< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 3 OF 4 ·
|Feb-03-11|| ||1.e4effort: Like yesterday, I found the initial move asked for by POTD:
17. Bxh7+...Kxh7 followed by
18. Rh3 (rendering null for the moment the BN attack on the WQ, but worse yet, paralysing the BN until the kill)...Kg8
19.Rxh5 at which point I have to get back to work.
|Feb-03-11|| ||Coigach: Material is even. W is better centralised and 4 pieces are poised to attack the BK. B has weakened his K defences by attacking the WQ. Otherwise, B has no real threats, and his Q is undefended on c7. Sacrificial mating combination quite possible.|
Candidates Bxh7+, Qh4, Rh3
Bxh7 is the only promising line. I couldn't calculate it through until the end, but saw that W can at least get his piece back with 19.g4 and is then at least a pawn up with the BK even more exposed.
I did see 19.Nxg6 when calculating, but failed to evaluate it as even better than 19.g4. OTB I wouldn't worry too much about what I'd play at move 19 until I got there; as long as I'm clear W will be sure of a good advantage I'm happy 17.Bxh7+ can be played.
Similarly, I didn't bother looking at what happens after moves like 18...Kg8, as B played, since B is in bad trouble if he can't keep his piece.
|Feb-03-11|| ||beenthere240: 15...Qc7 is just a dare - saying create a combination where you can move the knight with check and I'll give you my queen.|
|Feb-03-11|| ||sevenseaman: <Once> A reasoned and cogent response. |
In this puzzle, I fairly felt contented to find Bxh7 and Rh3 and saw also that Black could not refuse the B by Kh8 on a/c of Ng6+, losing the Q.
Apparently I needed to be more thorough as one would be in CC (we have been doing just that against GM Pogonina) and I may have seen the R sac on h8. Thanks.
|Feb-03-11|| ||psmith: <eblunt>
After 19...Qe7, analysis aided by Fritz 5.32 gives 20. Qe3! (threat Qh3) g6 21. Rh3 (threat Qh6) g5 22. Rh5 Rfd8 (22...f6 23. Qh3 Qg7 24. Qxe6+ Rf7 25. Nxf7 Qxf7 26. Rh8+) 23. Rxg5+ Kf8 24. Rg6! (threat Qh6#) -- there are a number of variations but White has a winning attack. (Suggest an improvement or defense.)
|Feb-03-11|| ||kevin86: A change of tactics. First white went after the king and achieved his real goal of winning the queen.|
|Feb-03-11|| ||MiCrooks: The point after Bxh7+ Kxh7 Rh3 g6 is that Nxg6 wins immediately. Once again the Queen is hanging on c7 (a recurring theme) so Black has to reply Qxf4 but then after Nxf4 White wins back the pinned Knight and is up two clear pawns.|
So Black plays Kg8 instead so that he only drops one pawn, but he leaves White not only up a pawn but with a dominating position due to his much better pieces.
The nice tactic with Rh8+ is just icing on the cake.
|Feb-03-11|| ||bengalcat47: Such a big Fuss made over the classic Bishop sacrifice at h7! Seroiusly, though, this is a very impressive win for Spielmann, a player who exceled at complicated tactical positions.|
|Feb-03-11|| ||David2009: Spielmann vs J Fuss, 1934 White 17?|
Level material, but 17.Bxh7+ now wins a Pawn. Best for Black seems 17...Kxh7 (not ...Kh1?? Ng6+ loses the Q) 18 Rh3 Kg8 19 Rxh5 Rac8 and struggle on a Pawn down.
If instead 18...g6? than 19 Nxg6 wins another Pawn because the Qc7 is unguarded. Time to
The second blunder 19...f6?? is icing on the cake.
Some day this is going to be 'game of the day' with a "No fuss" punline.
|Feb-03-11|| ||doubledrooks: I found the game continuation to the end.
However, after the possible 19...Qe7 I didn't go with 20. Qe3, which according to <psmith> Fritz says is best.
Rather, I went with 20. Qg4 (aiming for Qh3) g6 21. Rh6 Qf6 22. Qh3 Rfd8 23. Ng4 Qg7 24. Rh7 Qxh7 25. Nf6+ and 26. Nxh7. But there are other moves black could play and I'm not sure 20. Qg4 works.
|Feb-03-11|| ||Everett: First two moves are very easy to see. The rook sac, setting up the discovered attack on the hanging Q is more of a Tuesday/Wednesday thing. One of the few patterns I know.|
|Feb-03-11|| ||mjmorri: With 16.Rc3 Spielmann must have anticipated 16...Nh5 which leads to disaster for Black. With the undefended Black Queen on c7, the position cries out for a knight check. But how...? Spielmann shows us. 17.Bh7+ is the easy move. The hard move is 16.Rc3. That is what sets GM's apart from the rest of us.|
|Feb-03-11|| ||WhiteRook48: I tried 17 Rh3 right away. I'm such an idiot, after 17...Nxf4 the knight attacks the rook, so any discovered checks can't possibly work.|
|Feb-03-11|| ||Everett: <WhiteRook48> I looked at that line too, but luckily looked a bit further! The only thing you did wrong is not check it...|
|Feb-03-11|| ||BOSTER: Looking at the position on diagram it is easy to see that if white moves his knight e5 he will create a discovered attack on the black unprotected queen with the queen on f4. It is easy to find the solution like this 17.Bxh7+ Kxh7 18.Rh3 g6 19.Ng6 Qxf4 20.Nxf4+ Kg8 21.Rxh5.
