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Veselin Topalov vs Vladimir Kramnik
"A Knight's Tale" (game of the day Jan-24-08)
Corus (2008)  ·  Semi-Slav Defense: Anti-Moscow Gambit (D44)  ·  1-0
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Given 25 times; par: 64 [what's this?]

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sac: 12.Nxf7 PGN: download | view Help: general | java-troubleshooting

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Veselin Topalov vs Vladimir Kramnik (2008)
photograph courtesy of "LostEmperor"

Kibitzer's Corner
< Earlier Kibitzing  · PAGE 29 OF 35 ·  Later Kibitzing>
Jan-24-08  Hot Logic: I have strong doubts that the Queen's Gambit will be shot, seeing that Heath Ledger is currently 0-1 against the Grim Reaper.
Jan-24-08  CapablancaFan: <Hot Logic: I have strong doubts that the Queen's Gambit will be shot, seeing that Heath Ledger is currently 0-1 against the Grim Reaper.> Wow! Can you be any colder??
Jan-24-08
Premium Chessgames Member
  JointheArmy: My mom told me the same thing today when she heard it on TV. I shook my head and knew that Ledger was no where near grandmaster strength.

Did some checking since obviously no Heath Ledger would show under the USCF, but what I did find kinda scared me.

Heath Ledger's real name or alternative name is Andrew Ledger. I looked on FIDE.com and found an Andrew Ledger rated 2427 FIDE very close to Grandmaster.

It says he was junior state champion at 10 years old. Unfortunately it doesn't say whether it was from Australia or the U.S.

<MTV: I hear you play a lot of chess in Washington Square Park.

Heath Ledger: Yeah. I’ve played since I was a kid. I play at least one game a day.

MTV: That’s dedication.

Ledger: Yeah, or obsession.

MTV: Smoking and chess?

Ledger: Yeah, they go hand in hand.>

http://paulhoffman.wordpress.com/20...

Sadly I did more digging and found what I think is the truth. Ledger is a strong club player, but nothing more.

<Ledger played in chess tournaments as a child in Australia, but it has to be a tremendous exaggeration to describe him as close-to-grandmaster strength. The exaggeration would perhaps be excusable if it weren’t coming from the screenwriter who is turning one of the all-time great chess novels into a film. And the idea of the actor’s getting a grandmaster rating before filming can only be described as fantasy, albeit a delightful one, which fellow chess obsessives can appreciate.

At the other extreme is People.com, which undoubtedly understated Ledger’s chess prowess by portraying him as a mere woodpusher. People quotes a Greenwich Village dog walker who’d watch the insomniac Ledger play chess at 6:30 A.M at the celebrated stone tables in Washington Square Park: “He didn’t seem to be such a good chess player but I’m not sure ….”>

http://paulhoffman.wordpress.com/20...

Jan-24-08  ruyfanatic: Excellent game.
Jan-25-08  znprdx: <mack: & Jack Kerouac:> "ev'rything's been returned which was owed"

Jan-25-08  UdayanOwen: Not sure how discussion forum for the 'knights tale' game between Topalov and Kramnik got so long and off track....

But on the subject of that game...

Wow....

Jan-25-08
Premium Chessgames Member
  brankat: This what I posted a couple of hours after Topalov-Kramnik game in response to a kibitzer's comment:

" <Herby Rawley> <..no hint of 12. Nf7!! will that now become the standard move are things hopeless after 11....Bg7?? This is easily as good as Kasparov's 16 Sicilian against Karpov. The Opening Explorer was a real boon in finding this out.. If 11....Bg7 deserves ??. And now every one knows it chess is one move closer to being solved Topalov deserves..>

Although Topalov played a very exciting game, and certainly surprised Kramnik, Your enthusiasm may be somewhat premature, and the "conclusion" too far reaching.

