< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 3 OF 3 ·
|Aug-26-08|| ||Sololoy: Anand could have got his Q to b4+ 4 moves earlier:
64 Qc3+ Ka2
65 Qa5+ Kb2
|Aug-26-08|| ||theraindog: Got it but I might have missed it over the board. Unless of course someone nudged me and said, 'white to move and win!'|
|Aug-26-08|| ||TheaN: <Anand could have got his Q to b4+ 4 moves earlier:
64 Qc3+ Ka2
65 Qa5+ Kb2
Incorrect. That's the whole point of Qc2: Anand does not allow the Black King to go to b1 when the White Queen has no sight on c2, leading to a draw:
<64.Qc3†? Ka2 65.Qa5† Kb1! => and White makes no more progress, as any Queen check on the b-file is now met by Qb2. That thus leads to <66.Qe1† Ka2> with either repetition with Qa5† or a second rank check with once again Qb2. After Qb2, in either case, Black draws very, very easy.
|Aug-26-08|| ||sshhhh: Can anyone tell me where's the win after 68...Ka2? Thanks|
|Aug-26-08|| ||BlackWaive: Tuesday:
I thought I could knock this puzzle out in under 20 seconds, so as soon as I saw the line
70. c2+ a3 71. c4
I thought I was good. However, I missed the only two loopholes:
71...f1+ and 71...a2+.
I didn't even bother with Candidate Moves, since the Kings and Queens are the only pieces on the board. My mistake - and I would have probably done the same in a blitz game.
|Aug-26-08|| ||PuzzleMaster: Tue 2008.08.26 (White to play. 70. ?)
Candidates: 70. Qc2+, 70. Qb4+
A) 70. Qc2+ Ka3 71. Kd3 Qa2+ =
B) 70. Qb4+ Kc1 (70 ... Ka2 71. Kc2 ) 71. Qd2+ Kb1 72. Qc2#
|Aug-26-08|| ||Kings Indian: I tried the white queen C3 and C2 and saw the black king extricating himself from trouble. Moving the white queen to B4 forces the black king to the wall. I see the white king moving to C2 next. I can't see the black queen preventing check mate from there.|
|Aug-26-08|| ||YouRang: Not a *hard* puzzle -- and yet it took me a moment to be sure I had the right answer.|
I suppose that's because it's difficult to imagine the opposing queen being so helpless. However, I've been around long enough to know that there are certain positions with just Ks+Qs where the attacking side has time to make a non-checking move such that the defending queen has no useful move.
So, <70.Qb4+> was my first guess, since it seemed to give my K+Q the best chance to complement each other. This permits 70...Kc1 or 70...Ka2.
It's easy to see that 70...Kc1 leads to 71.Qd2+ Kb1 72.Qc2#, so it behooves black to stay away from my king with <70...Ka2>.
Now, <71.Kc2!> is a somewhat obvious try (giving check again accomplishes nothing), with the threat of 72.Qb3#. You just have to visualize the position well enough to see that the black queen can't deliver check (or, at least, not without being simply captured). Good puzzle.
|Aug-26-08|| ||SuperPatzer77: 65. Qc5+ Kb3, 66. Qb5+ Ka3 (if 66...Ka2, 67. Kc2! ), 67. Qa5+ Kb2 (forced), 68. Qb4+ (transposing to 70. Qb4+) 1-0.|
Thus, Black's only move is 65...Ka2, 66. Qc4+! Ka3 (66...Kb2, 67. Qb4+ ), 67. Qa6+ Kb2, 68. Qb6+! Kc1 (68...Ka2 69. Kc2! or 68...Ka3, 69. Qa5+ Kb2, 70. Qb4+ ), 69. Qc5+ Kb2 (69...Kd1 70. Qg1# or 69...Kb1 70. Qc2#), 70. Qb4+ 1-0.
|Aug-26-08|| ||SuperPatzer77: <TheaN> Bravo!!! You're absolutely right about 64. Qc2+! only move for White's win. |
I didn't see 64. Qc3+? that Vishy Anand didn't want. Anand's key move is 64. Qc2+! leading to an inevitable checkmate or winning the Black Queen. Isn't it very interesting, <TheaN>?? Wow!!!
We've gotta tip our hats off to Vishy Anand of India. He played awfully well in 1987 as a young man.
|Aug-26-08|| ||DarthStapler: I missed it, I couldn't find the mate line after Kc1|
|Aug-26-08|| ||SuperPatzer77: <sshhhh: Can anyone tell me where's the win after 68...Ka2? Thanks> |
<sshhhh> After 68. Qb6+! - You wanna know what happens if 68...Ka2, right?
The answer to 68...Ka2 is 69. Kc2! forcing an inevitable checkmate.
|Aug-26-08|| ||johnlspouge: <<al wazir> wrote: |
<whitebeach: A beautiful ending. Reminds me why we love this game.>
It reminds *me* why I'm not a GM.>
You are obviously a half-empty kind of guy, <al> :)
|Aug-26-08|| ||kevin86: A great minature problem with only FOUR pieces!
