chessgames.com
Members · Prefs · Laboratory · Collections · Openings · Endgames · Sacrifices · History · Search Kibitzing · Kibitzer's Café · Chessforums · Tournament Index · Players · Kibitzing

Karl Robatsch vs Francisco Jose Perez Perez
Capablanca Memorial 2nd (1963), Havana CUB, rd 10, Sep-08
Pirc Defense: Austrian Attack. Weiss Variation (B09)  ·  1-0
ANALYSIS [x]

FEN COPIED

explore this opening
find similar games 2 more Robatsch/F J Perez Perez games
sac: 18.Ne4 PGN: download | view | print Help: general | java-troubleshooting

TIP: You can step through the moves by clicking the < and > buttons, but it's much easier to simply use the left and right arrow keys on your keyboard.

PGN Viewer:  What is this?
For help with this chess viewer, please see the Olga Chess Viewer Quickstart Guide.
PREMIUM MEMBERS CAN REQUEST COMPUTER ANALYSIS [more info]

Kibitzer's Corner
< Earlier Kibitzing  · PAGE 2 OF 2 ·  Later Kibitzing>
Dec-14-10  Patriot: Black is up a piece and threatens 19...Nxf2 or 19...Nxg5.

White could simply play 19.Bxe4 or 19.Qxe4 threatening 20.f6 but black can prevent this with 19...f6. Since the white bishop x-rays through to h7 and the queen is directly attacking it, it makes sense to consider 19.f6.

A) 19...Bxf6 20.Bxf6 (threatening 21.Qg4+) Nxf6 21.Rxf6 (threatening the queen and 22.Qxh7#)

B) 19...Nxf6 20.Rxf6 (threatening 21.Rxd6 and 21.Qxh7#)

C) 19...Nxg5 20.Qxg5 Black must lose significant material to stop mate.

D) 19...Ne2+ 20.Rxe2 Qd4+ 21.Qxd4 exd4 22.Bxf6

---------

There was at least one defense I missed. In line C, 20...Ne6 21.Qf5 wins.

Dec-14-10  knight knight: White's a piece down, but can play 19. Bxe4. However we're looking for a puzzle move, so... 19. f6 looks strong:

a) 19...Bxf6 20. Bxe4 Ne2+ 21. Kh2 and mate on h7 soon

b) 19...Bh8 20. Bxe4 Ne2+ 21. Kh2, mate on h7 soon

c) 19...Nxg5 20. Qxg5 Ne6 21. Qf5 e4 22. Bxe4 mating or winning basket loads of material

di) 19...Nxf6 20. Rxf6 Nf3+ 21. R1xf3 Qd4+ 22. Qxd4 exd4 23. Rxc6 even material, white has some positional advantage

dii) 19...Nxf6 20. Bxf6 e4 21. Qg4 Ne6 22. Bxe4 material even, white has a huge positional advantage, likely mates soon

diii) 19...Nxf6 20. Bxf6 h6 21. Qg4 Ne6 22. Qf5 e4 23. Bxe4 mating or winning basket loads of material

e) 19...h6 20. Bxe4 (pinning the h-pawn) Bxf6 21. Qxh6 Nf5 22. Bxf5 mating

f) 19...Nf5 20. Rxf5 Qd4+ 21. Kh1 Nf2+ 22. R5xf2 Qxh4 23. Bxh4 white is a piece ahead

Not an exhaustive list of defences, but think I've found the main lines.

Tough Tuesday I think! (unless I've chosen the wrong puzzle move)

Dec-14-10  knight knight: Oh, just noticed in my di) line white's actually a piece ahead lol!
Dec-14-10  Patriot: <<gofer>: Apologies about...

