< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 4 OF 4 ·
|Oct-18-12|| ||Gaith tabba: I think another possible and very strong move and wining Nd7 qd7 (bd7 nothing different ) bf6!!! Re8 or rd8 only moves because Be7 Qh5 gh5 Rg3 checkmate ) aftter Re8 Rh7!! Kh7 only move Qg4 ! And now mate in two black an avoidble because Qh4 followed by Qh8 I think that som strange analyses but very strong and force and funny|
|Oct-18-12|| ||Eggman: <<chrisowen>>|
After 12.Qh5 Nf6 13.Ng4 you mention 13...e5 (clever and resourceful!). After 14.Nxf6+ Kg7 we reach this position ...
click for larger view
... with White's Queen, Rook, and Knight under fire. But now how about 15.Qh6+ Kxf6 16.fxe5+ (16.Qxf8!? Bxf8 17.Bxe5+ is probably also good) Bxe5 17.Bxe5+ Qxe5 18.Qxf8
click for larger view
18...Bxh3 (18...Qxa1?? 19.Qh8+!) 19.Qxa8 and if 19...Qg5 then 20.Qd8+ wins.
|Oct-18-12|| ||keypusher: <Gaith tabba: I think another possible and very strong move and wining Nd7 qd7 (bd7 nothing different ) bf6!!! Re8 or rd8 only moves because Be7 Qh5 gh5 Rg3 checkmate ) aftter Re8 Rh7!! Kh7 only move Qg4 ! And now mate in two black an avoidble because Qh4 followed by Qh8 I think that som strange analyses but very strong and force and funny>|
How about 15...Bf8 16.Qh4+ Bh6 17.Bg5 Rh8 18.Qxh6+ Kg8. Does that work for Black?
|Oct-18-12|| ||David2009: Plachetka vs L Zinn, 1974 second postscrpt:
<keypusher [snip] What does the engine say after 16....Be5?>|
Fritz 12 proposes 16... Be5 17. Bxe5+ Qxe5 18. fxe5 cxd5 19. Rxh6+ Kg7 20. Rh4 to reach with Black to play
click for larger view
which Fritz assesses as +4 for White. It proposes that Black play f5 to free the King (either immediately or after Bd7) which allows White to simplify with exf6 en passant.
|Oct-18-12|| ||psmith: (edited because of bad editing in the original version...)
I started with the idea that if I could get my N to h6 that would be mate. But attempts to do so (12. Ng4) are too slow. Early on I toyed with 12. Qh5 but thought “that can’t work”. Then I saw 12. Qh5 gxh5 13. Rg3+ Kh8 14. Nxf7#. But what about 12. Qh5 Nf6? Now, suddenly 13. Ng4 is tempting since if 13… Nxh5 14. Nh6# after all. But does Black have any other defense? 13… gxh5 14. Nxf6+ Kg7 leads to 15. Ne8+ with 15…Kg8 16. Rg3#; 15…Kh6 16. Bg7+ Kg6 17. Rg3+ Kf5 18. Rg5+ Ke4 19. Nc3#; 15…Kg6 16. Rg3+ Kh6 (16…Kf5 17. Rg5+ Ke4 18. Nc3#) 17. Bg7# Best seems to be 14…Kh8 and now there is a simple win of two pawns with 15. Nxd5+ f6 16. Nxc7 Bxc7 17. Rxh5 ; Black has a ruined pawn structure and is down two pawns, and I doubt his two Bishops can give him enough activity though there is still some fight. Can White try for more? I looked at 15. Rxh5!? so that if 15… Kg7 16. Ne8+ Kg6 [16…Kg8 17. Rg5#] 17. Rg5+ Kh6 18. Bg7#; I didn’t see an immediate win after 15… h6, though – 16. Rxh6 Kg7 17. Rh7+ Kg6 seems too slow (Black will play e5 and break the protection on the Knight). Of course we can go back to something like 16. Nxd5+ in this line, leading to similar positions as above… I may have missed something devilish here, but I am out of time for this today. So, post and check!|
|Oct-18-12|| ||Eggman: <<(Fritz) proposes that Black play f5 to free the King ...>>|
I'm not familiar with Fritz (or chess engines in general) - does it actually gives reasons for the moves it suggests?
|Oct-18-12|| ||rudiment: Nice! Got this one straight away. White's commanding Bishop begs to be capitalised upon. Good week so far, but I'm sure the weekend will bring me back down to earth...|
|Oct-18-12|| ||Olavi: 200 Modern Brilliancies by Kevin Wicker gives this: Belgium 1977 Defosse-Franck
1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 e6 3.Nf3 b6 4.Nc3 Bb4 5.a3 Bxc3+ 6.bxc3 Ne4 7.e3 Bb7 8.Bd3 f5 9.Qc2 O-O 10.O-O Rf6 11.Nd2 Rh6 12.g3 Qh4 13.Nf3 Ng5 14.gxh4 Nxf3+ 15.Kg2 Ne1+ 16.Kg3 Rg6+ 17.Kf4 Rg4+ 18.Ke5 Nc6#|
|Oct-18-12|| ||keypusher: <Fritz 12 proposes 16... Be5 17. Bxe5+ Qxe5 18. fxe5 cxd5 19. Rxh6+ Kg7 20. Rh4 to reach with Black to play>|
Thanks, David2009. That looks convincing. Also, for those wondering about 12.Qh5 Nf6 13.Qh6, FSR posted Plachetka's original line, 13....d4! 14.Ng4 Nh5 15.Rxh5 f5!, unclear.
