< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 2 OF 2 ·
|Nov-26-04|| ||AdrianP: <chessgames.com> <crafty> Crafty doesn't understand these sort of positions. Thinks an extra pawn is +1. |
|Nov-26-04|| ||chessgames.com: <black has Re3 after e7 as f4 covers the bishop> That's what I was overlooking. |
|Nov-26-04|| ||Spassky69: Doesn't f4+ draw easily? |
|Nov-26-04|| ||AdrianP: Nothing here, so far as me and Pocket Fritz 2 can see. V. well played by Moro despite a shaky opening. Gazza will be furious he don't put Moro away for his impudence. |
|Nov-26-04|| ||Spassky69: <44..f4+ 45.Bxf4 Kf6> No Kf5 draws much more quickly. Shredder - 44. f4+ 45.Bxf4 Kf5 46.Bb8
Kxe6 47.Rc7 Rxa3 48.Bxa7 Ra2 49.Bxb6 1/2-1/2
Although white wins a pawn, any human knows that's a book draw.
|Nov-26-04|| ||Spassky69: < f4+ 45.Bxf4 Kf6> Oh sorry acirce. Thought you were referring to after Rc3. I was wrong, my bad! |
|Nov-26-04|| ||TIMER: Maybe Rg7 now. |
|Nov-26-04|| ||Spassky69: Dead Draw now. Rc7?, the computers didn't like this one, although they know nothing about endgames. |
|Nov-26-04|| ||Spassky69: White can win the bishop yet I don't know if it can still stop the black passed pawns after Shredder gives
Kxe6 47.Rxg7 Rxa3 48.Bb8 Bd7 49.Rh7 Ra5 50.Kh2 b5 51.Rh6+ Ke7 52.Bd6+
Kd8 53.g4 Be8 54.g5 Ra2+ 55.Kg3 a5 56.g6 b4 57.g7 Bf7 58.Be5 a4 59.Rh8+
Ke7 60.g8=Q Bxg8 61.Rxg8 b3 62.Rb8 Ke6 63.f4. He shifts his evaluation sometimes from 0.20+ to 0.80+ keeps shifting. |
|Nov-26-04|| ||tpstar: <chessgames.com> Thanks for showing us the game! Do you plan any more live broadcasts for the Russian Championship? |
|Nov-26-04|| ||chessgames.com: <Do you plan any more live broadcasts for the Russian Championship?> We probably will, but nothing certain at this time. |
|Nov-26-04|| ||Minor Piece Activity: Was this really a draw all the way? It seems to me that there should have been a way to convert that extra pawn. How about 32. Rd8!? Plan to force the rooks off (it seems letting Moro's rook onto the 2nd rank gave him compensation) and maybe try for zugzwang. Maybe After Rxd8 Bxd8, white can attempt a slow death with h4 and f4? |
|Nov-26-04|| ||Minor Piece Activity: Anything wrong with 40. Rd4 Bxb5 41. Bb4+? Seems like an interesting way of returning the pawn in order to lock the rook away for most of the endgame. |
|Nov-26-04|| ||Minor Piece Activity: No one wants to join me in finding out if Kaspy missed a win? |
|Nov-26-04|| ||acirce: I'm pretty tired right now and going to bed soon, but I would say there are probably much better chances to find important improvements before the endgame. Say already somewhere around move 20 or so. |
|Nov-26-04|| ||Minor Piece Activity: Yes, but in that case, I'm sure we'd find improvements to keep Moro from losing a pawn in the first place and probably just analyze to a draw anyway. My original question was whether Kaspy can convert the pawn. |
On the opening + middlegame, I'm guessing 5...Be6?! and 25...c4 were bad ideas?