<19 ... Nxg5 20 fxg7 f6 (Kxg7 21 Qxg5+ Kh8 22 Rxf7 mating) 21 gxf8=Q+ Rxf8 (Kxf8 22 Rxf7+ Kg8 23 Qxg5+ winning) 22 Qxg5+ winning>

Its garbage. But 19 ... Nxg5 is the most interesting line. Both 20 fxg7 and 20 Qxg5 are good, but black has interesting options to delay mate...>

I thought your line was interesting. For practical purposes, seeing that 19...Nxg5 20.fxg7 is sufficient for a win, is "good enough". But I guess it depends on whether your goal is precision or finding there's a winning sequence for each reply for black, in order to prove 19.f6 is best. On this site I generally prefer the latter and that's the logic I hope to use OTB because it is far more practical. Precision can be accomplished when the position presents itself but even there I prefer simplicity if I know I'm winning.

Dec-14-10
Premium Chessgames Member
  perfidious: 19.f6 looks crushing here.
Dec-14-10
Premium Chessgames Member
  benveniste: I've seen this particular game presented as a puzzle before, but it started a move earlier. Black has no good answer to 18. ♘e4!.
Dec-14-10
Premium Chessgames Member
  kevin86: A brilliant intermezzo by white! The bishop is in danger and the knight fixed by the pin against h7. Black really has no reply.
Dec-14-10
Premium Chessgames Member
  agb2002: White has the bishop pair for a bishop and two knights.

Black threatens 19... Nxf2 and 19... Nxg5 20.Qxg5 Qf6 followed by Kh8 and Bh6.

The obvious 19.Bxe4 is replied with 19... f6 followed by ... Rf7 slowing down White's attack. Therefore, 19.f6:

A) 19... Nxf6 20.Rxf6 e4 21.Rxd6 + -.

B) 19... Bxf6 20.Bxe4 and mate soon (20... Ne2+ 21.Kh2).

C) 19... h6 20.Bxe4 Bh8 21.Qxh6 and mate soon (20... Nf3+ 21.gxf3).

D) 19... Nxg5 20.Qxg5 Ne6 21.Qf5 winning.

E) 19... Ne2+ 20.Rxe2 Qd4+ 21.Be3 + -.

F) 19... Nf3+ 20.Rxf3 Qd4+ 21.Be3 + -.

Dec-14-10
Premium Chessgames Member
  patzer2: For today's Tuesday puzzle solution, 19. f6! blows up Black's weakened castled position.

However, in going over this game, it's clear Black was in trouble several moves earlier.

The move 15. Rf2! may already be winning for White. Black needed to play 15...b5 for just about any chance to hold, but after 15...b5 16. fxg6! his task is difficult and may be impossible.

White is clearly winning after 18. Ne4, as 18...Nxe4 19. f6! with a clearly lost position is Black's best option here.

P.S.: Here's some analysis of 15...b5 16. fxg6! , played out move by move with Fritz 10:

15... b4 16. fxg6! fxg6 (16... hxg6? 17. Rxf6 Ne6 18. Nd1 Bxf6 19. Bxf6 Ng7 20. g4 Rad8 21. Ne3 Rfe8 22. Bc4 Rd7 23. Rd1 Qc5 24. Rxd7 Qxe3+ 25. Qf2 Qxf2+ 26. Kxf2 ) 17. Bc4+ Kh8 18. Na4 Nb5 19. Kh2 Qd4 20. Bxf6 Bxf6 21. Rxf6 Qxc4 22. Raf1 Kg8 23. R1f2 Nd4 24. b3 Qb5 25. Nb2 Rxf6 26. Qxf6 Qb7 27. Nd3 Qg7 28. Qd6 Re8 29. Nxb4 Qe7 30. Rf6 Kg7 31. Qxe7+ Rxe7 32. Rd6 Rc7 33. Nd3 Nb5 34. Re6 Nd4 35. Rxe5 Nxc2 36. Rc5 Nd4 37. Nb4 Kf7 38. Rc4 Rd7 39. Nxc6 Nxc6 40. Rxc6 Ke7 41. Kg3 Ke8 42. Kf4 Rd2 43. Ra6 Rf2+ 44. Ke5 Rxg2 45. Rxa7 h6 46. b4 Rg3 47. h4 g5 48. h5 Rh3 49. b5 Kd8 50. Rh7 g4 51. Rxh6 Ra3 52. b6 Kc8 53. Kf6 Rf3+ 54. Kg7 Rh3 55. e5 g3 56. e6 g2 57. Rg6 Rxh5 58. Rxg2 Rb5 59. Rc2+ Kb8 60. e7 Re5 61. Rc7 Re6 62. Kf7 .

