< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 2 OF 2 ·
|Aug-27-14|| ||Phony Benoni: Lasker was human?|
|Aug-27-14|| ||An Englishman: Good Evening: Interesting simultaneous attack on the Queen side, King side and center; Lasker's forces spring into action from moves 18-23 as if they had been lying in ambush.|
|Aug-27-14|| ||Ferferi: Very nice pun. Made me smile. :)
[Mieses wasn't always a "mouse"; on his good day he could be like a lion. Very fierce tactical player. Here, too, he puts up a gallant fight, but it's hard to be yourself against Lasker...]
|Aug-27-14|| ||Refused: Well the pun reminds of a story about Mieses.
Rumoredly this happened during a tournament in England.
One hotel employee addressed him with <Mister Mieses> (pronounced with an /aI/ like mice)
Mieses responded slightly annoyed:
<It's Master Mieses.> (pronounced with /i:/ like in meet)
So I doubt Master Mieses would approve this pun. :)
|Aug-27-14|| ||kevin86: There seems to be a hint of Mister Jinks in this pun.|
Black wins easily- as Lasker always seemed to make it LOOK.
|Aug-27-14|| ||Ferferi: The reference is, of course, to John Steinbeck's classic, "Of Mice and Men". Sad, sad, sad story; just like this game ended for Mieses.|
|Aug-27-14|| ||croatia92: Miguel Najdorf 70 years!!|
|Aug-27-14|| ||julillo: Najdorf from 1926 t0 1996 has 70 years of career and Reshevsky from 1917 to 1991 has 74 years |
Real titans of chess
|Aug-27-14|| ||julillo: Taimanov has 73 years of career|
|Aug-27-14|| ||morfishine: Mouse is singular, Mice is plural
Mieses is pronounced "mee-suz", which means once again, a pun self-implodes due its own idiocy
Unless I'm "meesing" something...
|Aug-27-14|| ||tamar: Meister Mieses Meesses Meesus Mieses- possible reason for White's poor form.|
|Aug-27-14|| ||Phony Benoni: He wasn't a grandmaster, but we have 77 years (1928-2005) for Francisco Benko.|
Other 70+: Arnold Denker (1929-2001, 72 years) and Edward Lasker (1902-1976, 74 years).
|Aug-27-14|| ||psmith: On the pun... I think you have to remember this:
|Aug-27-14|| ||Richard Taylor: < Ferferi: The reference is, of course, to John Steinbeck's classic, "Of Mice and Men". Sad, sad, sad story; just like this game ended for Mieses.>|
Yes and no. The original quote which Steinbeck used in his tragic story is (something to the effect):
The best laid plans
a mice and men
gang aft astray
which was by Robbie Burns, the Scottish poet. He is describing how the field mice build their nest, but then the mower comes with his scythe and destroys their home. So their best laid plans often go wrong, or no matter how you plan, there may well be something you either didn't foresee or missed.
Then Steinbeck used this as the title of his short novel or long story.
Another book titled thus is 'Catcher in the Rye' also a quote from Burns.
You could make a game, and people do, of books titled by quotes. Steinbeck's 'The Winter of Discontent' is titled from almost the first line in Richard III. All this from memory, haven't checked the poem for some time, have known that phrase and poem since about 1959 as my father used to quote it.
But it is very famous...
|Aug-27-14|| ||Richard Taylor: < keypusher: A nice variation just before the end is 28 Qxc6 Rd1+ 29 Kf2 Re2+! 30 Kxe2 Qd3+ 31 Kf2 Qd4+ 32 Ke2 Re2+ 33 Ke1 Qf2# (Soltis). >|
Amusing variation. I played this game through quickly not noticing the B on c6 was attacked. Great play by Lasker. Mieses was no mug either.
The Qd3+ line seems a bit less adventurous but indeed looks easier for Black.
|Aug-27-14|| ||Everett: <Mieses is pronounced "mee-suz", which means once again, a pun self-implodes due its own idiocy>|
Why be such a ridiculous pedant? Is there a reason for your exacting attitude towards a playful pun?
|Aug-27-14|| ||Richard Taylor: < morfishine: Mouse is singular, Mice is plural
Mieses is pronounced "mee-suz", which means once again, a pun self-implodes due its own idiocy|
Unless I'm "meesing" something...
