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Gustav Richard Neumann vs Adolf Anderssen
Berlin (1864), Berlin GER
King's Gambit: Accepted. Philidor Gambit Schultz Variation (C38)  ·  1-0


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Kibitzer's Corner
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  InspiredByMorphy: 10.g3 is a strange move. What is whites response to 10. ...g4 ? if 11.Nh4 fxg3 12.Qxg3 Nxd4 puts black up two pawns.
Mar-03-05  sneaky pete: <InspiredByMorphy> If 10... g4 11.e5 .. followed by 12.Qh7 .. with attacking chances. It was actually Neumann (white) vs Anderssen, according to Pickards book "The Chess Games of Adolph (sic) Anderssen".

10.g3 g4 makes a later Nh4 .. possible, as in the line given by Pickard (= von Gotschall): 10... g4 11.e5 Bg7 12.Qh7 Kf8 13.Nh4 .. threat 14.Ng6+ .. but after 13... d5 black should win. Black might also play 10... g4 11.e5 d5 12.Qh7 dxc4 with a clear advantage.

Premium Chessgames Member
  sachistu: Actually, <sneakypete> it's not certain Neumann was White here. Neue Berliner Schachzeitung,1864,p232 has Anderssen playing White. This tracks with 10 other Anderssen-Neumann games I have (with the same opening). In each case, Anderssen was White. Not conclusive, but I think this gives greater weight to NBz being right. From what I've read, the Pickard books are short on documentation, so I'm a bit skeptical.
Sep-29-14  john barleycorn: Gottschall's book about Anderssen has it as game 330 with Neumann having White.

10.g3 gets an exclamation mark:

10.g3! Nh6 (even after 10...g4 11.e5 White has a strong attack e.g. 11....Bg7 12.Qh7 Kf8 13.Nh4 Nh6 14.Bxf4 etc.)(Gottschall)

Premium Chessgames Member
  sachistu: Thanks <john barleycorn> for your feedback. I do not wish to appear stubborn, but Pickard could have copied von Gottschall's citation thus propagating the error (if it was such). As mentioned before, Anderssen invariably played White in this line. I can only find one instance (Kolisch-Anderssen,1860) where Anderssen defended the Black side in this particular variation (e.g. through move 6). Also, Anderssen played the same move (7.Qd3) multiple times (with White) against Neumann.

When you have conflicting sources, it seems a good idea to see if the game would logically follow a player's tendencies/preferences. I'm familiar the notion of "using your opponent's ideas against him", but those days (when theory was in the developmental stage) I'm not sure that is a strong possibility. Consequently, I remain very skeptical that Neumann had White.

Sep-29-14  john barleycorn: In the set of games as given in v. Gottschall's book Neumann had the White in RL and KG's while Anderssen had white in the Evansgambits. And v. Gottschall remarks once in a while "Neumann is fighting with Anderssen's weapons".
Premium Chessgames Member
  sachistu: Thanks <john barleycorn>! That certainly sheds a different light on things. Unfortunately, I do/did not have a copy of von Gottschall's book. Will have to get a copy!
Premium Chessgames Member
  sachistu: One addition question/comment <john barleycorn>. Was this the set of games played in Berlin? (They played another set in Breslau). I ask because Neue Berliner Schachzeitung,1864,p276 has Anderssen playing White in another KG (C37, 24 moves, at Berlin). By the way, <cg> has that game listed with Anderssen playing White. If von Gottschall's remark is correct (consistent), then it would seem Neumann was White.
Sep-29-14  john barleycorn: Played in Berlin, July 1864. And the above game is from that time according to v. Gottschall. Then there are listed another 28 games played in Berlin, April 1865 and 25 games played in Berlin April 1866.
Premium Chessgames Member
  sachistu: When you say "the above game" <john barleycorn>, are you referring to the C38 game we were discussing earlier? In my last post (above), I was asking about a different game (C37). By the way, Neue Berliner Schachzeitung also gives July 1864 for both games. I was trying to reconcile Anderssen being White in the C37 game vis-a-vis your statement that Neumann had White in all the KG games (in that set).
Sep-29-14  john barleycorn: "The game above" means this page the C38.

There is a Muzio Gambit with 24 moves (24.Rf6 Ne4 and white resigns) from July 1864 and it says Anderssen was White. I have overlooked that one in my previous post. Sorry for that.

Premium Chessgames Member
  sachistu: Thanks <john barleycorn>. Glad to hear von Gottschall and Neue Berliner Schachzeitung agree on that one. I still have reservations about the C38 game, but the comments you listed from von Gottschall are persuasive.
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