< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 23 OF 25 ·
|Nov-05-09|| ||Matt Tsjakk: <Deepergray>: That was a weird mood you were in there. But Stan Lee made me laugh :)|
|Nov-05-09|| ||b3wins: Great fight! After the exchange of queens it seemed that both players played for a win for a long time, until the exchange sacrifice (following the over-ambitious 45.Kf6) made Carlsen realize he needs to struggle for the draw. Many interesting variations to check in this game:|
What would happen on 44. Rh6+ winning the ‘a’ pawn? During the game chessok.com gave the line 44…Kd5 45. Rxa6 b4 46. Ra5+ Ke6 47. Be5 c3 48. Rd1 (brave!) Rd3 49. Rxd3 Bxd3 50. bxc3 bxc3 51. Bf4 where white has the advantage, but probably not enough to win.
Another interesting line at chessok was black’s last chance to gain winning chances – 51… Ke5 52. R3c5+ Kd4 53. Rxb5 Rg2+ 54. Kh4 Rg4+ 55. Kh3 Rg8 with evaluation of -1.04. How would the game continue, then? 56. Rbc5, and now black cannot play 56… Bg2+ 57. Kh2! or 56… Rh8 57. Rxc2 Rxh5+ 58. Kg3 Rg5+ 59. Kh4 Rg4+ 60. Kh3 Bxc2 61. Rxc2 - white rook goes to the ‘a’ file, giving checks from the side and draws; so black’s winning chances are with 56… Rxc8 57. Rxc8 f4 58. h6 Ke3! (Kd3? 59. Rxc2! Kxc2 60. h7 Bxh7 61. Kg4=) 59. Rc3+ Kd2 and black seems to win here, actually. The king protects the ‘f’ pawn from the white king, and the white rook cannot leave the ‘c’ file. So white should probably play 56. Rc7, but at first sight black’s plan of f4, Ke3 looks very strong.
Any comments on these lines?
♘ow I see that Eyal picked on that line as well, but it seems to me right now that 56. ♖bc5 is losing – see above
|Nov-05-09|| ||17.Bxg7: Well, the big conclusion after this round is that Kramnik is now tied for first, while rating favorite Carlsen is tied for last.|
|Nov-05-09|| ||b3wins: One addition to the last variation I just posted which does not change the result:
59. Kg4 f3 60. Rc3+ Ke2|
|Nov-05-09|| ||Eyal: <b3wins: Another interesting line at chessok was black’s last chance to gain winning chances – 51… Ke5 52. R3c5+ Kd4 53. Rxb5 Rg2+ 54. Kh4 Rg4+ 55. Kh3 Rg8 with evaluation of -1.04. How would the game continue, then? 56. Rbc5 [...] black’s winning chances are with 56… Rxc8 57. Rxc8 f4 58. h6 Ke3! (Kd3? 59. Rxc2! Kxc2 60. h7 Bxh7 61. Kg4=) 59. Rc3+ Kd2 and black seems to win here, actually. The king protects the ‘f’ pawn from the white king, and the white rook cannot leave the ‘c’ file.>|
Instead of 58.h6, <Kg4>! seems to save White in this line - Black can't maintain the f-pawn after 58...Ke3 59.Rc3+ Kd2 (or 59...Bd3 60.h6) 60.Rxc2+!
|Nov-05-09|| ||TylerD: Good game, indeed. Very entertaining from start to finish. A reminder of how beautiful and strong chess Kramnik can play at his best. Players like Gelfand, Leko and Ponomariov will have a tough time handling Kramnik in this tournament... If he doesn t slip against Moro or Anand he might end up the tournament winner... If so he will have won two supertournaments in a row... Imagine him doing that - and then topping it all with a London win in December... We will all look funny, having spent the year talking only about Carlsen, Aronian and Topalov...|
|Nov-05-09|| ||Eyal: Commentary by Shipov on move 19:
<19 ... Qxd2 + gentle, humane course. Now I do not have to call the society to protect children complaining of ill-Kramnik!
[Much more dangerous, though, for both sides:
19...Qa6! Then bad for white 20.dxc5 Bxg2 21.Rg1 Bf3 and I do not see a decent impact protection d5-d4.]
[Apparently, Carlsen would have to find the liberating impact
19...Qa6 20.f3! gxf3 21.gxf3 Bxf3 22.Rg1 and then white king goes to f2, connecting the rooks, and thereby supporting life on Mars. Still imengo in Queens black could hope to increase their advantage. The fact is that in positions with multi-colored matte elephant attacks are particularly strong. A number of pawns often gives the safety factor of kings. And just the presence of queens in this regard is essential strengths.]> (http://translate.google.com/transla...)
|Nov-05-09|| ||Natalia Pogonina: A very interesting game indeed. Kramnik could have posed more problems for White, but we're all humans, after all...|
|Nov-05-09|| ||meth0dSNK: carlsen could have won he played it wrong, mayb b/c he didnt have enough time|
|Nov-05-09|| ||meth0dSNK: p.s im better than all the players in that tournament.. ownd.|
|Nov-05-09|| ||Jack Bauer: I'm gonna need a hacksaw.|
|Nov-05-09|| ||I Like Fish: hello...