I wouldn't be surprised if a stronger program than my older Fritz 10 version could find a saving resource for Black after 15...b5 16. fxg6! . However, this analysis should be sufficient to demonstrate it will be very difficult to find drawing chances for Black in this line.

Dec-14-10  ProLogik: <<Once>Ironic that Robatsch of all people should be demolishing a kingside fianchetto. After all, he did much to popularise the modern/ Robatsch defence (1. e4 g6).>

Well, who would know better the flaws of a system than someone who is familiar with it?

Dec-14-10  WhiteRook48: oh my gosh, I actually missed it. I'm stupid.
Dec-14-10  charms: An Austrian playing the Austrian attack. I think the thing to be learnt from this fairly easy puzzle is that there is no such thing as an "obvious response". I think that I might have replied Bxe4 without thinking, missing the instant blow.
Dec-14-10  wals: 19.Bxe4 was a blunder. WAAAAAAAAAAAH.

Rybka 4 x 64 blunders only

depth. 19 : 17 min :
Black
(+3.25):16...gxf5. Best, Nd7, 0.46.

1. (0.46): 16...Nd7 17.f6 Bh8[] 18.Bh6 Re6 19.Bxf8 Qxf8 20.Nd1 Bxf6 21.Qg3 Qh6 22.c3 Bh4 23.Qh2 Bxf2+ 24.Nxf2 Qe3 25.cxd4 Qxd4 26.b3 Qe3 27.Kh1 Rf6 28.Qg1 Nc5 29.Bb1 Qe2 30.b4 Ne6 31.a3 Rf4

2. (0.54): 16...Nh5 17.g3 h6 18.Be3 Bf6 19.Qg4 Bg7 20.fxg6 fxg6 21.Rxf8+ Rxf8 22.Rxf8+ Bxf8 23.Ne2 Nxe2+ 24.Bxe2 Kf7 25.Kg2 Nf6 26.Qc8 a5 27.Qb7+ Be7 28.Bxh6 Nxe4

depth: 19 : 5 min :
Black
(+5.77):17...b4. Best, e4, +3.13.

Black, outclassed, resigned move...19

Dec-14-10  standardwisdom: I spotted 19.f6 instantly, but spent a long time evaluating 19.. Ne2+ counterattack, before realizing that it is merely a distraction that doesn't go anywhere. The f6 square belongs entirely to white at that point.
Dec-14-10  sevenseaman: Chess is made up of blunders and brilliancies. Its a rare occurrence that two players play flawlessly and still one takes away a win.

I should like to make a collection of the putatively flawless encounters ending in a result. Theoretically all flawless games need to be won by white and chess could come to a standstill on a/c of the toss.

Will I get started?

Dec-14-10
Premium Chessgames Member
  Phony Benoni: <sevenseaman> I hope not. And I think not.

My theory is that the flawless game of chess is not only possible, it may have already been played. The problem is that we'll never know which one it was, not will we believe it when we see it.

Dec-14-10  sevenseaman: < Phony Benoni> Your theory may or may not have a destination. At best it may have to stop at the adjudged 'ideal'. In chess, most learned masters and ever-developing machines are our test labs and arbiters.

It will be easier and pragmatic if we modified our paragon of 'perfect' to 'least imperfect'. Else we will continue to swish air without getting anywhere.

