< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 22 OF 23 ·
|Nov-12-11|| ||LIFE Master AJ: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pLEE...|
Another nice vid on this game ...
|Nov-12-11|| ||leonie: thank you very much. Iwatched all of the videos and they are all nice.
Your video and explanations is the most complete for my understanding.
I also took a look at your other videos. but the games are much more complicated. I will need time to understand but I do not know why there are all this ugly discussions.|
|Nov-12-11|| ||LIFE Master AJ: <<but I do not know why there are all this ugly discussions.>> |
Old history. Its NOT worth going into, its better just to ignore all that silliness.
|Nov-12-11|| ||AnalyzeThis: Would 6....Qe7 work out better for black than 6..... Nf6?|
|Nov-12-11|| ||JoergWalter: <AnalyzeThis>
6....Qe7 7.Bg5 and what to do then?
The oldest and probably best defense (see Atwood vs. Wilson, 1801 posted previously) is 6....Qd7!. (exclam by Maroczy, Pachman et. al.)
Of course it is not even mentioned in <LMAJ>'s so called analysis.
|Nov-15-11|| ||leonie: Mr. Goldsby, is it true?
The oldest and probably best defense (see Atwood vs. Wilson, 1801 posted previously) is 6....Qd7!.
|Nov-16-11|| ||SimonWebbsTiger: I am sure I am not alone when I say the very first game I saw after learning how to move the pieces was this game.|
There is something so wonderfully beautiful, yet simple, about this game. Morphy develops and uses neat tactics to mate his poorly developed, bound opponents.
My heart skipped a beat in one of my first tourney games as a child when I had this all the way to 9...b6. The game continued 10. 0-0-0 g6 11. Bb5 (11. Nd5 is also a body blow) Bg7 12. Nd5 . I like this old game of mine even now because it illustrates the tactical motif of the pin in a lovely, geometric way: the bishops on b5 and g5.
|Nov-16-11|| ||JoergWalter: <SimonWebbsTiger>
yes, that was thoughtless of me. Sorry.
|Nov-16-11|| ||LIFE Master AJ: I copied this here, (from my forum); as I still get asked this question in e-mails from time to time ... |
<<Nov-16-11 leonie: Mr. Goldsby, please excuse me for posting here but I do not like the page with the game of Paul Morphy any more. You have been helpful and so I shall copy this here again, if you do not mind. It is about 6....Qd7 and I cannot find it in your analysis. You show that 7....Qd7 is bad.
leonie: Mr. Goldsby, is it true?
The oldest and probably best defense (see Atwood vs. Wilson, 1801 posted previously) is 6....Qd7!.>>
Paul Morphy - The Count of Isouard & The Duke of Brunswick
1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 d6 3.d4 Bg4 4.dxe5 Bxf3 5.Qxf3 dxe5 6.Bc4,
click for larger view
Technically speaking, this natural developing move is actually a mistake. However, I want to emphasize that Black has a TERRIBLE (nearly losing!) game here ... nothing he does will change that. (ALL the engines agree - the eval's are either that White is MUCH better, or even nearly winning ...)
All the good analysts (Hubner, Timman, Nunn, etc.); agree that 6...Qf6 was the best move for Black ... in a pretty bad situation.
Your 6...Qd7?! is inferior ... the is just a (long-term) target on d7. (However, I should point out that 6...Qd7; was probably still an improvement over the actual game!)
Here is an analysis that I began last night - and finished this morning. (I don't consider it exhaustive, but just shows how Black will NOT escape his difficulties from the diagrammed position.)
[6...Qd7!?; (Really - '?!') 7.0-0 Nf6; 8.Rd1, (8.Nc3!?) 8...Qg4; 9.Qd3! Nc6; 10.f3 Qg6; 11.Bb5 Bc5+!?; 12.Be3 Bxe3+; 13.Qxe3 Nd7;
To protect c6, if Black gets doubled Pawns here, the game is virtually over.
Black must do something. Castling on the Q-side looks very dangerous, and ...0-0?? just drops a on the d7-square.
15.Bxc6 Qxc6; 16.Nd5 Nf6; 17.Qa3! Nxd5; 18.Rxd5 f6; 19.Rad1, White is much better. " "]
7.Qb3 Qe7 8.Nc3 c6 9.Bg5 b5 10.Nxb5 cxb5 11.Bxb5+ Nbd7 12.0-0-0 Rd8 13.Rxd7 Rxd7 14.Rd1 Qe6 15.Bxd7+ Nxd7 16.Qb8+ Nxb8 17.Rd8# 1-0
|Nov-16-11|| ||LIFE Master AJ: I just re-submitted the Neverov-Chahrour game ... its the most forceful example of the 6.Qb3 line that I can find. (I submitted it many months ago now ...) |
Most of the time, 6.Qb3 is purely transpositional. (7.Bc4 is usually played next.) However, one VERY GOOD reason to play 6.Qb3 immediately is that Black seems virtually forced to play the weakening 6...b6. Also - in some games I found on the Internet - White sometimes want to follow this up with a pin (b5) of Black's QN; if it goes to c6 ... the doubling of those Pawns is probably decisive, if Black allows that to happen.
