< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 1 OF 3 ·
|Nov-10-04|| ||urtley: ah yes...first post :) the mistake is 19...Qxb2 |
|Nov-10-04|| ||Zaius: For some reason I missed the checkmate and instead went on this line:|
22.Rb1+ Ka7 23.Nxc6+ Qxc6 24.Qd4+ Qb6 25.Rxb6 cxb6 26.Qxg7+ Kb8 27.Qxh8+
|Nov-10-04|| ||milanez: so simple..that i missed it.. for some reason i came up with 22 Rb1+ Ka7 23 Nxc6+ Qxc6 24 Qd4+ Qb6 25. Rxb6 cxb6 26. Qxg7+ Kb8 27. Qxh8+ which leads to decisive advantage anyway |
|Nov-10-04|| ||milanez: now i feel better knowing i'm not the only one:) |
|Nov-10-04|| ||Zaius: Ok that's just eerie. |
|Nov-10-04|| ||milanez: <Zaius> next time i'll type faster and beat you to it! lol |
|Nov-10-04|| ||alexandrovm: funny coincidence |
|Nov-10-04|| ||Dudley: Got it in about 5 minutes. 1. Rb1+ forces Ka7. 2. Noticed that Nxc6 would be #. 3.Divert the black queen from protecting c6 by any means necessary. Now if I could only do that in games where I don't know for sure there's a mate lurking there. |
|Nov-10-04|| ||Bluelapis: White rook gained d-file. So, another check is an inevitable checkmate.. |
|Nov-10-04|| ||cu8sfan: <Dudley> Seeing these kind of situations in games is not the problem, getting into such positions is. Well for me it is. |
|Nov-10-04|| ||greystar69: I got the exact same line as Zaius and Milanez which leaves white queen and three pawns v. rook up after 28. Qxh8+, so equally crushing as what was played, but nowhere near as beautiful. |
|Nov-10-04|| ||cuendillar: I actually took longer time to find 22.Rb1+ Kc8 23.Qd8# than the text variation. That the knight should deliver mate was fairly obvious. |
This felt easier than yesterday's problem to me.
|Nov-10-04|| ||sourcerer: brilliant sacs!! but why Qxb2 when faced with such a mammoth task of defending his highness? |
|Nov-10-04|| ||Appaz: <cu8sfan><getting into such positions is>(the problem.)|
I think this has a lot to do with what kind of a player you are. If you have a strong tactical eye, you will more easily see tactical possibilities, and will then favour the moves which strengthens those.
This is actually the first daily position on cg.com I've cracked (haven't look into that many though), but it took me only a couple of minutes. Since there is no way to sac the rook (with a check) and survive, Rb1+ is an obvious candidate, and suddenly one of my favorite themes arises: distracting a defender with a sac.
|Nov-10-04|| ||Camus: <sourcerer>
It seems like black prefered to take the risk of a quick death, since his position is lost even without the combo, so i.e. 19. ... Rd8 20. Nc4 and the e-pawn could hardly be stopped
|Nov-10-04|| ||patzer2: White's combination begins with 16. Rxd7! White also appears to have a win with the simple idea 16. Qb4!, as White will be able to pick off the isolated pawn after the exchange of Queens. |
|Nov-10-04|| ||Nickisimo: I went for the 22. Rb1+ Ka7 23. Nxc6+ line as well, though the resultant endgame of Q vs 2R is either = or =-, so that answer couldn't really be correct. |
|Nov-10-04|| ||milanez: <Nickisimo> once white queen goes to g7 on move 26 to give a check, black king can only move to b8,blocking off the rook on a8, which lets queen take the h8 rook giving white Q+2P vs R |
|Nov-10-04|| ||patzer2: An expanded analysis of 16 Rxd7! follows:
16. xd7! xd7 17. xb6+ xb6
[17...cxb6 18. Qxf7+ Kc8 (18...Qe7?? 19. Rd1+ ; 18...Kd8?? 19. Rd1+ Kc8 20. Rd7 ) 19. Rd1 a5 (19...g6?? 20. Rd7! with a mating attack) 20. Qxg7 Qf8 21. Qd7+ Kb8 22. Nxe5 Ra6 23. Nxc6+ Ka8 24. Qd3 ]
18. xf7+ c8
[18...Kd6 19. Rd1+ Kc5 20. Rd5+! cxd5 (20...Kc4 21. Nxe5#) 21. Qxd5#]
19. xe5 b7!?
[19...Qxb2?? 20. Rd7+ Kb8 21. Qd1 is the game continuation]
20. d7 xb2 21. c5+ b8 22. e1 c8
[22...Qxc3?? 23. Rb1+ Ka7 24. Qxc7#]
23. xg7 a7 24. d4 b6 25. d7 xd4 26. cxd4
Of course the win is not so easy here, requiring strong endgame technique. So White might prefer the simplicity of 16. b4 xb4 17. cxb4 0-0-0 18. cxe5 to where White's pawn advantage and initiative offers good winning chances.
|Nov-10-04|| ||beenthere240: Too bad Nxc6 is mate -- otherwise he could have won the queen! |
|Nov-10-04|| ||mahmoudkubba: I agree with <urtley> the mistake is 19- ... qxb2 instead black could've played kb7 followed by Rona8 to rc8 if possible.. any idea of the conditions, envelopes, cases, ...etc of this game? was ait a dest or a single match or just a hobby game or a traniee game?? |
|Nov-10-04|| ||mahmoudkubba: to <beenthere240>: who is ZEMBLA please tell us????? |
|Nov-10-04|| ||notyetagm: 19 ... xb2?? is one of the stupidest, greediest moves I have ever seen on the chess board. |
|Nov-10-04|| ||kevin86: <beenthere> White would not have "won the queen"-as he had sacrifced it;he would have been the exchange down (without the mate). |
It seemed like double attacks were on the menu-cg threw us a curve with the mate.
|Nov-10-04|| ||patzer2: <notyetagm> while 19...Qxb2?? is a blunder it is not so obvious. I would rather emphasize that 20. Qd7+! Kb1 21. Qd1! is the subtle winning sequence that exposes the error. My analysis (posted above) indicates Black is lost no matter what move he makes in this position, even though 19...Kb7!? puts up more resistance and gives Black chances of swindling a draw if White misplays the endgame. |
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