< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 3 OF 3 ·
|Oct-03-07|| ||logo: I solved this one faster than the one yesterday which i solved faster than the one on Monday...Strange week.|
|Oct-03-07|| ||patzer2: For me the most interesting aspect of this game is the tactical threat made with 17...Rd5. White (2500 player) saw the threat a move ahead, but Black (2300 player) did not see it. If so, Black would have seen that he had good practical chances to hold the position with 18. Qe2 .|
|Oct-03-07|| ||gawain: Sweet. I saw the solution right away, having recently re-played several games with the theme of a pinned f pawn.|
|Oct-03-07|| ||YouRang: Ach - missed it. I saw that one black bishop pinned the f2 pawn while the other had dangerous control over the light squares around the white king. I saw the potential of putting a rook on the h-file with mate at h1, and (I'm embarrassed to say) I even considered 18...Qxg3+. |
I just couldn't believe (and worse, didn't take the time to check) that white was helpless against the R & B mate after 19. hxg3. Grrr.
|Oct-03-07|| ||kevin86: I answered this one in a heartbeat! With the pawn welded to f2 because of the pin,white's king has no escape from a mate on h1. There is no way to stop the mate after the quiet,but lerhal,♖h4. |
This game is a rare case of a quiet move AFTER the queen sac.
|Oct-03-07|| ||playground player: I hate it when I miss an easy one like this! Bet I would've solved it if you'd put it up on Monday. Then at least I would've known to make a Queen sac.|
|Oct-03-07|| ||cu8sfan: OK, what's wrong with my thought process. It went like this:|
1. The f2-pawn is pinned to the king.
2. Qxg3 somehow comes to mind because of this pin (and of course, this being a puzzle and all...)
3. The bishop on c6 bears strongly down on the king.
4. A possible, actually the only, continuation after Qxg3 might be Rh5.
5. Does this look dangerous to White? One rook against his pawns, rooks and queen? I don't think so, he'll find a way to free himself of my threats.
I think this is me being too lazy to calculate lines...
|Oct-03-07|| ||YouRang: <cu8sfan> <I think this is me being too lazy to calculate lines...> I see I wasn't alone. :-/|
|Oct-03-07|| ||Aurora: 18...Qxg3+ 19.hxg3 Rh5 is crushing.|
|Oct-03-07|| ||yalie: Is there anyway we can get a list of all the Monday puzzles at cg.com?|
|Oct-03-07|| ||WannaBe: <yalie> Well, the answer is yes, but you have to be premium member to access the 'tactics' archive, where all the previous puzzles are stored.|
|Oct-03-07|| ||WannaBe: Slight correction to my previous post, about 60 puzzles are stored in the tactics archive, not 'all'.|
Apologies on my error.
|Oct-03-07|| ||al wazir: <patzer2> and <An Englishman>: Thanks. I wasn't expecting a serious answer, but I got two of them.|
So if you had played 18...Qxg3 in the puzzle position it would have been a sham- or pseudo sacrifice, whereas if I had played it it would have been a true sacrifice.
|Oct-03-07|| ||YouRang: <al wazir> Lol. It's one reason why I prefer to just call it a "sacrifice", rather than qualifying it as "sham" (or "pseudo").|
This is particularly true regarding games being played by other people, since the "sham" qualifier depends on how clearly the player calculated the subsequent line -- which is in fact unknown.
What if I *think* I've calculated it, but there's a flaw I didn't see (a "flawed sham")? And maybe my opponent didn't see it either (a "double flawed sham".
Or, the case you referred to, where you weren't able to calculate it out when you made the sacrifice, but things worked out well anyway ("a delayed sham"). :-)
|Oct-03-07|| ||ellhares: easy puzzle iam sure the all had solevd but if u wana know ur leve according to these puzzle u must look at the time u solved if u did it in 10 second or less so u might be 2000 rating if u did it in 10 to 30 then u r 1900 to 1700 if u solved it in more than 30 second so u r less than 1700!!|
|Oct-03-07|| ||Ragh: 17.Bd3?? White just lets Black's LSB take complete control of the already weakened light squares on the a8-h1 long diagonal. May be Qe1 was better here to avoid the quick mate.|
|Oct-03-07|| ||MostlyAverageJoe: <ellhares> What is the evidence for your ELO estimates?|
I found the solution rather quickly (definitely under 30seconds), and my ELO is definitely below 1700.
BTW, please make use of the keyboard to post your messages in English, not in instant-messagease. Personally, I find the abbreviations like "u r" instead of "you are" rather childish and disrespectful to others.
|Oct-03-07|| ||fm avari viraf: It is aptly said so that all the combinations lie concealed over the board but one must have an X-ray eye to see it. Here, everything looks fine for a moment for White but suddenly with the Queen sac on g3 sends the King to perdition!|
|Oct-03-07|| ||yalie: thanks WannaBe|
|Oct-03-07|| ||SuperPatzer77: <TheaN - 18....Qxg3+!! 19.hxg3 (Kh1 Rg5+! 20.f3 Bxf3+ 21.Rxf3 Qxf3+ 22.Qg2 Qxg2#) Rh5! with Rh1# to follow (23.Bxh7 Kxh7 24.Qh6/d8+ etc Rh1#).>
If 19. hxg3 Rh5!, 20. Bxh7+ Rxh7, 21. Qd8+ Rxd8 or 21. Qh6 Rxh6 and 22...Rh1# is awfully inevitable. Therefore, White has no defense against Black's threatening mate - Rh1. |
<Murphyman - 19.Kh1 is met by 20...Rxd3++ and #>. I completely agree with Patzer2 - If 19.Kh1 Qf3+, 20. Kg1 Rg5+!, 21. Qxg5 (forced) Qh1# - <Piece of cake, right, Patzer2?>
|Oct-03-07|| ||zahbaz: How long would white last if he played 18. Rfe1?
As for the puzzle, I wish I could say I got it. For a good few minutes, I was staring at white trying to figure out what the hell the point of the puzzle was haha. When I kicked the stupid out of me, I considered black's Q sac, yet thought white could counter the rook...
|Oct-03-07|| ||YouRang: <zahbaz: How long would white last if he played 18. Rfe1? >|
Well, this would shoot down the queen sac:
18...Qxg3+?? 19. hxg3 Rh5 20. Be4! <blocking the bishop's control of g2 & h1>
Black has a number of "okay" choices after 18. Rfe1, but none are clearly winning. I'd probably go with 18...Rh5 just to maintain pressure.
|Oct-03-07|| ||TrueBlue: Here is a cute line:
19. Kh1 Rg5+
20. f3 Bxf3+ 21. Rxf3 Qxf3+ 22. Qg2 Qxg2#
and MAJ, I don't believe for a second you are bellow 1800 :)
|Oct-03-07|| ||ForeverYoung: Three for three this week so far. I noticed the cute boogie woogie line 19 Kh1 Qf3+! 20 Kg1 Rg5+! 21 Qxg5 Qh1 mate.|
|Oct-04-07|| ||TheaN: <patzer2: <TheaN> your 19. Kh1 Rg5+! does indeed force a pretty mate. However after 19. Kh1, a shorter mate is <carelessfill>'s 19...Qf3+ 20. Kg1 Rg5+ 21. Qxg5 Qh1#.>|
Of course. A basic theme: occupy the square which has potential defence. IMO the diversion of the Queen is prettier than the forced breakthrough XD, but that's me. At least I would've won by force, only took me two more moves.
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