Sep-05-11  DrMAL: Nice mini by Austrian Robatsch showing 6...Bg4 a weak reply due to 7.h3 giving white two-bishops advantage. 8...e5 was thought lesser here after Robatsch himself tried 8...Nc6 J Penrose vs Robatsch, 1962 (and lost). 11.g4 or simply castling seem logical alternatives to 11.Bg5 also strong looking. After 14.O-O black's position was very passive the knight on d4 looks nice but everything else is doing very little, 14...Qb6 tried to free it. 16...gxf5? instead of moving the knight to h5 or d7 lost but do-nothing 17...b4?! made it faster. Nice game for Robatsch! <sevenseaman: Its a rare occurrence that two players play flawlessly and still one takes away a win.> I think that, by definition of flawless, this can NEVER happen.
Sep-05-11  rilkefan: <I think that, by definition of flawless, this can NEVER happen.>

Only if "Black is ok!", no?

Sep-05-11  DrMAL: Either the flawless chess game always wins or it always draws, I'm inclined to believe the latter but I imagine people on here can argue endlessly on it, since it cannot be proven (kinda like Fischer playing Morphy or what have you).
Sep-06-11  sleepyirv: I like to think the flawless game of chess has been played by a couple of patzers. They did not understand the level of complexity of their game, that each move was accidentally brilliant. In the near infinity of chess games, a couple monkeys were abel to write Shakespeare.
Sep-06-11  DrMAL: Waxes similar to the Akobian vs. CG Poll game going on, even if writing this is going to make those participating in it less than happy to read. I mean, depending on computers for opening choices is simply an admission to complete lack of understanding. Computers are great at tactics and, to large sense, positional play (by grace of rules added) and they are even useful for looking at opening lines that transition to the middlegame. But they are not worth anything whatsoever compared to chess understanding for choice of opening moves. This is why they use an opening library with frequency played.
Sep-26-11  Beautiful.LMS: <DrMAL: Nice mini by Austrian Robatsch showing 6...Bg4 a weak reply due to 7.h3 giving white two-bishops advantage.>

Just because nobody plays 6..Bg4 anymore doesn't mean it's weak. There are other moves that players like more.

Sep-26-11  SimonWebbsTiger: 6...Bg4 isn't terribly good. Fischer, for example, appended it a "?" in <My 60 Memorable Games> in the notes to his famous win versus Benko, US Chp. 1963. (The Rf6 win)

Khalifman gives it his usual detailed treatment in <Opening for White According to Anand Vol. 4>. His conclusion: white simply has the better pawn structure and his g2-g4-g5 is hard to meet. Further, white's play is strengthened by castling q-side.

Apr-14-18
Premium Chessgames Member
  tpstar: <Ironic that Robatsch of all people should be demolishing a kingside fianchetto. After all, he did much to popularise the Modern/Robatsch defence (1. e4 g6). Here he uses a pretty standard attacking plan against his trademark defence - the f pawn hack. Double rooks along the f file, pin and then win the Nf6, chuck your f pawn up the board, point your bishop and queen against h7. Bake in a medium oven ... It has to be said that black speeds up white's winning process with moves like 16...gxf5 (voluntarily moving the crucial g6 pawn) and 17...b4 (kicking the Nc6 onto a square it wants to go to anyway).>

<Nice mini by Austrian Robatsch showing 6...Bg4 a weak reply due to 7.h3 giving white two-bishops advantage. 8...e5 was thought lesser here after Robatsch himself tried 8...Nc6 J Penrose vs Robatsch, 1961 (and lost). 11.g4 or simply castling seem logical alternatives to 11.Bg5 also strong looking. After 14.O-O black's position was very passive the knight on d4 looks nice but everything else is doing very little, 14...Qb6 tried to free it. 16...gxf5? instead of moving the knight to h5 or d7 lost but do-nothing 17...b4?! made it faster. Nice game for Robatsch!>

