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< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 3 OF 3 ·
Later Kibitzing > |
| Feb-21-06 |
| McCool: Finally a regular game between these two.
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| Dec-08-08 |
| Andrijadj: This is such an idiotic game,blacks play is simply awful...It would be good to see Morphy trying this opening against Petrosian or Korchnoi... |
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| Dec-08-08 |
| Andrijadj: For example 9...Nf6...What kind of idiocy is it??? |
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| Dec-08-08 |
| zb2cr: To answer your question <Andrijadj>,
"For example 9...Nf6...What kind of idiocy is it???"
A forced kind of idiocy. Black does something else than 9. ... Nf6, White plays 10. Bg5+ and forces him to play it anyway, to avoid losing his Queen. For example, 9. ... h6; 10. Bg5+, hxg5; 11. Qxh8, Nf6; 12. O-O and White has an excellent attacking setup. Or 9. ... d5; 10. Bg5+, Nf6; 11. O-O, Bg7; 12. e5 reaching a position somewhat like the actual game. |
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Dec-08-08
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| Wolfgang01: Morphys technical knowledge and appreciation was at least 150 years ahead. I admire his play. |
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Dec-08-08
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| JG27Pyth: <For example 9...Nf6...What kind of idiocy is it???> Idiocy? It's the first choice move for Toga II a 2900 rated chess engine. What move do you prefer? I suggest following this game with an engine -- Maurian's defense isn't as bad as you'd think. Morphy is just <unbelieveable> ... Bxf7 is preposterous/genius! I'm sure a twentieth century GM would give Morphy a much harder time but give Maurian some credit -- he isn't playing like an ape -- he's just getting torn to shreds by one of the greatest, if not the greatest, attacking geniuses of all time. |
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Dec-08-08
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| JG27Pyth: Well, 13...d5? is desperate-ape (roughly +4.50) but he's in bad shape no matter what... Toga recommends 13...Kf7 (+1.41) |
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| Dec-08-08 |
| njchess: This is a crushing example of play from Morphy. Within the first seven moves, Morphy exchanges a knight, a bishop and a pawn for Black's e,f and g pawns thereby exposing the Black's king. From move eight on, Morphy correctly presses the attack via a series of forcing, attacking moves leaving Black with few practical options. Black tries to trade off queens to defuse the attack, but Morphy simply applies more pressure instead. After 13. ... d5?, the game is essentially over. Kf7 followed by Rg8 are better moves, but still losing. Also, Kf7 is not at all obvious because it does not really protect the king, but rather prevents the fork of the king. Given the speed and strength of Morphy's attack, it really isn't unusual to see a defender slip up under that type of brutal pressure. The first rule of defense is simple - don't panic. Easier said than done over the board. |
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Dec-08-08
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| A.G. Argent: Well, to paraphrase a pal of mine who was, ironically, also from New Orleans: "Oh yeah, Morphy, he wudn't NUTTIN' nice!" Thanks <JG27Pyth> for the machine analysis in looking at Maurian's futility at holding off the onslaught. Spot-on. |
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Dec-08-08
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| playground player: Lest anyone think that Charles Maurian was a complete patzer, he does have a win against Steinitz in the CG.com database. |
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Dec-08-08
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| Calli: I seemed to recall that Steinitz lost two to Maurian and won 5 or so. Maurian also beat Zukertort. I'll see if I can find those games later. Morphy's opponents were not so weak as many think. |
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| Dec-08-08 |
| WhiteRook48: Ha ha ha ... Morphy definitely wins. Since Maurian has to save the King, Morphy will be able to save his hanging Queen ... GO MORPHY! |
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| Dec-08-08 |
| DoubleCheck: Can someone post and explain what would of happened if Black tried to counter with 16... Qe4 or Qxc2.
