< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 2 OF 2 ·
|Aug-13-04|| ||vonKrolock: <ughaibu> i used to know a variation from the same quoting "when Petrossian offers a sacrifice, RESIGN AT ONCE" - it was also 'fished' from some far-deep 'in-brain' material, so i can be wrong... |
|Aug-13-04|| ||francescog: As for the best-move-issue, I found the queen sacrifice, but then I didn't see a clear win after 36 Bh3... and so I thought that this puzzle was too hard for me =) I'm happy to agree with <who>, <patzer2> and <crafty>. From the psychological point of view, <themindset> is certainly right. But from the problemist point of view, Nh5 is the kind of move that I would play... i.e. completely wrong =) and so this makes the puzzle less appealing. In any case the final trap is wonderful! |
|Aug-13-04|| ||Morales: Twenty years ago, 13th August 1984, the great Tigran Petrosian passed away. He should be the player of the day. |
|Aug-13-04|| ||patzer2: I thought the puzzle had a stronger alternative solution (cooked perhaps?) before I ever looked at it with the computer. The only thing that makes 34...Qxh2+ look overwhelming or a "psychological blow" is White's blunder 36. Nh5?? After 36. Bh3!?, White makes a game of it.|
My own human instinct over the board in these kinds of positions is to disdain a speculative pawn grab (even if it involves a combination) and to continue applying positional pressure by bringing more pieces to bear on the weakened King position. Personally I've won more of my games this way (especially against stronger opponents) than I did by gong for the "pawn up" combinations and endgames.
However, to give it a more objective look, I let Fritz 8 do an overnight infinite analysis at 20 depth on the position. After 34...Rg8! White has two "best play" replies, both of which lose:
1. (-1.47) 34...Rg8! 35. Ne2 Bg4 36. f4 exf4 37. Nxf4 Nf7 38. Re4 Bf5 39. Re2 Ne5 40. Rf1 Bd3 41. Nxd3 Rxf2 42. Nxf2 (@ 20/53 depth & 1393kN/s)
2. (-1.47) 34...Rg8! 35. Re2 Rgg6 36. Qe3 Rf4 37. Nf1 Qh5 38. Ng3 Qh4 39. Nf1 Rh6 (@20/53 depth & 1393kN/s).
|Aug-13-04|| ||senbay: I really miss Petrosian, even though i never met him, I was 3 years when he died. I wish that he lived on and that he is still a live because I think that he would have regained his world champion title ( this might just be wishful thinking). He is my favorite player ever and I consider him the best player ever existed( even better than Fischer and kasparov). I like him a lot and may God's peace be upon his soul. |
|Aug-13-04|| ||Hektor: I have always admired Petrosian's style of play: going against common chess "rules" from the get-go (both black knights "on the rim" by move 13!), the slow constriction of his opponents, then a powerful blow to obtain a favourable endgame. |
|Aug-13-04|| ||zb2cr: If 37 Kg3 instead of 37 Bh3, then Black plays 37 ... Rg8, threatening mate with the Knight at e4. The only defense I can see to that is 38 f4 (38 Bh3 clearly loses), Ne4+; 39 Kf3, Nxf2; 40 Kxf2, exf4. Black's now up two Pawns, with an attractive amount of pressure on White's Kingside. |
|Aug-13-04|| ||kevin86: RIP Tigran!
I think the finish is problematic at best! It looks like white could have held out-with best play.