1. In due time analysis will show whether <12. Nxf7> is really correct/sound. Remember N.Short's remark about Opening novelties: "They are like condoms. You use them only once". So, it remains to be seen. For now, my feeling is, Kramnink got caught by surprise. But now the move is known, and the search for a refutation has already begun.

2. If the move stands, then the variation will be avoided by Black, until the answer is found, which, eventually, is almost always the case.

3. Either way, the whole thing certainly has nothing to do with "solving Chess"." ______________________________________________________- ____

In a way it's probably not surprising that a master of a Ljubojevic's type would offer a response to Topalov's (Chepa's) novelty. The kind of a position that emerged after <12. Nxf7> has always been Ljubo's forte. Glad to see he has not lost his magic touch :-)

Jan-25-08
Premium Chessgames Member
  nimh: I analysed the position after 18.Rad1 with Rybka, and found that it is entirely sound.
Jan-25-08  Hot Logic: I've had enough of all these Kramnik vs Topalov fan battles. I propose that from now on fans of each player need to identify themselves with a coloured ribbon tied around the upper left arm; Green for Topalov and Blue for Kramnik.

Whenever two or more supporters of each side meet each other at a chess club or tournament they should then agree to settle their differences like gentleman - with switchblades outside the hall - the first to draw blood being the winner.

All fanmail concerning this idea may be posted on my private Kibitzing forum.

Jan-25-08
Premium Chessgames Member
  tamar: Great pic <lostemperor> It looks like a mushroom cloud is ascending from the chessboard!
Jan-25-08  walker: About Cheparinov's and other's novelties ...from Mr. Kean's tread:

<Shams:> GM Keene, a question has come up (after the Topalov-Kramnik game) about novelties. Are seconds allowed to play these moves in their own games? If not, does this injunction ever expire? What about in a case like that of Kasparov, where he has retired leaving many novelties unplayed? Some of us are quite curious and I wonder if you might shed some light on this. Thanks much.

< ray keene:> its a matter of common sense really-if a second is still working with a player he shd never use any tn they have elaborated together unless the player specifically says so.i recall after baguio 1978 korchnoi said that all openings novelties we had worked on were now fair game and michael stean won a strong event in 1979 using many of our team ideas. if player and second break up acrimoniously i wd say that the second can play anything he likes, especially if the idea was found by the second in the first place.

Jan-25-08
Premium Chessgames Member
  Hesam7: Regarding novelties and seconds, chessvibes did an interview with van Wely during Mexico and they asked him what his arrangement with Kramnik was. He explained that there are two types of novelties: the ones discovered by Kramnik and given to him to be checked and the ones that he has found during their mutual preparation. He said he could not use the first type but he regards the second as his intellectual property and after Mexico he will use them.

It seems that Cheparinov and Topalov have a similar arrangement, since in the video Topalov remarks that "although Ivan could have played this himself ..."

Jan-25-08
Premium Chessgames Member
  Hesam7: <<herby rawley>: yesterday's position after 11...Bg7 had occurred 33 times and some of the world's best had it from both sides Kramnik,Anand,Radjabov,Dreev et.al among them which means 100s maybe 1000s of good players annotated, commented , analysed that position and no hint of 12. Nf7!! will that now become the standard move are things hopeless after 11....Bg7?? This is easily as good as Kasparov's 16 Sicilian against Karpov. The Opening Explorer was a real boon in finding this out.. If 11....Bg7 deserves ??. And now every one knows it chess is one move closer to being solved Topalov deserves credit for that...this game will be in lots of anthologies>

Yes this novelty might get refuted like Kasparov's was so soon afterwards. And the fact that Topalov waited for an important game to unleash it also points towards this. I mean if this changes the evaluation of the whole line why not play it earlier?? You would preserve your weapon only if you knew you had only one shot.