|Nov-26-04|| ||aw1988: After 40. Rd4 Bxb5 41. Bb4+ black has 41...Ke6. If 42. Kf4 there follows 42...a5 43. Bc3 Rc4 (43...Rxd4? 44. Bxd4 and if 44...Bf1 white plays 45. Bxb6, and after Bxg2 46. a4! (Bxa5 also works) 46...Bf1 47. Bxa5 and with many strong points (king breakthrough on the kingside to g5 after black k moves, Bb6 and a5, a reserve tempo f3-f4 and a potential mining square d4) white should win easily) 44. Ba1 Ba6 (44...Be8?? 45. Rxc4. OUCH.) 45. Kg5 Rxd4 46. Bxd4 and white wins- here are a few sample variations: 46...b5 47. Kxh5 f4 (desperation- if 47...Bb7 there is still 48. Kg6.) 48. Kg6; 46...a4 47. Kxh5 (47. Kg6?! f4 48. Kg5 (48. Kxh5? Kf5 49. e6 Bf1 (a 'rapid' ending!) 50. e7! Bxg2! 51. Bxg7 (if he queens: 51. e8=Q?? there is 51...Bxf3#! OUCH!) 51...Bxf3+ 52. Kh6 and I know i said 'white wins' but this actually looks quite drawish.. 52...Bc6 53. h5 b5! 54. Bd4 Be8! 55. Kg7 Bxh5 56. Kf8 f3 is actually lost for white!|
Of course, I do not claim this to be an exhaustive analysis of the position, nor do I doubt an improvement can be found somewhere. But this kind of position, with so many threats, is extremely hard to defend.
|Nov-26-04|| ||Minor Piece Activity: Wow, thanks, it's kind of hard to see what is your general conclusion though. =D I'll go take a look. |
|Nov-26-04|| ||Ron: <Minor Piece Activity>
I have hardly studied this game but in response to your suggested line 32. Rd8 Rxd8 33. Bxd8 it seems to me that on general principles Black can hold for although White is a pawn up we have bishops of opposite colors.
I might get back to this game. |
|Nov-26-04|| ||Minor Piece Activity: Ron, it probably does draw because of such a simplified position, yet I can't help but feel there should be a zugzwang somewhere facilitated by the extra pawn. 32. Rd8 Rxd8 33. Bxd8 Bd7 34. h4 Ke6 35. Bc7 Bc6 36. Kg1 maybe and now try to infiltrate on f4 and g5 with the king? |
|Nov-26-04|| ||Minor Piece Activity: Then again, 32. Rd8 can be met with 32...Rc3 instead which looks good. I guess Kaspy's h4 was the best. |
|Nov-26-04|| ||Minor Piece Activity: Hey aw, how does 40. Rd4 Bxb5 41. Bb4+ Ke6 42. Kf4 a5 43. Bc3 Rxa3 (...Rxd4? Bxd4 a4 Bxb6 and now after g3 should be 1-0 when white king infiltrates) 44. Rd6+ Ke7 45. Rxb6 Bf1 (...Rxc3? Rxb5 a4 Ra3 Kxf5 1-0) 46. Bb2 Rd3 47. Rb7+ Kf8 48. e6 Bxg2+ 49. Rf7+ Ke8 49. Rxg7 Rxf3+ 50. Ke5 look to you? Looks good for white and more or less forced. I used a few ideas from your line. I'm sure there is an easier/quicker way to win the endgame though. |
|Nov-27-04|| ||aw1988: I'll look at it tomorrow- it's kinda late. |
|Nov-27-04|| ||aw1988: <Minor Piece Activity> In that case, white has a clear win; I try to use plausible looking lines, not some random gibber the computer spits out... just to see the various attacking possibilities: If black tries to attack from behind with Re3+ white simply plays 51. Kf6. White is now threatening to capture the bishop and give mate (Rg8#), so black it seems can only postpone losing by sacrificing the rook: Rxe6+ Kxe6 and... I would rather be white. :)|
If Kf8 white still plays Kf6 and white now has an immediate mate: Rb3 Bd4 with the threat of Bc5+ Ke8 Rg8#.
If f4 there is Rg8+ Ke7 Bd4 Rc3 (desperation) Bxc3 Bh3 Rg7+ Ke8 Kd6 Bxe6 Re7+ Kd8 Rxe6 Kc8 Kc6 Kb8 Re8+ Ka7 Bd4+ Ka6 Ra8#
All lines pretty much amount to gloomy depressing losing for black.
|Oct-11-06|| ||positionalgenius: A very nice game,hasn't been kibitzed on since live coverage in 2004!|
< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 2 OF 2 ·