|Aug-13-04|| ||artemis: <chessgames.com> I believe that there is a mistake in the score here. I looked this game up on my database on Fritz8, and the Nh5?? blunder that has caused so much confusion does not appear in this game, and is instead the only other move, Bh3 |
|Aug-13-04|| ||Zenchess: The final score according to Chessbase is 36. Bh3 Nxh3 37. Nf5 Bxf5 38. Qf1 Nf4+ 39. Kg3 Rg8+ 40. Kf2 Nh3+ 0-1. |
|Aug-13-04|| ||belgradegambit: I agree with <an englishman> that this is similar to Kotov's immortal win against Averbakh <Averbakh vs Kotov, 1953; |
|Aug-13-04|| ||ughaibu: Zenchess: Thanks for that. Benzol: Haven't you got a book with the definite score? |
|Aug-13-04|| ||Shah Mat: Play the board, not the player. |
|Aug-13-04|| ||patzer2: <zenchess> Thanks for the corrected score. Following this new score, after 36. Bh3 Nxh3 it would appear 37. Nf5?? is just as big a blunder as the misrecorded 36. Nh5??|
Fritz 8 follows the Crafty line with 36. Bh3 Nxh3 37. Kg2 (not 37. Nf5??) 37...Nxf2 38. Kxf2 Rf1, but varies from Crafty's line with 39. Rh1 (also worth considering is 39. a3). After 39. Rh1 in this line, Fritz asseses Black as having a small but clear advantage (-1.12 @ 18/39 depth & 1189kN/s). However, this is not a forced win and it would seem White has drawing chances.
|Aug-13-04|| ||abejnood: Today I did better than most days here! I got until 37 ... Nxh3 . I can't believe it! I'm so happy. I don't mean to put down anyone but this is like the first time ever I got that far... I just have to say it! I usually flunk anything Wednesday and beyond. I hope no one will be offended by my comment... ( I once saw a certain Ferocious Beast) ... I must be getting better!...thanks chessgames.com... |
|Aug-13-04|| ||HailM0rphy: What a beautifull ending..Tal must have been watching the game and told him to play Qxh2 |
|Aug-14-04|| ||Zenchess: Bent Larsen made a point about that; regarding one of Karpov's sharp TN's, he said that if a supersharp move is really good, a normally solid player will go for it. |
|Aug-25-07|| ||vonKrolock: <33.g1> Suetin said that 33.ae1 would be <" Упорнее"> - what's translated as 'more obstinated' (or 'stubborn(er)' ?!) - more here http://www.chesspro.ru/_events/2007...|
|Aug-25-07|| ||euripides: This looks like a Panno KID with a move wasted by White with c2-c3-c4. Petrosian was clearly in no mood to draw in front of his home crowd. I wonder what the tournament situation was. |
A year later he showed what White can do against the Panno:
Petrosian vs Spassky, 1966
|Aug-25-07|| ||euripides: ... one of the big differences between the two games is the different fortunes of the black knight, which Spassky leaves on a5 and Petrosian brings an extraordinarily long way into the attack. In <vonK>'s interesting link, Suetin is also quoted praising this plan, saying that Petrosian had the ability to recall the fundamental strategic plan in the heat of tactical complications.|
|Nov-23-07|| ||HOTDOG: 36.Nh5 Rxh5+ 37.Kg3 Tg8! 38.f4 Ne6+(stronger than Ne4+) 39.Kf3 Nd4+ 40.Ke4 Af5 mate|
|Oct-27-10|| ||ozmikey: A beautiful finish indeed. The real question for my money is why White played so passively right from the start!|
|Nov-05-10|| ||sevenseaman: Its a massive game and a premium demonstration of Petrosian's special skills as the positional last word in chessdom.|
Its nerve or total vision? How Petrosian strips his King and bares it to the bone on a frosty night!
It is no comfort to be aware that the bitter fight to the finish is also concentrated in the three files h, g and f where Black is in residence.
It sits behind a fig leaf of a lone pawn. But with Petrosian in full control no enemy fire had a chance of reaching its dicey sojourn.
|Jul-26-12|| ||Everett: 10..Na5 turns my stomach. Petrosian wins, but does so without this N for most of the game. Is there something wrong with the intuitive <10..Ne7>?|
Well, there is <10..Ne7 11.Nxe5 dxe5 12.d6> but this looks pretty equal. I originally thought Black could cross this idea after <10..Ne7 11.Nxe5 Ng4?! 12.Nxg4?? Bxb2> but White simply plays <12.Ne3> in that line.
Besides 10..Na5, it seems even <..Nd4> is possible, to be followed possibly by ..Bf5 or ..Bg4 depending, and ..a6 or ..Rb8 are always useful in such structures...
|Aug-22-12|| ||khursh: I just realized that the key knight came from a5 /move 10!/, slow but deadly knight!|
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