|Oct-18-12|| ||HAPERSAUD: A sad day indeed when offbeat openings work :(|
|Oct-18-12|| ||Gaith tabba: Sorry I am hurry up with my analyse but I think also interesting the key pusher see best defence to my moves but I think also white have draw in hand at least and this my full anlayse to moves with specific 12Nd7 now Qd7 forced because (..Bd7? 13Qh5!! And and white soon check mates ) so 13 Bf6 R e8 (Rd8 same) 14Rh7 kh7 15 Qg4 Bf8!! This move I didnt see in my first analyse and key pusher saw it thanks for him Now 16Qh5 Bh6 17g4 Rh8 18g5 Kg8 19 Bh8 or (gh6 with very strong bishop and dark square and un clear posiotion but I think white is good ) 19..kh8 20gh6 now f5 orf6 forced because (..20kh7 ?? 21Qf6 kh6 22Qh8#) 21 Qf6 + Kg8 22 Qg6+ forcedK h8 because Kf8?? h7 and white queen for Qg7 qh5and whit win so 22..kh8with draw with check this analyse not best but very funny and I didn't use engine|
|Oct-18-12|| ||BOSTER: <Eggman> <When I tackle complicated puzzles ,I first memorize the position and then set it up on a board from memory>.|
I agree that this is a good strategy, but if you can remember all picture ,why do you need a chess set?
Some players claim that playing "blind" is easy then with chessboad.
|Oct-18-12|| ||FSR: <kasputine><Eggman> You're right. Good point.
<keypusher> Dunno what the engines say, but I think the above-mentioned kibitzers have busted my 16...Be5 line with their recommendation 12...Nf6 13.Ng4! gxh5 14.Nxf6+ Kh8! 15.Rxh5 h6 16.Nxd5+ Be5 17.Bxe5+ Qxe5 18.fxe5! cxd5 19.Rxh6+ leaving White <three> pawns up. So White really does have a clear win in all lines, but Black should have made him demonstrate it, especially since the plausible 13.Qh6? would have allowed Black to escape.|
|Oct-18-12|| ||TheBish: Plachetka vs L Zinn, 1974|
White to play (12.?) "Medium"
12. Qh5! Nf6 is what I came up with after a few minutes' thought. (And not 12...gxh5 13. Rg3+ Kh8 14. Nxf7#.) Now what? After looking at trading knights first (which doesn't work so well after 12. Nxd7 Qxd7! 13. Qh5 f6!), I found a simple solution.
13. Qh4 Be7
Again, if 13...Nh5 14. Qxh5! gxh5 15. Rg3+ Kh8 16. Nxf7#; or 13...Kg7 14. Ng4.
14. Ng4 and wins a piece, since now if 14...Nh5 15. Qxh5 gxh5 16. Nh6#, and other knight moves allow 15. Qxh7#.
|Oct-18-12|| ||Jambow: Ok about twenty seconds to see Qh5 started a mating net and taking only allowed another one. This was Tuesdayish for me but sometimes Mondays are like Thursdays too so who knows.|
|Oct-18-12|| ||TheBish: Darn! I saw 13. Ng4! but didn't look far enough after 13...gxh5, but I suspected there was something there.|
|Oct-18-12|| ||Abdel Irada: <al wazir>: <(But maybe it wasn't there when I started typing.)>|
Yes. That does happen here with some frequency.
Of course, thanks to the length of some of my posts, it probably happens to me more than to most people. Quite often, I start work on the puzzle a few minutes after it's posted, when there are only one or two solution posts up (that would be Phony Benoni and maybe one other solver), but by the time I go through all the lines and click "Kibitz!" there are ten more solutions posted.
|Oct-18-12|| ||kevinatcausa: Thursdays are usually beyond me. So today when I saw Qh5 and how white could win following gxh5, I felt a few nagging doubts.|
"Surely, it couldn't be this easy, could it? I should think longer on this."
So I made my plans. I carefully checked ...h6 and ...Kg7, before, satisfied, I clicked on the game and saw black's resignation after my first move.
Then I read the comments, and realized I missed the whole point of the puzzle with ...Nf6. Bah!
|Oct-18-12|| ||LoveThatJoker: <12. Qh5 Nf6> (12...gxh5 13. Rg3+ Kh8 14. Nxf7#) <13. Qh6> 1-0|
A) 13...Nh5 14. Qxh5 f6 15. Nxg6 hxg6 16. Qh8+ Kf7 17. Rh7+ Ke8 18. Rxc7 Rxh8 19. Rxc8+ as the R on h8 is hanging.
B) 13...Re8 14. Ng4
C) 13...Be7 14. Ng4
|Oct-19-12|| ||LoveThatJoker: I see as per the above kibitzes that 13. Ng4 was best. 0.60 out of 1 for this puzzle.|
|Oct-19-12|| ||C4gambit: 12.Qh5 Nf6 13.Ng4 gxQ 14.NxN+ Kh8
(A) 15.Ne8+ f6 16.NxQ BxN black seems ok.
(B) 15.Rxh5 h3 (i) 16.Rxh3+ Kg7 17. Ng4+ f6 black seems ok (ii) 16.Ne8+ Kh7 again i can't find it for white ...
|Oct-19-12|| ||kevin86: I missed it-I actually looked at Rxh7,but it leads nowhere.|
|Dec-18-12|| ||Abdel Irada: <al wazir: OK, I'll bite.>|
That's it. Someone call animal control.
|Jan-08-14|| ||mcgee: As pointed out before, the pity is that this game is only original in that Black chooses to resign! |
|Jan-08-14|| ||mcgee: Can someone please upload Bellon v Pfleger, Olot 1972 as above please? :)|
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