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Rene Letelier Martner vs Robert James Fischer
"A Queen for the King" (game of the day Jul-29-05)
Leipzig Olympiad Prelim (1960)  ·  King's Indian Defense: Normal Variation (E70)  ·  0-1
To move:
Last move:

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Given 366 times; par: 32 [what's this?]

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Kibitzer's Corner
< Earlier Kibitzing  · PAGE 8 OF 8 ·  Later Kibitzing>
May-15-13
Premium Chessgames Member
  SamAtoms1980: Context is so important.

In Guess-the-Move, I diddle around, drop 3 points over the last two moves (but still finish above par), and then <*BAM*>, game over.

If this is a Monday or Tuesday puzzle set at 23....?, a few dozen of us come out, and we're all like "23....Qxf4+!! ZOMG, LOL, I are teh pwnz0r".

Nobody tells you if you can "Monday" your opponent when you're playing over the board.

Jun-14-13  master of defence: Why not 11.Nxd6 Nxd6 12.Qxd6 Qxd6 13.exd6 Bxb2 14.Rd1?
Jun-20-13  SufferingBruin: Just played this on "Guess the Move". I'm low rated but damn if I wasn't just a little cocky getting most of the moves right (a couple of howlers but still, better than I'm used to).

I didn't get 23. ... Rxe3 though I considered it.

I *never* considered Qxf4, an amazing move. I'm jealous of people who saw it live, Letelier included.

Jun-20-13
Premium Chessgames Member
  perfidious: <Phony Benoni: Fischer must have been channeling his Inner Menchik....>

That is a game I had never seen, but with Fischer's tremendous knowledge and obsessive work habits, I should not be at all surprised to learn that he knew of Barasz-Menchik, or at the very least, the motif.

Jun-21-13
Premium Chessgames Member
  RookFile: It comes up if we do what Alekhine says and consider all captures and checks on every move.
Jul-04-13
Premium Chessgames Member
  offramp: Can someone give me an executive summary of all the kibitzing?
Jul-04-13
Premium Chessgames Member
  beatgiant: <offramp> <Can someone give me an executive summary of all the kibitzing?> Nice game, 5. e5 is wrong, and Fischer probably knew that from pre-game study.
Jul-04-13
Premium Chessgames Member
  offramp: Thank you, <beat giant>!
Jul-21-13  talwnbe4: Fruit on a core 2 duo 1.86 Ghz single processor finds 16.. fxe6 is better than 16.. f5 after 5:43 1.68. However, after analysing 16..f5 17. f4 Nf6 18. Bg2 Rfe8 19. O-O Ng4 20. Bd2 Rad8 21. Qe1 Nd4 Fruit 2.2.1 finds black's position overwhelming 2.50.
Jul-28-13  Everett: I just realized something after all these years of chess that many of you must already know: the knowledge needed to utilize queen sacrifices in games has very little* to do with the queen and everything to do with the harmony of everything else but the queen. So any queen sacrifice, brought to our attention due to the power of the queen, teaches us explicitly of the power of pieces and pawns working together. By focusing on the queen, however, we are wrongly focusing on what is leaving the board rather than what remains.

* the queen is the most powerful magnet/decoyer/deflector on the board, and thus usually commands a forced response, which other piece or pawn moves may not compel.

Aug-10-13  Mudphudder: Can't go over the game enough. Still one of my all time favorite Fischer games!
Sep-22-13  kasparvez: One question: has anyone ever sacrificed a queen against Fischer and won??
Sep-22-13
Premium Chessgames Member
  Travis Bickle: True genius!
Oct-20-13  hedgeh0g: <Shams: ...why do most Black players at all levels favor the 4...d6 move order?>

I don't think it has anything to do with 5.e5, but rather 5.Bg5!

The point is that if Black responds with 5...h6, the bishop can retreat to e3, since the g4 square is not available for the Black knight. After 6...d6, White can opt for either a favourable Sämisch with 7.f3 or adopt a more flexible setup with 7.Be2. In any case, an eventual Qd2 is going to come with tempo.

And if Black doesn't play ...h6, White will naturally follow up with Qd2 with a nice game. Of course, it's hardly a refutation of the opening, but it does suggest, in my view, that 4...O-O is arguably an inaccuracy.

Oct-20-13
Premium Chessgames Member
  Shams: <hedgeh0g> Very good! Thank you.
Oct-23-13
Premium Chessgames Member
  FSR: <hedgeh0g> Well said. John L Watson makes essentially the same points in <Mastering the Chess Openings, Volume 2>, pp. 188-89. After 4...0-0 5.Bg5! d6 6.Qd2! White has gotten to play Bg5 straightaway, without prefacing it with Be2 (the Averbakh) or f3 (the Sämisch). He scores a massive 64.6% in CG.com's database (albeit with a small sample size - only 130 games). Opening Explorer

Note also that after 4...d6(!), 5.Bg5 sucks like a duck in a truck who needs a good - well, you get the idea. Black plays 5...h6, and on 6.Bh4 c5 7.d5 (7.dxc5 Qa5 8.Bd3 Qxc5=), 7...g5 8.Bg3 Qa5! 9.Bd3 (9.Qd2 Nh5! wins the bishop pair) Nxe4! and Black is better. Watson cites Black's crushing victories in Stein vs Geller, 1966 and Spassky vs Fischer, 1992.

Sep-01-14  Mating Net: White probably thought that 21...Rxe3! was an exchange sacrifice. When Fischer played 23...Qxf4!! he must have been stunned.
May-12-16
Premium Chessgames Member
  RookFile: I'm sure you're right. He was probably expecting some other check, like ...Qb6+ or ....Ng4+. For a few seconds, he must have thought Fischer had completely lost it.
Jul-17-16  kishore4u: A queen for the king
Jul-17-16
Premium Chessgames Member
  offramp: <kishore4u: A queen for the king.>

Yes. Some queen sacrifices can be a bit samey, like the one Qxh7+ followed by Rh3+ and Rh8#, or the Q-sac used in a smothered mate.

This one, though, is really different, especially with the opposing king in the middle of the board.

Jul-17-16
Premium Chessgames Member
  steinitzfan: Interesting game -- because years ago I thought I understood it. Now it takes all my powers of visualization and calculation to see that Black wins if White declines the queen sac.
Jul-17-16  morfishine: Yep, its a beaut, no doubt
Jul-17-16  drollere: i don't think 5. e5 was the big mistake here. it was opening the center with inessential pawn captures and wasting moves rearranging the minor pieces before castling.

if you have to move minor pieces that many times you should just trade them off the board.

all along every one of black's pieces is perfectly placed, and this is not really a "queen sacrifice" since mate follows and the K has retreat squares to prolong the agony.

meanwhile white's Q has the important role of blocking her own R and attacking along a blocked diagonal instead of helping the attacked bishop. may as well take the Q and R off the board.

Sep-01-16
Premium Chessgames Member
  Chutzpah: The move 5.e5 gave Fischer a nice "rope a dope" game. Fischer called 5.e5 "weak".
Sep-01-16
Premium Chessgames Member
  TheFocus: I was looking at an Alekhine game where he used Fischer's idea first (1...Nf6, 2...g6, 3...Bg7, 4...O-O).

I wonder if Bobby knew that?

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