< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 9 OF 9 ·
|Jul-06-09|| ||Mateo: <Open Defence: it could be that both Kramnik and Jakovenko did miss h5.. its possible> Maybe but there was no reason to take the draw at this stage.|
|Jul-06-09|| ||Absentee: Disgraceful.|
|Jul-06-09|| ||DEEPERGRAY: Does anyone have a final eval of the position via chess engine?|
|Jul-06-09|| ||whiteshark: The other 19-mover so far was Carlsen vs Kramnik, 2009|
The average number of moves from Kramnik's five games is <24>.
|Jul-06-09|| ||DEEPERGRAY: I thought kramnik had black pieces
A draw is reasonably accepted by kramnik (drawnik)
|Jul-06-09|| ||hedgeh0g: To be fair on Kramnik, he is one of only three players to have a win so far in this tournament.|
|Jul-06-09|| ||percyblakeney: <Does anyone have a final eval of the position via chess engine?>|
It's "only" -0.48 according to Rybka 3, even if that is rather much for Rybka, and considering that Jakovenko was 15 minutes up he definitely could have played on here.
|Jul-06-09|| ||acirce: Kramnik hasn't showed a lot in this tournament apart from what I guess is good preparation, at least with Black. But it is still enough for shared lead.. (I think Carlsen is going to win today though.)|
|Jul-06-09|| ||TommyC: An advert for the Sofia Rule!|
|Jul-06-09|| ||yalie: <acirce: Of course people blame Kramnik when his opponent accepts a draw in a better position. What else is new? :-)>|
sad irony that the "best player" in the world with the white pieces is in trouble after just 19 moves. :)
i guess now that Kramnik has a win with black pieces, this tournament can be considered a success for him. He does not even need to show up and play anymore:)
|Jul-06-09|| ||percyblakeney: Shipov complained quite a bit about Jakovenko accepting the draw offer if the Google translation says what it seems to say:|
<Escalation in the black are strong advantage. Of course, some risk in this was. But victory is not without risk. Vain, Dima. Nothing! Champion heights with the peace-loving approach can not be achieved. On this sad note, I - Grandmaster Sergey Shipov - and the story concludes. Our joint mission was interrupted by an artificial and is clearly premature>
|Jul-06-09|| ||MrQuinn: It is such a good feeling to know that Kramnik, pale approximation of a competitor that he is, no longer has his mud hooks in the world title. He is just pathetic. He takes his pay, but he doesn't play. There isn't an ounce of fight in him. One clearly sees now what a fluke his victory over Kasparov was. And I thought it would be so good for chess at the time, new blood and all that. What a washout he is. Sad, sad, sad.|
|Jul-06-09|| ||Ulhumbrus: I can think of one possible good reason why they agreed to a draw. Either player thought that he would risk losing if he were to attempt to win the game from the position after 19 Qf5.|
|Jul-06-09|| ||samikd: < Of course people blame Kramnik when his opponent accepts a draw in a better position> |
So you admit that its Kramnik who offers the draw ? :)
<The average number of moves from Kramnik's five games is <24>.>
And yet people keep talking about the 15 movers ! How unfair !!
|Jul-06-09|| ||acirce: Well I assume Kramnik offered the draw since he made the last move. Obviously doesn't matter for the point I was making though.|
|Jul-06-09|| ||Absentee: <MrQuinn: One clearly sees now what a fluke his victory over Kasparov was.>|
|Jul-06-09|| ||parisattack: <Ulhumbrus: I can think of one possible good reason why they agreed to a draw. Either player thought that he would risk losing if he were to attempt to win the game from the position after 19 Qf5.>|
In the Good Old Days GMs thought about their chances of winning.
Perhaps we need a new scoring system: +1 for a win, 0 for a loss and -1 for a draw.
Or, organizers should invite the top 6/8/10 players out of the top 10/15/20 based on lowest draw percentage over their past 10 tournaments.
|Jul-06-09|| ||whatthefat: It is peculiar that Jakovenko took the draw here.|
|Jul-06-09|| ||Check It Out: I left to work at 15...Qc7 thinking this game looked very interesting and it's a draw four moves later??|
|Jul-07-09|| ||kurtrichards: The position can hardly be considered drawish. Hmmmm.... What about another round of space invaders?|
|Jul-07-09|| ||SatelliteDan: <acirce: Of course people blame Kramnik when his opponent accepts a draw in a better position. What else is new?> Is there a unspoken rule that says you can except a draw as long as you don't offer it in GM play?|
|Jul-07-09|| ||Ulhumbrus: If Black plays ...c5, White may obtain a dangerous attack by d5 followed by e4 and placing his N on f5. On the other hand if Black doesn't play ...c5, how is he going to make use of his extra pawn?|
It could be that Kramnik did not find a way to regain the pawn, while Jakovenko did not find a way to make use of it.
It could be that Kramnik thought that he might lose if he attempted to gain compensation for the pawn by attacking Black's King before Black played ...c5, and Jakovenko thought that he might lose if he attempted to play ...c5 and invited d5.
|Jul-07-09|| ||dexterious: What a shameful way for Kramnick to participate in one of the premier tournments. The guy really should not be invited at all in these tournaments. So much play left in this game.|
|Jul-07-09|| ||AgentRgent: <dexterious: What a shameful way for [Kramnik] to participate in one of the premier [tournaments]. The guy really should not be invited at all in these tournaments. So much play left in this game.> Feel free not to invite him to YOUR tournaments.|
|Jul-08-09|| ||Ulhumbrus: After 19...c5 here is one way for Black to win and one way for Black to lose.|
On 19...c5 20 d5 Re7!( keeping control of the square e5) 21 ab ab 22 e4 Ne5! ( offering exchanges without delay) 23 Ne3 Nxf3+! ( simplification, to reduce the number of pieces available to the attack) 24 Rxf3 Bc8! Now the bishop watches the square f5 against the move Nf5 and the White Q is short of squares eg 24 Qh5 allows 24...Rxe4.
On 19...c5 20 d5 Re7 21 ab ab 22 Qh5 Ne5 23 Nxh6+ gxh6 24 Qxh6 f6 25 Be4 Qb6 26 Rf4 Rg7 27 Raf1 Nd7 28 Rh4 Qd6 29 Qh5 Qe5 30 Bh7+ Kh8 31 Bf5+ Kg8 32 Be6+ Rff7 33 Qh8 is mate.
Perhaps both players found it difficult to decide whether White would gain sufficient attack or not.
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