True, but the Scottish dialects which Burns used (and maybe misused) are sometimes closer to Old and even modern German, although it also has a mix of 'Gaelic' etc or a mix of Anglo-Saxon and Celtic or whatever history of language is involved.
The problem (for the tragic life of the pun) is that there wasn't a particularly "well laid plan" by Mieses, in his own line it seems that Nge2 as is played more commonly, is better. The attack on the B on c5 is typical but gaining 2 B's is offset but black's control of the d file and d4...
Here's a more successful game by White (he wins as Black gets tired I think and misses a nice finisher!):
C Cuartas Bedoya vs P Scheeren, 1977
|Aug-27-14|| ||Richard Taylor: The other one is - why did Steinbeck title the story of Lenny and his friend after that line or poem by Burns? Is it a parallel: I mean does it mean that like the mice, the big guy, who from memory, was Lenny, and is not aware of what he does even as he kills the woman, and the blind actions of the men for revenge. I think his friend kills him before he is captured...|
In the story, "justice" is sacrificed for vengeance and a lack of understanding: something like that.
In any case Steinbeck is well worth reading. I also like the stories of Cheever (who deals with very different subjects, classes of people, and places): I re-read one this morning.
There is also a dramatic story by Dreiser I read where a journalist has to go and witness the capture (and trial) of a black man who had been accused (wrongly) of rape, in (one of the Southern US States) - it is quite a complex story, and quite moving. Of course it was set early in the 20th Century. There is also a "miscarriage of justice" in that story: but it is more than a morality tale about right and wrong...
Mieses, the mouse, blindly essays to attack the great force of nature, the Chess Force (the principles of good opening development, preparation, perhaps), but plans not well enough! ? But Burns almost implies that these plans will more than 'aft'(often) 'gang' (go) astray...?
|Aug-27-14|| ||WannaBe: Great, a simple pun of a game for nothing more of amusement and humour turns into Literature 301...|
|Aug-28-14|| ||Honza Cervenka: Instead of 15.c3 or earlier white should have played Qd2 and 0-0-0.|
|Aug-28-14|| ||JimNorCal: Isn't it "gang aft agley"?|
|Aug-28-14|| ||morfishine: <Richard Taylor> Thanks for the reply and the link to the game! This explains a lot. I was too quick to write-off the game due to "the opponent was Lasker". But on the other hand, Mieses was White, and he was definitely no slouch |
You make a good point: Mieses misplayed the opening, something one cannot do and hope to survive vs Lasker
Notice the year of the game? 1889
Mieses was 24 while Lasker was only 21
|Sep-02-14|| ||Richard Taylor: < JimNorCal: Isn't it "gang aft agley"? >|
I don't know, could well be I was relying on memory.
|Sep-02-14|| ||Richard Taylor: <morfishine> Lasker was a great player for sure. I recall reading all of his Manual of Chess as a teenager in the 60s.
I played the 5th game of his match in 1921 against Capablanca and he didn't have such a bad game, it was very complex and he missed a couple of strategic points, then Capablanca played quite brilliantly to win. But Lasker was older then.|
Yes, he was young I suppose when he played that game. I saw some of his combinations looked 20 moves ahead when he was at his peak. One of the very great masters ever.
I'm not very converted to Mieses system though it seems to me White spends too much time fianchettoing...but maybe there is nothing wrong with it.
<WannaBe> Please be aware that there is no such thing as anything written for fun or amusement, (after all, can there be literature or art after Auschwitz, and the US invasions of Vietnam, Afghanistan etc is the obvious point..): such a naive and simplistic comment, assuming that there is ever any innocent writing, or even speech, smacks of a sadly dangerous right wing and insular attitude and a simplicity of thought which is sadly prevalent in today's "thought tormented"* and corrupted world. In future please do not interrupt my enormously important and informative literary lectures.
*I borrow the phrase from 'The Dead' by James Joyce From /The Dubliners/.
|Jan-31-17|| ||MrJafari: I was surprised to see Lasker's style. He played unpredictable!|
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