< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 3 OF 3 ·
|Jun-20-13|| ||scormus: <Jim> I know you can be trusted to find an interesting alternative for B. I did wonder about 17 ... Rxd8 but I thought W would be in control after 18 Qe2, though I didn't check closely to see if there was a hidden resource for B. I suppose if B had seen the #ing sequence he'd wouldnt have played 17 ... Nxb2|
|Jun-20-13|| ||gofer: It looks like black has just played Nd6-c4 in the vain hope for
some counter-play, but black has mis-calculated. Because white
can happily give up his Queen!
<17 Rxd8 ...>
White's queen is immune, so black must find something else to take.
17 ... Nxb2
18 Rxf8+ Kxf8+
19 Nxh7+ Kg8
20 Re8+ Kxh7
<17 ... Rxd8>
<18 Qe2 Nd6>
<19 h5 ...>
Errr. It's not all over, but she's stood up.
|Jun-20-13|| ||mistreaver: Thursday. White to play. Medium? 17.?
I kinda like:
my first idea was to try getting the knight at h6 to mate
18 Nh6 mate
Time to check.
Whoops, as <LoveThatJoker> pointed out, 17... Qxh4 .
|Jun-20-13|| ||whiteshark: <17. Rxd8!> Prost!|
|Jun-20-13|| ||SamAtoms1980: Agh. I just could not shake the notion of 17.Nxf7. This could almost be a spoiler. Might even be easier to find over the board, because after the simple 17.Rxd8, the recapture with 17....Nxb2 is virtually forced, and then White walks home with 18.Rxf8+ Kxf8 19.Nxh7+ Kg8 20.Re8+.|
|Jun-20-13|| ||zb2cr: This one is quite simple. 17. Rxd8, Nxb2. (If 17. ... Rxd8 or 17. ... Nxd8, 18. Qe2!). 18. Rxf8+, Kxf8; 19. Nxh7+,
Kg8; 20. Re8+, Kxh7; 21. Rh8#.|
|Jun-20-13|| ||Sho: Got it--what irony! I expected the solution to NOT be Rxd8 but played it anyway: at my (really) low level trading queens often ends with a resignation (usually my opponent's) shortly after. From 18. ... on is easy enough. Too funny.|
|Jun-20-13|| ||paulalbert: Didn't think this was too challenging for Thursday. Visualized the typical R and B mate possibility and was able to calculate the piece exchange sequence without much difficulty, the Nxh7ch idea then being the key to get the black K back to g8 from f8.|
|Jun-20-13|| ||JalapenoBuck: White knew what was coming ever since 16. Qb2...this is what separates good players from me. I would have wanted to protect my c4 Bishop with something like Qb3.|
|Jun-20-13|| ||MostlyWatch: I almost got it, but I looked in my wife's eyes and got distracted.|
|Jun-20-13|| ||Dr. Funkenstein: Still not sure on this one after looking at it for too long… My flag fell on this one.|
17. Rxd8 Nxb2 (else the white queen moves and although material is roughly equal, white would have the attack with more active pieces, 17. …Rxd8 18. Qb3) 18. Rxf8+ Kxf8 19. Nxh7+Kg8 20. Nf6+ Kg7 (Kf8 21. Re8+) 21. Re8 pinning the bishop and threatening 22. Rg8+ Kh6 23. Bd2+ and if 21. Re8 Kh6 22. g4 Nd3+ 23. Kd2 threatening g5+
Time to check…
|Jun-20-13|| ||Dr. Funkenstein: .... missed the simple mate with Re8+
I'm surprised like others that black didn't go in for Nxd8 or Rxd8 and then Nd6....
|Jun-20-13|| ||kevin86: A funny mate.|
|Jun-20-13|| ||Jimfromprovidence: Last night I did not how to accurately proceed after 17 Rxd8 Rxd8 18 Qb3 Nd6.
click for larger view
Generally, the idea is to move the bishop to b2 or a1 and then play Qc3 to set up a major threat along the a1-h8 diagonal supported by the rook’s control of the e file. But that uses two tempi.
One good thing is that black’s d knight cannot move because of the threat Qxf7#. Another is that black’s f pawn is pinned.
So it’s reasonable to think that after 19 Bb2 black should play 19…Rf8, then if 20 Qc3, then 20…f6.
That’s when I could not get any further.
Rybka freeware however, finds after 19 Bb2 Rf8, the amazing 20 Nxf7!
click for larger view
To me, it’s definitely a weekend puzzle to see why this move works, so I’ll just leave it like that.
|Jun-20-13|| ||jvasea1990: 17... Nxb2 - error.