But here I asked himself. Did <CG> choose this game as the puzzleif the real continuation was like this ? Is this a puzzle?
I don't think so. This means , that when players had reached the position on diagram black!, not white had found something intriguing to make this game more attractive. Maybe,when players had reached the position on diagram Spielmann looked at h8 square, Fuss had read his mind and played Kg8 and f6 with possibility 20.Rh8+
click for larger view
After this the game really looks like masterpiece which is worth to be choosen by <CG>.
|Feb-03-11|| ||offramp: I am certain that Spielmann did not calculate even one variation in this whole finale.|
|Feb-03-11|| ||wals: Went close, but not close enough.
18...g6 would have given it another twist.
Rybka 4 x 64
Black blunder: d 18 : 9 min :
1. (1.93): 18...g6 19.Nxg6 Qxf4 20.Nxf4 Rad8 21.Rd1 Rh8 22.Rxh5+ Kg7 23.Rxh8 Rxh8 24.b3 Kf6 25.g3 Kf5 26.f3 b5 27.h4 Rd8 28.Ng2
19...f6, +10.87, didn't help Black,
who resigned move 21... .
|Feb-03-11|| ||TheBish: Spielmann vs J Fuss, 1934|
White to play (17.?) "Medium"
With Black's queen undefended and White's counterpart on the same diagonal (h2-b8), there is a possible tactic of winning the queen if the knight can somehow move with check.
17. Bxh7+! Kxh7
Worse is 17...Kh8 18. Ng6+ fxg6 19. Qxc7 Kxh7 20. Qxb7, winning the queen for a knight.
18. Rh3 g6
Otherwise, White wins the piece back with an attack (and pawn), i.e. 18...Kh8 19. Rxh5 (threatening 20. Qh4 and 21. Rh8#) and if now 19...f6? (19...Rfc8! holds out longer) 20. Rh8+! Kxh8 21. Ng6+ wins the queen, as does 19...c5? 20. Ng6! fxg6 21. Qxc7 gxh5 22. Qxb7.
White can try 19. g4, but 19...f6 20. Nxg6 pretty much forces a similar line.
19...Qxf4 20. Nxf4 Rad8 21. Rxh5+ Kg7 22. Ne2 and White has won two pawns.
|Feb-03-11|| ||Patriot: 17.Bxh7+ is one of those "nothing to lose" moves. Since 17...Kxh7 18.Rh3 and white gets the piece back. After 18...g6 19.g4 will surely get it back with interest. I never considered 18...Kg8 nor do I think it is necessary. But I did notice that if the knight could go to g6 with check, white wins the undefended queen.|
|Feb-03-11|| ||Patriot: After 18...g6, 19.Nxg6 is better than 19.g4 but it looks winning as well. What can I say? I found the entire line winning, starting with 17.Bxh7+ so that was enough for me. After getting to the position in a game, hopefully then I would choose 19.Nxg6 because that's the point where it matters.|
|Feb-03-11|| ||culei: Patriot
Eyal previously refuted the 19 g4
I didn't analyze it because I'm tired but maybe you can find something he said black has a nice move wich will make the game very ,very intersting
|Feb-04-11|| ||rilkefan: <<Eyal>: After, e.g., 19.g4 c5 20.gxh5, Black has the little trick of 20...g5! (the pawn can’t be captured because of Rg8 with a pin on the g-file)>|
What about 21.Qxg5 Rg8 22.Ng6? ...fxg6 23.hxg6+ appears to win. I think white wins the endgame after ...Qd8, but maybe ...Qc6 is good.
|Feb-04-11|| ||SamAtoms1980: <Phony Benoni: And I predict the obvious pun will be made before the end of page one.>|
How obvious? There are quite a few good ones that could fly here:
"Don't Raise A Fuss"
"No Big Fuss"
"Stop It With The Fuss"
I saw the first three moves but not 20.Rh8+, by the way. Looking for a conclusion on the king, when the final stroke was directed at the queen.
|Feb-04-11|| ||rilkefan: Also there's white's name - "This guy can play".
And on black's - "Fuss gets stepped on".
|Feb-04-11|| ||Eyal: <rilkefan: What about [19.g4 c5 20.gxh5 g5!] 21.Qxg5 Rg8 22.Ng6? ...fxg6 23.hxg6+ appears to win. I think white wins the endgame after ...Qd8, but maybe ...Qc6 is good.> |
Yes, Black can't take immediately on g6 - but White doesn’t have an efficient way of immediately increasing the pressure either, so Black has time to improve his position, and eventually the (doubly) pinned knight would fall - 22...cxd4! 23.Qf6 Qc6 (that's more accurate than 22...Qc6, because after 23.f3 cxd4 24.Rg3! Black can't take the knight as the queen doesn't defend e7 - 24...fxg6 25.hxg6+ Kg7 25.Qe7+ and mate) 24.f3 e5! 25.Qxe5 (25.Qxf7+ Rg7 28.Qf5 Bc8) Rae8 26.Qxd4 Qe6 27.Qh4 Rg7 28.Rf2 Kg8 and fxg6 will follow.
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