h4? |
|
| Feb-11-12 | | optimal play: So your thinking is that if after 30...Kg6 Black then aims for h4 so White has to play gxh4 then after Black plays gxh4 he has a passed pawn on the h-file? Sure, but White could circumvent that any number of ways, like say f4 or e4 or even Kf3 In fact he would really have to blunder to muck this up. To give credit where it's due I think Alapin put up a reasonable fight in the endgame, Kostic just kept his head, and carefully worked through a won position without any obvious mistakes. |
|
| Feb-11-12 | | drukenknight: so 31 f4 for you? |
|
| Feb-12-12 | | optimal play: yeh I'd go with f4 so a possible line might be 30...Kg6 31.f4 gxf4 32.exf4 Kf5 33.Kf3 and what's Black got after that? |
|
| Feb-13-12 | | drukenknight: I am not sure it makes sense for me to take w/: 31...gxf4; so lets think about it...theres still a passed pawn situation here, but it's not likely to be connected, and my K seems placed to stop it |
|
| Feb-13-12 | | optimal play: So after 30...Kg6 31.f4
click for larger viewif Black then decides against 31...gxf4 then perhaps 31...g4 threatening h4 keeping White's King somewhat hobbled, but after 32.e4 I still don't see how Black can save this game? |
|
| Feb-14-12 | | drukenknight: I dont think ...g4 will work, but I guess I go with 31...h4; it's difficult for sure. |
|
| Feb-15-12 | | optimal play: Forget about 31...h4? that definitely won't work. White would just respond with 32.gxh4 then 32...gxh4 33.Kf3 Kh5 34.e4 and I don't like Black's chances after that. |
|
| Feb-15-12 | | drukenknight: yes you are quite right, I think. None of it will work as you can see from that line that either white gets a connected passed pawn; in your line; or if white takes 32 fxg h3 33 Kf2 white will get back in front of his passed pawn with Opposition which also wins.
So this is a very interesting problem for us; I see issues of Distant Opposition; the defensive box; and basic K/p rule that you need to be in front of pawn AND have opposition in order to win. All these and more! So let's back up the game to a few moves earlier: 27...f6 What was the pt. of that. Black is down a pawn and here gives up space; it doesnt seem fair that he has to be losing on two fronts (i.e. both material and positional aspects of the game). Also that ..f6 seems to block the black K from moving and he is denied the f6 spot from his K which has something to do with distant opposition. so I try 27...f5 28 Kd2 Kf6 (staying near the pawn break) 29 f3 to get to this position: 
click for larger viewSo now it looks like white will get the passed pawn on d5 but it wont be connected and the black K will be in position to stop it. You can also see issues of "defensive box" like ...h4 would have to be met by gxh as the white king is outside the box, and same issues for the black king. Subject to your evaluation... |
|
| Feb-16-12 | | optimal play: Interesting...but even in this position, Black is still left with the same obstacles he must overcome to try and salvage this game. White's pawn-block on the K-side is ample defence against any attempt by Black to get a passed pawn down the g or h files. Therefore White should direct his K through c4 and up behind Black's Q-side pawns. This would have a devastating effect since the Black K still has to guard against a runaway passed pawn on the d-file and could not possibly get across to support his pawns on the a&b files. So anyway, after 29.f3 it's Black to move. 29...h4? 29...g5? 29...e5? I can't see a way for Black survive... |
|
| Feb-16-12 | | drukenknight: all right if you're ok with the above line (it seems right to me) then I think 29....g5 is next move as that is the only strong move, then what 30 fxg Kxg? what do you think? I think he may survive if the K can position himself right. blacks advanced b pawn may mess me up. |
|
| Feb-17-12 | | optimal play: I think Black's position deteriorates rapidly from this point. After 29...g5 30.fxg5+ Kxg5 then 31.Kd3 h4 (what else is there?) 32.gxh4+ Kxh4 33.Kc4 (as I indicated in my previous post Kc4 is the killer!) Then what? If say 33...Kg3 then 34.e4 Kxf3 35.d5 wins! Or have I miscalculated? Is there still a way for Black to survive? |
|
| Feb-24-12 | | drukenknight: I think you're right about that line above, 35 kd5 wins. So if we go back to that diagram of Feb 15 do I have to start with pawns? what if it starts: 29...Kd7? |
|
| Feb-24-12 | | optimal play: 29...Kd7?? The King is on f6?? Do you mean Ke7? or have I misunderstood you? |
|
| Feb-25-12 | | drukenknight: yeah Ke7, I mess up the notation quite a lot, sorry... |
|
| Feb-26-12 | | optimal play: 29...Ke7 is no problem for White because Black still can't stop the White King getting to c4. For instance 30.Kd3 Kd6 31.Kc4 Kc6 32.b3 and Black is stuck. |
|
| Feb-28-12 | | drukenknight: I think if 31 Kc4 isnt it 31..fxg5? I mean obviously this game has me pretty confused so just a guess.. |
|
| Feb-28-12 | | optimal play: <31..fxg5?> ok now we're both confused!? We're starting from your diagram of Feb 15 right!?
So if the revised line is 29...Ke7 30.Kd3 Kd6 31.Kc4
Then the position would be as follows:-
click for larger viewBlack to move 31...? |
|
| Feb-28-12 | | drukenknight: ur right I guess I set up the board wrong.. |
|