( Houdini 3 Pro w32 #4 (depth 19) 18.Rxf8+ Kxf8 19.Nxh7+ Kg8 20.Re8+ Kxh7 21.Rh8#)
( -5.35 (depth 19) 18.Rxc8 Nd3+ 19.Kd2 Nxe1 20.Rxa8 Rxa8 21.Kxe1 Re8+ 22.Kd2 h6 23.Nf3 Re4 24.Bb2 Ra4 25.a3 Na5 26.Kc3 Nc4 27.Bc1 Kg7 28.Kb3 b5 29.g3 f6 30.Nd2 Ne5 31.Nb1 Rc4 32.Be3)
( -5.55 (depth 19) 18.Rd2 Nc4 19.Rdd1 Bf5 20.f3 Rad8 21.g4 Rd3 22.Rxd3 Bxd3 23.h5 h6 24.Ne4 Bxe4 25.Rxe4 Nd6 26.Re1 Nb5 27.Ba1 Nb4 28.Re2 Nd5 29.Kc2 c5 30.Kb3 Nd4+ 31.Bxd4 cxd4 32.Rd2)
( -5.75 (depth 18) 18.Nxh7 Rxd8 19.Nf6+ Kg7 20.Kxb2 Kh6 21.g4 g5 22.hxg5+ Kxg5 23.Re4 Kh6 24.f4 b6 25.a3 Ba6 26.f5 Rd3 27.Ne8 Rc8 28.Bg7+ Kh7 29.Bc3 Rf3 30.Nf6+ Kh6 31.Nd5 Bd3)
|Jun-20-13|| ||jancotianno: Nice and forcing. :)|
|Jun-20-13|| ||James D Flynn: White has sacrificed a piece and 2 pawns to get an advantage inn development, he must therefore act decisively to realize that advantage before Black completes his deveopmenty.
17.Rxd8 Nxb2( if Rxd8 18.Qe2 Nd6 (if Be6 19.Nxe6 Re8 20.Nxc7Rxe2 21.Rxe2 Rc8 22.Rde1 f5 Re823.Rx8 )19.Qf3 f5 20.Qb3+ )18.Rxf8+ Kxf8 19.Nxh7+ Kg8 20.Re8+ Kxh7 21.Rh8#|
|Jun-20-13|| ||Patriot: White is down a piece for 2 pawns.
17.Rxd8 Nxb2 (only reasonable move) 18.Rxf8+ Kxf8 19.Nxh7+ Kg8 20.Re8+ Kxh7 21.Rh8#
|Jun-20-13|| ||Patriot: I guess I over-evaluated the material for white and thought 17...Nxb2 was the only try. After 17...Rxd8, white has a queen for a knight, rook, and two pawns which leaves black with slightly more material (at that point). So that's not really enough to completely vindicate 17.Rxd8. But it could easily be white's only try to get back in the game, or else remain behind. Sometimes it is better though to simply hold on when slightly down in material. So it's probably best to analyze it further.|
|Jun-20-13|| ||Ratt Boy: <bravado1: Is this really a combination? At least on the 17th move? White does not sacrifice anything, but only forces the exchange of queens.>|
Yeah, it is a combination, because after 17.♖xd8, ♘xb2, White is still down a piece and two pawnsâ€”so he'd better git crackin' on a solution quick-like, or Black cleans up. The sham sac of the ♘ on Move 20 is an integral part of the whole conception; after it all, White is down two pieces, with nothing to show for it except the scalp of a ♔.
|Jun-20-13|| ||tivrfoa: In my calculation I played 20. Nf6+, but I think it doesn't work, because: 20. ..Kg7 21. Re8 Ne5! (22. Bxe5 Nd3+)
So 20. Re8!! is the move.|
|Jun-20-13|| ||BishopofBlunder: This puzzle proves the adage that there is no such thing as a free Bishop.|
|Jun-20-13|| ||BlackSheep: 16.Qb2 sets up the trap and Black just hops right on in .|
|Jun-20-13|| ||Knight Stalker: That was'nt just difficult, that was insane!|
|Jun-20-13|| ||BOSTER: After 17.Rxd8 Rxd8 18.Qb3 Nd6 19. Bb2 Rf8 20.Nxf7!
<Jim> <Why this move works>.
The threat is discovered check with mate Nh6#.
So, 20...Nxf7 21.Qc3 Nfe5 22.Rxe5 Nxe5 23.Qxe5
if...Kf7 24.Qg7+ Ke8 25.Ba3 Rf7 26. Qg8+ Kd7.
27.Qxf7 and white win
20...Rxf7 21.Qc3 with mate.
20...Re8 21.Nxd6+ Kf8 22.Qf7#.
20...h5 21.Ng5+ Nf7 22.Nxf7 Kh7 23.Ng5+ Kh6. 24.Qc3 and white win.
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