Opening Explorer

search thread:   
< Earlier Kibitzing  · PAGE 2 OF 2 ·  Later Kibitzing>
NOTE: You need to pick a username and password to post a reply. Getting your account takes less than a minute, is totally anonymous, and 100% free—plus, it entitles you to features otherwise unavailable. Pick your username now and join the chessgames community!
If you already have an account, you should login now.
Please observe our posting guidelines:
  1. No obscene, racist, sexist, profane, raunchy, or disgusting language.
  2. No spamming, advertising, duplicate or nonsense posts.
  3. No malicious personal attacks, including cyber stalking, systematic antagonism, or gratuitous name-calling of any member Iincludinfgall Admin and Owners or any of their family, friends, associates, or business interests. If you think someone is an idiot, then provide evidence that their reasoning is invalid and/or idiotic, instead of just calling them an idiot. It's a subtle but important distinction, even in political discussions.
  4. Nothing in violation of United States law.
  5. No malicious posting of or linking to personal, private, and/or negative information (aka "doxing" or "doxxing") about any member, (including all Admin and Owners) or any of their family, friends, associates, or business interests. This includes all media: text, images, video, audio, or otherwise. Such actions will result in severe sanctions for any violators.
  6. NO TROLLING. Admin and Owners know it when they see it, and sanctions for any trolls will be significant.
  7. Any off-topic posts which distract from the primary topic of discussion are subject to removal.
  8. The use of "sock puppet" accounts to circumvent disciplinary action taken by Moderators is expressly prohibited.
  9. The use of "sock puppet" accounts in an attempt to undermine any side of a debate—or to create a false impression of consensus or support—is prohibited.
  10. All decisions with respect to deleting posts, and any subsequent discipline, are final, and occur at the sole discretion of the Moderators, Admin, and Owners.
  11. Please try to maintain a semblance of civility at all times.
Blow the Whistle See something that violates our rules? Blow the whistle and inform a Moderator.

NOTE: Keep all discussion on the topic of this page. This forum is for this specific game and nothing else. If you want to discuss chess in general, or this site, visit the Kibitzer's Café.

Messages posted by Chessgames members do not necessarily represent the views of Chessgames.com, its employees, or sponsors. All Moderator actions taken are at the sole discretion of the Admin and Owners—who will strive to act fairly and consistently at all times.

This game is type: CLASSICAL. Please report incorrect or missing information by submitting a correction slip to help us improve the quality of our content.

<This page contains Editor Notes. Click here to read them.>

Featured in the Following Game Collections[what is this?]
yCommunity P-K4 Combined by Fredthebear
by fredthebear
Pirc Def. Austrian Attack. Weiss Var (B09) 1-0 Line clearance
from Perky Old Mod Benkoni by fredthebear
19.? (Tuesday, December 14)
from Puzzle of the Day 2010 by Phony Benoni
19. f6! blows up Black's position, but may be lost by 15. Rf2!
from Weakened Castled Position by patzer2
1.e4 explorations
by Ktchecker
19 moves
from Chess Miniatures, Collection II by PinkLedDoor
19.? (Tuesday, December 14)
from POTD Pirc , Modern ,Robatsch by takchess
19. f6! blows up Black's position, but may be lost by 15. Rf2!
from Weakened Castled Position by Jaredfchess
19.? (December 14, 2010)
from Tuesday Puzzles, 2004-2010 by Phony Benoni
miniature pool
by Zorts
19 moves
from Chess Miniatures, Collection II by wwall


home | about | login | logout | F.A.Q. | your profile | preferences | Premium Membership | Kibitzer's Café | Biographer's Bistro | new kibitzing | chessforums | Tournament Index | Player Directory | Notable Games | World Chess Championships | Opening Explorer | Guess the Move | Game Collections | ChessBookie Game | Chessgames Challenge | Store | privacy notice | contact us
Copyright 2001-2019, Chessgames Services LLC