Thanks |
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Dec-08-08
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| amadeus: <what if Black tried to counter with 16... Qe4 or Qxc2> 17.Qh6+ Kg8 18.Qf8# |
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Dec-08-08
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| whatthefat: <JG27Pyth: Morphy is just <unbelieveable> ... Bxf7 is preposterous/genius! I'm sure a twentieth century GM would give Morphy a much harder time but give Maurian some credit -- he isn't playing like an ape -- he's just getting torn to shreds by one of the greatest, if not the greatest, attacking geniuses of all time.> It's worth noting that the Bxf7 sacrifice was not a new idea in this line. Cochrane vs Staunton, 1842
Staunton vs NN, 1847 |
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| Dec-08-08 |
| xrt999: 6...d5 is the refutation to this line. After 7.exd5 Qh4 8.Kf1, the game is in black's favor by a small margin, typical of the kings gambit; although white has traded down material, he has a slight spatial advantage and will attempt to build an attack. After 8...Qf6, black is fine. White might try 9.Nc3, Black might try to put his knight on e7 and castle kingside, or even develop and castle queenside. White cannot castle. I like black here, although I will probably never see this type of opening from white in a serious game. On the other hand, I would never play 3...g5 against the Kings gambit! |
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Dec-09-08
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| Whack8888: Hehe, nice game but no way Morphy was 150 years ahead of his time. I think he was about 50 or so years, maybe less actually, depending on what date you are starting from. Morphy was the best up until about early Lasker, mid-later Steinitz etc. Morphy's games are certainly some of the best aesthetically, though. I am not sure if any other player, aside from Tal, had quite the beauty of chess done as much as Morphy. |
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Dec-09-08
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| JG27Pyth: <It's worth noting that the Bxf7 sacrifice was not a new idea in this line. Cochrane vs Staunton, 1842
Staunton vs NN, 1847>
Wow, thanks for pointing that out...! Hats off to Cochrane. Nice to see Staunton remembered it well enough to whip some poor amateur with it when he got the chance. |
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| Dec-09-08 |
| Andrijadj: Well,if you are forced to play a move like Nf6 in ninth move,your defence and tactical vision is extremely bad...And one more thing,after 10 Bg5 why didnt he play Qe8...Cause after all attacks he has Bb4 and capture of queen on e8... |
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| Dec-11-08 |
| xrt999: < Andrijadj: This is such an idiotic game,blacks play is simply awful...It would be good to see Morphy trying this opening against Petrosian or Korchnoi... > Thank you!
I really have never understood this part of CG: when a very strong player dominates a weaker player, everyone is so enamored and gushes over the very strong player and how awesome his play is, picking apart the weaker player and pointing out the tactical mistakes. simply put, black played the wrong opening move, 6...Nc6, and lost the game! This is neither remarkable nor notable, it is just a very strong player dominating a weaker player. |
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Dec-11-08
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| amadeus: 10...Qe8 11.Bxf6 Kxf6 12.0-0!, and now the game is over: 12...Ke7 13.Qg5 Kd6 14.Rf6 Ke7 15.Rg6 1-0 |
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Dec-11-08
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| Calli: This game should be at knight odds. Morphy never played Maurian even. |
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| Dec-16-08 |
| Andrijadj: Nice amadeus thanks for the insight...But still,same type of demolition happenned in the game,so that just proves my point...
Xrt,that is exactly what I wanted to say...Maurian simply puts no resistance and that is why quality of this game is questionable... |
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Apr-27-09
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| heuristic: <6...d5 is the refutation>
6...d5 7.exd5 Qh4+ 8.Qf2 Qxf2+ 9.Kxf2
mo' better moves :
8...Kg7 9.Qg4+ Kf7 10.Qh5+ Ke6 11.d5+
13...Kf7 14.Bxf6 Rg8 (14...Ke8 15.Nc3 Rg8 16.g3 ;14...Rf8 15.Nc3 d6 16.d5 )15.Nc3 Ke8 16.g3 |
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Nov-20-09
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| cornflake: <xrt999: 6...d5 is the refutation to this line. After 7.exd5 Qh4 8.Kf1, the game is in black's favor by a small margin, typical of the kings gambit; although white has traded down material, he has a slight spatial advantage and will attempt to build an attack> 6... d5 is not a refutation. after 7.Bxd5 (not 7.exd5) white still has a dangerous attack on the f file after he plays 0-0.
6...Nc6 is a vastly inferior line to 6...d6. For a possibly tenable way to play the 6...d6 line see Degraeve vs C Marcelin, 2002. |
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sac: 5.d4