There are some other aspects to 6.Qb3, like White may want to delay bringing out his LSB and play Nc3 and 0-0-0 as I (also) found in the DB. [(Again) - see the V. Neverov - M. Chahrour game that I already posted somewhere - above.]
|Nov-16-11|| ||JoergWalter: 6.... Qd7! (best in that position)
8. c3 Nf6
What more can you expect from an inferior opening?
|Dec-17-11|| ||Penguincw: A very creative game by Morphy.|
|Jan-04-12|| ||kingscrusher: I have video annotated this game here:
|Jan-04-12|| ||JoergWalter: well done video. thanks <kingscrusher>|
|Jan-05-12|| ||Penguincw: < kingscrusher >|
Another classic. Thanks.
|Feb-14-12|| ||LIFE Master AJ: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ny7k...
I also have a video on this game ... over 600 views now ...
|Feb-24-12|| ||Nemesistic: After 4.dxe wouldn't it be better for Black to play 4...Nc6?, gambiting a pawn instead of what transpired?|
Or is that even worse than 4...Bxf3?? Which we know causes Blacks first probem?
Why not 4.dxe ...Nc6 5.exd ...Bd6 6.Bb5 ...a6/...Nge7 ??
|Feb-24-12|| ||SimonWebbsTiger: @<Nemesestic>
some people try the gambit from time to other - eg. Kramnik, of all people to play a dubious gambit against(!), faced it in a simultaneous display - but it's not really good. Khalifman provides one example of how white develops and ends up a sound pawn ahead in <Opening According to Anand> Vol. 1
|Feb-24-12|| ||Nemesistic: <SimonWebbsTiger> I just played against the Philidor on a friends computer against an engine (some version of shredder! I don't know too much about engines compared to you guys!) from the position i went with above after Black plays 6...a6 and i ended up in this position below..White to play|
I can't post a diagram so..
W..Kf1/ pawns on a7 and h3/ Rg7
B...Ke5/ pawns on f3,g5,h5/ Ra2
There's just no way i can promote that a pawn is there?
Anyway i resigned, but even though i attained that position you said was bad for Black after 6...a6, this is the best i could personally do lol.. Saying that its the closest iv got, and probably ever will get to beating an engine lol
There's no draw here is there?
|Mar-21-12|| ||Nightsurfer: Hi <Phony Benoni>, |
I have just read your assessment of the tactics of Paul Morphy's opponents - your assessment dating back to May 6th, 2011, sorry for the delay in paying attention to your contribution!
I would like to stress that you have made a most valuable point by stating that <" ... for the most part, Black doesn't play this game horribly. Sure, 3...Bg4 and 7...Qe7 are probably not good, and 9...b5 is just asking for it. But for the most part, D&C make reasonable moves ...">.
Yes, you are right! Many of those moves that D&C have executed are quite plausible. Therefore the average amateur player, after somehow having stumbled by chance into the dubious line 3. ... Bg4? pp. , would tend to play the same way the duo D&C has tried to get out of their mess back then at Paris. With the result that sometimes a strange case of replay can be put on the board, herewith a stunning case - R Gralla vs S Stojanovic, 2008 - that has happened FOR REAL 150 (!) years after <Paul Morphy vs Duke Karl / Count Isouard, Paris 1858> at Hamburg, Germany.
And I can tell you, for sure: that game R Gralla vs S Stojanovic, 2008 is not a fake!
|Jun-01-12|| ||theoreticaldraw: This is the first time I've played through this game in years. It's funny how black's practically busted after about 6 moves.|
|Jun-01-12|| ||Llawdogg: Some even say after three moves.|
|Jun-02-12|| ||chaamjamal: Hi <Nightsurfer>
Thanks for the Gralla Stojanovic 2008
|Jun-29-12|| ||RMKvdS: Nice video <kingcrusher>.|
|Jul-21-12|| ||Nightsurfer: You're right, <chaamjamal>, I do agree with you: <"eerie">, that is the right way to describe that very strange event of second coming in 2008, namely during the rather incredible game R Gralla vs S Stojanovic, 2008 - 150 (!!) years after this game here <Paul Morphy vs Duke Karl / Count Isouard, Paris 1858>!|
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