it looks complicated...
|Nov-05-09|| ||ounos: Note that if he hadn't played 33. fxe4 immediately but had put the intermediate 33. h5! Bf5, then that pawn would be a square closer to queening - something which would change the nature of the subsequent complications.|
|Nov-05-09|| ||KamikazeAttack: <Note that if he hadn't played 33. fxe4 immediately but had put the intermediate 33. h5! Bf5,>|
What makes u think Bf5 would be the reply to 33.h5?
|Nov-05-09|| ||HeMateMe: I've never liked this variation for white. bringing out the Queen early often loses tempi, and that happened here.|
Didn't Kramnik throw away winning chances with the swap of queens? White has an uncastled position, behind in development.
|Nov-05-09|| ||Eyal: <ounos: Note that if he hadn't played 33. fxe4 immediately but had put the intermediate 33. h5! Bf5, then that pawn would be a square closer to queening - something which would change the nature of the subsequent complications.>|
But Black is not losing his h-pawn here, and moreover he can take White's h-pawn; the point is rather that after 33...Bxh5 34.Rxe4, or 33...Bf5 34.Re3 with a doubling of rooks on the e-file, White gets a strong initiative.
|Nov-05-09|| ||Travis Bickle: <meth0dSNK: p.s im better than all the players in that tournament.. ownd.>
SHUT UP! You PUNK!!|
|Nov-05-09|| ||shintaro go: This is a sign of good things to come from Vlad.|
|Nov-05-09|| ||b3wins: <Eyal: Instead of 58.h6, <Kg4>! seems to save White in this line - Black can't maintain the f-pawn after 58...Ke3 59.Rc3+ Kd2 (or 59...Bd3 60.h6) 60.Rxc2+!> You are right. I now tried also 57... Ke3 (instead of 57... f4) but white finds a miracle save in all lines:
58. Rc3+ Kd2 59. Rc7 f4 (Ke3 60. Rc3+; 59... Ke2 60. Kg3) 60. Kg4 f3 61. Rxc2+! (only move, on h6 or Kg3 comes Ke2 and protects the pawn) Kxc2 62. Kg3 Kd3 63. Kf2 with h6-h7, and the black king is one tempo short of either protecting the 'f' pawn or catching white's 'h' pawn. |
58. Rc3+ Ke2 59. Kg3
58. Rc3+ Kf2 59. h6 f4 60. Kg4 f3 61. h7! Bxh7 62. Rxf3+ Ke2 63. Rc3 Is that what Rybka meant by eval. -1.04? Usually that means black should win. Any improvements for black anyone? (either here or in my previous post)
|Nov-05-09|| ||Eyal: <b3wins> A -1 evaluation, especially in endgames, doesn't mean a completely clear win - just a "big advantage". I've encountered many cases where Rybka (or other engines) gave exaggerated evaluations in essentially drawn endgames - Leko-Carlsen from the recent Pearl Springs was a good example; it's also possible that Rybka simply didn't reach deep enough in the plies to correctly assess all these lines. Btw, I've tried some alternatives in earlier stages of this line, but they still don't seem to work for Black - e.g., 55...Rg1 (instead of Rg8) 56.Rbc5 Rh1+ 57.Kg3 Rxh5 58.Rxc2 Bxc2 59.Rxc2 with a drawn rook endgame.|
|Nov-05-09|| ||b3wins: Eyal: Commentary by Shipov
Thanks for the link. Shipov is by far my favorite of all online commentators. Deep, unbiased, pleasant, respectful to the players with understanding of the human qualities that make a chess fight, and most important of all - is not a slave of computers!!! (really the only one out there in that regard.) His analyses of the Nalchik GP which appeared in translation at ChessBase where wonderful. It's a pity his writings are not translated more often.
|Nov-05-09|| ||LaFreak III: now i know why this is a draw..
|Nov-05-09|| ||Jim Bartle: 17.Bxg7: "Well, the big conclusion after this round is that Kramnik is now tied for first, while rating favorite Carlsen is tied for last."|
Made me laugh.
|Nov-05-09|| ||Eyal: Shipov can also be hilariously funny sometimes, especially in the automatic Google/Babel Fish translations... As for respect to the players and understanding of human qualities, I remember a wonderful comment that he made at a late stage of the Carlsen-Karjakin game from Corus this year:|
<Unbelievable but true - the fight broke out with renewed vigor. I was literally falling from the chair, there are no forces to comment on this nervous and difficult fight. But I will do so out of solidarity with the players - after all, it is harder for them than for me...> (http://translate.google.com/transla...)
|Nov-05-09|| ||dejavu: I think carlsen was surprised to see Kramnik out of his usual self, out gunning and daring with brilliant and valiant moves-he would have preferred a quiet draw but he was forced to fight for survival-and fight he did.Magnus fault was not in his chess technique but rather in his psyche for this game. he had one expectation and was met with avalanche of brilliancy-this is the Kramnik that the fans long wished to watch. nevertheless, it was wonderful to watch the whiz kid pulling out a miracle from his hat.|
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