Black has two grim choices-or too grim choices:
70...c1 71 d2+ b1 72 c2# or
70...a2 71 c2 and threatens mate in three ways-black can hope for 71...c3+ 72 xc3??? stalemate, but of course 72 xc3 a1 72 b2# is the end.
|Aug-26-08|| ||johnlspouge: <<jovack> wrote: [snip] this is why i never accept draw offers>|
A chess game with you could be very boring, <jovack>.
click for larger view
Someone once gave me good advice: never use "never" carelessly :)
|Aug-26-08|| ||SuperPatzer77: <johnlspouge - Someone once gave me good advice: never use "never" carelessly :)>|
<johnlspouge> Amen to that!!!
Some chess players may accept draw offers - depending on whether it may be drawing chances. It's not easy to decide to accept the draw offers.
See the movie "Searching for Bobby Fischer". The amazing kid named Josh Watzkin did try to offer his opposing player a draw. His opponent rejected a draw offer and said to Josh "Move" in the movie. He eventually lost a game to Josh. Gee whiz!!!
|Aug-26-08|| ||Once: <JohnlSpouge> Reminds me of the James Bond movie - "Never say Never again".|
Or one of my favourite non-sequitor lines in Star Wars: "Only a Sith deals in absolutes" said by a Jedi!
|Aug-26-08|| ||Kasputin: With the black king and queen so near the corner, I wonder if there is a way to either capture the black queen or checkmate the black king.
Candidates - I will start with Qb4 and move on if necessary.|
a) 70 ...Kc1
71. Qd2+ Kb1
b) 70 ...Ka2
The black queen has no effective check against the white king (...Qg2 of course immediately loses to 72. Qxg2# and any other check and the queen gets captured) - also it does not appear that black can cover the important b3 square
71 ...any queen move that does not check the white king
72. Qb3+ and white applies mate on either b2 or b1, depending on the location of the black queen.
|Aug-26-08|| ||MiCrooks: If you have ever studied your elementary king and pawn endgames this is a no brainer. It would have been a bit more fun to start right after queening the pawns as Anand had to work to get the winning position.|
If you know this endgame, you know you are looking to set up a position where you move the king to set up mate where Black has no checks that don't drop the Queen.
So Qb4+ Ka2 Kc2 game over. He can play Kc1 instead but then the mate is obvious with Qd2+ Kb1 Qc2++.
Key is knowing that if the King is close enough you can win with Q against a rook pawn by letting the pawn Queen and setting up this position.
|Aug-26-08|| ||pastpawn: I suppose in blitz with little time on the clocks Black can try 70 ... a2 71 c2 c3+ and hope White touches the wrong piece by mistake :).|
|Aug-26-08|| ||jpolchinski: Why did B not play 34 Nxe4+, followed by Nxc3?|
|Aug-26-08|| ||456: Monday puzzle Aug-25-08 <27. ...?> P Zilles vs V Kutsankov, 2005|
|Aug-26-08|| ||johnlspouge: <<jpolchinski> wrote: Why did B not play 34 Nxe4+, followed by Nxc3?>|
I do not know, as the move looks awfully good, as confirmed by a Mom-and-Pop evaluation by Toga II 1.3.1 under my usual conditions (humans can improve near the end of the full computer variation):
<Your suggested move 34…<Nxe4>>:
[ply 15/34 time 00:04 <value (to White) -2.10>]
34…<Nxe4> 35.Kf3 Nxc3 36.Ne6 Rd3+ 37.Kf2 Ne4+ 38.Kg2 Rg3+ 39.Kh2 Ra3 40.Nxg7+ Kd7 41.Rf7+ Kc6 42.Re7 Rxa2+ 43.Kg1 Nf2 44.Ne8 Nxh3+ 45.Kf1 h6 46.Rxc7+ Kd5 47.Nf6+ Ke5
<The game move 34…<Rd3>>:
[ply 15/42 time 00:17 <value (to White) +0.28>]
34…<Rd3> 35.Kf4 Na4 36.Ne6 Rxh3 37.Nxg7+ Ke7 38.Ra5 Nxc3 39.Rxa6 Kd7 40.e5 Nd5+ 41.Ke4 Nb6 42.e6+ Kd6 43.a4 c3 44.Nf5+ Kxe6 45.a5 c2 46.Nd4+ Ke7 47.Nxc2 Nc8 48.Ne3 Nd6+ 49.Kd4
|Aug-26-08|| ||Stelling: SuperPatzer77: <TheaN> Bravo!!! You're absolutely right about 64. Qc2+! only move for White's win.|
Actually no, 64. Qb7+ or 64. Qb8+ do the trick and even win faster than 64. Qc2+.
When the black king goes to c1 white checks on the c file (getting closer to the king) and if the K ever gets to d1 white mates in two with Qc2+ followed by Qe2#
|Aug-26-08|| ||MostlyAverageJoe: <Sololoy/TheaN/SuperPatzer77>|
You might want to bookmark these links:
For what it is worth, with two exceptions, starting from move 53, both players made perfect moves (white: for the fastest possible mate and black: to delay the mate as much as possible). The exceptions are:
Thipsay: 60...Kb4 would delay mate by 3 moves compared to Kb2. However, the continuation after Kb2 is trickier for the white to play.
Anand: 64.Qb7+/Qb8+ would speed up mate by 2 moves compared to Qc2+. 64.Qc3+ would speed it up by 1.
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