Jan-26-08  percyblakeney: <Yes this novelty might get refuted like Kasparov's was so soon afterwards. And the fact that Topalov waited for an important game to unleash it also points towards this. I mean if this changes the evaluation of the whole line why not play it earlier??>

I think there would be a point in preserving the novelty in any case. If Topalov played it in an unimportant game and it turned out to be winning it would be surprising if Kramnik played into a line that was proved to be losing for him.

Jan-26-08
Premium Chessgames Member
  Eyal: <Al Gore must be alarmed by the global warming implications of all the laptops in Wijk aan Zee overheating as they grind this line into dust.> (http://www.chessninja.com/dailydirt...)
Jan-26-08  Larsker: <Al Gore> is a fine example of a thinking American.

Of course, there are others like .... like .... well... as I said, Al Gore is a fine example.

Jan-26-08  m1ch4lek: <PeerGynt: Why are nick names such as <KamikazeAttack> allowed at ChessGames.com?

KamikazeAttack was the name of the Japanese unit launching the Kamikaze Attacks on the US ships.>

Kamikaze pilot is hero for Japanese people. He was a soldier, and he was destroying a military target.

<It is like using a nick name "SuicidalBomber", "Al-QaidaFighter" or "SS Division 'Dead Head'">

It isn`t. Al-Quaida and SS have killed a lot of civilians. There is difference between soldier and terrorist.

Q: The nick name: Lion isn`t bad? Lions kill humans... PeerGynt: Why are nick names such as <Lion> allowed at ChessGames.com??

Jan-26-08  AdrianP: There was a letter to the latest NIC Yearbook, referring to this game:

Bosboom,M (2440) - Maenhout,T (2302) [D43]
NED-chT 0708 Netherlands (1), 15.09.2007

1.d4 d5 2.Nf3 Nf6 3.c4 c6 4.Nc3 e6 5.Bg5 h6 6.Bh4 dxc4 7.e4 g5 8.Bg3 b5 9.h4 g4 10.Ne5 h5 11.Be2 Bb7 12.0-0 Nbd7 13.Nxf7 Kxf7 14.f3 Ke8 15.e5 Nd5 16.Nxd5 cxd5 17.fxg4 hxg4 18.Bxg4 Qb6 19.Bh3 Kd8 20.a4 b4 21.a5 Qc6 22.Qg4 Kc7 23.a6 Bc8 24.Rf7 Bh6 25.Re7 c3 26.Rxe6 Qc4 27.bxc3 Qxc3 28.Rf1 Rf8 29.Rff6 Be3+ 30.Kh2 Qc1 31.Rc6+ Qxc6 32.Rxc6+ Kxc6 33.Qe6+ Kc7 34.Qd6+ 1-0

Where 13 Nxf7 had a very similar idea. Probably Cheparinov's Nxf7 had become 'use it or lose it'.

Jan-26-08  KamikazeAttack: <Q: The nick name: Lion isn`t bad? Lions kill humans... PeerGynt: Why are nick names such as <Lion> allowed at ChessGames.com?? >

Lol.

Jan-30-08  Civhai: I had a question since a long time ago and now, that we are discussing about novelties, it is maybe the right moment: Do you know something about the Karpov gambit (11. Ng5)? Is it still playable or is there a refutation? If it is playable: Do you know where I can find out more about it?
Jan-30-08  walker: <Civhai> check this tread:

Kasparov vs Shirov, 2001

Jan-30-08  Civhai: thanks a lot, walker
Jan-30-08  Abejorral: I have always loved knight sacrifices, this game is awesome, Topalov played unpredictable moves most of the time.
Jan-30-08  jhoro: Kramnik's take on <12.Kxf7>

<12.Kxf7 is an absolute nonsense... Such nonsense, that I seriously didn't even look at it>

http://www.sport-express.ru/art.sht...

Jan-30-08  ttr2121: Who should get the credit for this? Topalov for sitting down at the board and moving the pieces around? Cheparinov for figuring out all the moves? Or Daniliev sic) for making Topalov review the analysis before the game? Hmmmmmm....
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