< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 5 OF 6 ·
|Jun-10-12|| ||morfishine: <sevenseaman> I'm sorry to report you are mistaken. Your problem is indeed taken from game 5 from the 1972 match. Fischer played Black in a Nimzo. It is Black to move (27).|
Below is game 12, a QGD, which is quite good I might add:
Fischer vs Spassky, 1972
|Jun-10-12|| ||dufferps: I keep posting prematurely.
Maybe 25.Bb2 IS a good move for Terpugov. I now see:
and, now, Black has no immediate safe check moves; he must build an attack.
30. ... Nb4 or 30. ... Rb1 or something else?
I think ... RB1 is Black's strongest choice, eventually using his advanced c-pawn to win the game.
25.Bb2 doesn't save the game for White, but it does avoid the quick checkmate, and opens up a lot of possible variations.
|Jun-10-12|| ||Marmot PFL: I am thinking of 23...Rxg1+ to take out a defender and make room for the other rook 24 Kxb1 Rb8+ 25 Ka1 c3 followed by Qb4 threatening mate on b1 (or b2 if the Bc1 moves). If 26 Bd2 however I was planning Nd4 so as not to block the file but this seems to fail to Bd3 and black will get back only some material. So Nb4! was the key move.|
|Jun-10-12|| ||Patriot: Black is up a pawn for a piece.
There are so many candidates and too many permutations. None of them seem to hit upon a winning sequence. It would be nice to get the a1-h8 diagonal open but nothing seems to work. I looked at 23...Nxe5 24.Rxe5 Qxf2 25.Qxf2 Bxe5+ 26.Rd4 as one idea.
How about 23...Rxb1+ 24.Kxb1 Rb8+ 25.Ka1 Nxe5 26.Rxe5 Qb4? That is devastating. 27.Qa3? Bxe5+ 28.c3 Bxc3+ 29.Bb2 Bxb2+ . This isn't completely forced, however. 26.Bb2 is also possible or 26.c3. So I'm thinking 23...Nxe5 is the first move. If black plays 24.Rxe5, then we transpose into the line above.
I spent way too much time on this and I'm still not positive.
|Jun-10-12|| ||Marmot PFL: Although when black regains material 26 Bd2 Nd4 27 Bd3 cd2 he now threatens Qc3+ so I think this line also wins for black, though less attractively than Petrosian's.|
|Jun-10-12|| ||Patriot: Missed it. In my line above, <23...Rxb1+ 24.Kxb1 Rb8+ 25.Ka1 Nxe5 26.Rxe5 Qb4> white plays 27.Ba3 instead and wins.|
This was very tough. It took Houdini 40 seconds (18-ply) to find 23...Rxb1+ and evaluate it as winning. I considered that line right up to 25...c3 but didn't see the win.
Oh well...I tried!
|Jun-10-12|| ||agb2002: Black has a bishop and a pawn for the bishop pair.
The knight controls two important squares a3 and c3 which might be used to block the a-file and the a1-h8 diagonal respectively. Since the rook on a8 is idle we can consider 23... Rxb1+ 24.Kxb1 Rb8+ 25.Ka1 (25.Bb2 Qb4 forces 26.Qb3) 25... c3 (25... Qb4 26.Ba3 and Rb1):
A) 26.Ba3(e3,f4) Qxa3 27.Rb1 Rb2 - +.
B) 26.Qf4 d4 renews the threat Qb4.
C) 26.Re3 Qb4 27.Ba3 Qxa3 28.Rb1 (28.Rxc3 Qxb2#) 28... Rb2 - +.
|Jun-10-12|| ||Tiggler: <morfishine: <Tiggler> On your comment <Earlier posters (in 2004) also offered 22. Qe3 as a possibly winning improvement for W> Yes, but after <22...Qb4> white is lost>|
<Patzer2 Dec 8-2004> gives: <22...Qb4 23. a3 Qa5 24. Qd2 Qb6 25. Qd4 Qxd4 26. Rxd4 Nc6 27. Rdd1 Nxe5 28. Ka2 Nf3 29. Re3 Nd4 30. Rd2 Nf5 31. Rh3>. Said he was using Fritz 8.
Looks OK to me.
|Jun-10-12|| ||sevenseaman: Thanks <morfishine > & <Timetraveller>. Both of you and CT who too concur with you that it is game 5 are perhaps right.|
I got the link to the game that contains my position (27...Bxa4) via a <CG> home page search. There the game is numbered as #12. and Fischer plays black. You click this link in my earlier comment that I gleaned from Game 12, you'll get this position. Hence my innocent assertion.
This is an obvious anomaly that I have no explanation for.
Many thanks for your sporting help.
|Jun-11-12|| ||gawain: I did not fully appreciate this finish until I played it out on computer and looked at how Petrosian would have won after different tries by White, such as 26 Qf4|
|Jun-11-12|| ||gars: I did not solve it, of course, but moves 23 and 24 are quite obvious. The "Petrosian Twist" begins at 25) c3 and goes on until move 27) Qc4. I could not see why "white's position is fubar" as <gofer> says but I am a very weak player. What amuses me is that Petrosian plays this game seeking the initiative as soon as possible, which does not seem typical of him, as far as I can say. A beautiful game!|
|Jun-11-12|| ||gars: Raymond Keene comments on this game on page 15 of his book "Petrosian versus the Elite". He states that on move 12 White's position is already becoming critical.|
|Jul-29-12|| ||An Englishman: Good Evening: Funny how Black's development is superior after 12 moves with only one piece in play. I don't like 5.h3 because the Queen feels out of play on f3; Karpov would have played 5.Be2 and 6.0-0 first because he liked that versus the Pirc, and would have provided a smoother development here. I also believe that 10.0-0-0 is a "??" move. Despite the bad 8.g4 advance, White is still safer on the King side.|
|Jul-29-12|| ||andrewjsacks: Wonderful little-known game!|
|Jul-29-12|| ||Snehalshekatkar: Brilliant!!|
|Jul-29-12|| ||Travis Bickle: Even though I though 0-0-0 was a bad idea for white, what a devastating attack by Petrosian that ends with a Queen sac offer!|
|Jul-29-12|| ||gars: I quote <Phony Benoni>'s question on June 10th: "Why do I have the feeling Petrosian would have been good at Fischer Random?" The answer is simple: Fischer Random is pure Chess without any of the opening theory mumbo jumbo and Petrosian was a superb player. That's all, folks!|
|Jul-29-12|| ||SuperPatzer77: I love Tigran Petrosian because he was deaf himself. So am I. :-)|
Cheers to the roarin' Tigran Petrosian!!!
He sure could give any grandmasters a big headache if he were alive today.
|Jul-29-12|| ||lemaire90: Spectacular !|
|Jul-29-12|| ||Riverbeast: 27...Qc4 is the type of move that should be played with pinky finger raised...|
|Jul-29-12|| ||WannaBe: Tigran was deaf?! I never knew that!|
|Jul-29-12|| ||jackpawn: Petrosian wore hearing aids so he wasn't totally deaf.|
|Jul-29-12|| ||PhilFeeley: <WannaBe> You've been around here for how long and you didn't know that? Strange the details we miss.|
I don't get the "Spartak" reference. Anyone?
|Jul-29-12|| ||jackpawn: Petrosian, especially during this timeframe, was just a ton! D@mn, this game is impressive!|
|Jul-30-12|| ||SuperPatzer77: <WannaBe: Tigran was deaf?! I never knew that! >
<WannaBe> Take a look at the website link - |
Read the story under the subtopic "Deafness"
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