< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 3 OF 3 ·
|Nov-25-10|| ||knight knight: 32. Be5 <agb2002: 32... Rxe5 33.Ra1 Qxa1+ 34.Nxa1 Re1+ 35.Kf2 Rxa1> Others have also kibitzed this, I kinda stopped after 34. Nxa1 (seeing only 34...Re1+ 35. Kf2 Bxa1?? 36. Kxe1)|
So 32. Be5 is a losing move, not just one leading to unclear positions.
|Nov-25-10|| ||agb2002: <CHESSTTCAMPS:
C) 33... Rxb3 34.Qxf6+! Kg8 35.Qd8+ Kg7 36.Bd5+ Kf7 37.Qxd7+ Kf8 38.Bd6+ Kg8 39.Qxh7#>
This is far more efficient than my line C.3.
|Nov-25-10|| ||WhiteRook48: i had the first move|
|Nov-25-10|| ||al wazir: <rilkefan: "34. Qxf6+ Kg8" Something like 35.Qd8+ Kg7 36.Qxd7+ and if ...Nf7 then Be5+ leads to mate.>|
So it does, after about six more moves. Thanks. I doubt if Piper analyzed the entire 10-move combination in advance -- but neither did I. I'm still giving myself only half-credit.
|Nov-25-10|| ||Domdaniel: Anyone else curious about that <Event: London Vizayanagram, 1883> ...?|
London is in England. Vizayanagram or Vizayanagaram (విజయనగరo-
) is a city and district in India. Benima was Dutch, and all of his games in this database come from the same event, where Von Bardeleben was the best-known player.
So what *is* the background story? Anyone?
|Nov-25-10|| ||Domdaniel: It means 'City of Victory', if that helps ...|
|Nov-25-10|| ||jahhaj: <Domdaniel> From wikipedia|
The tournament was held in London at the same time as the 1883 London master tournament (won by Johannes Zukertort ahead of Wilhelm Steinitz). David Hooper and Kenneth Whyld, The Oxford Companion to Chess, Oxford University Press (2nd edition 1992), p. 155. ISBN 0-19-866164-9. The minor tournament was called the Vizayanagaram tournament in recognition of a donation of 200 pounds by the Maharajah of Vizayanagaram, which was used to pay the prizes in that tournament. J.I. Minchin (ed.), The Games Played in the London International Chess Tournament 1883, British Chess Magazine (1973 reprint), 1883, p. xiv.
|Nov-25-10|| ||Breunor: I came up with 32 Bf4. Did anyone look at this, does it also win? |
I had 32 Bf4 (threatening B x h6 and then R x f6) and if 32... Re6 33 B x h6 g x h6 33 B f5.
Thanks for any help!
|Nov-25-10|| ||jahhaj: <Breunor> Nice try but 32...Be6 trapping the queen looks a good reply to 32.Bf4|
|Nov-25-10|| ||CHESSTTCAMPS: <<Breunor> Nice try but 32...Be6 trapping the queen looks a good reply to 32.Bf4>|
A good point that I completely missed!
In my analysis (line D), I saw but rejected the game move 34... Bf5 without sufficient consideration. As <David2009> has observed, then it's essential to play the finesse 36.Qg5+! to win. For some reason, I examined this possibility in the D.2 line, but couldn't find the similar idea when I played Crafty (to my cost).
|Nov-25-10|| ||Domdaniel: <jahhaj> Thanks. I suspected it might be something like that but couldn't find the evidence ... in wikipedia?! Sigh.|
|Nov-25-10|| ||SufferingBruin: One more thing (I posted my wrong answer last night): Happy Thanksgiving! I'm bringing a large appetite and a fistful of blood thinners. How about you folk?|
|Nov-25-10|| ||Eduardo Leon: <32.♖xf6>
Demolishing the defensive structure surrounding the black king.
If black could only give a check with his queen or his rook! But, every square in the first rank is covered.
Both 33...♖e7 34.♕xf6+ and 33...♖e6 34.♕xd7 are unacceptable for black.
Otherwise, 35.♕xf6+ wins the knight.
<35.♕xf6+ ♔g8 36.♕g5+>
It might seem like 36.♗xf5 wins a piece, but then 36...♘xf5.
Not 36...♔g8 37.♕xh6, winning two pieces instead of one.
<37.♗xg6 hxg6 38.♕xg6+>
After 39.♕xh6+, white can give a series of checks in order to bring his queen to c3, protecting both the knight and the b4 pawn. For example: 38...♔f8 39.♕xh6+ ♔g8 (39...♔e7 40.♕e3+ and 41.♕c3) 40.♕g6+, followed by 41.♕f6+ and 42.♕c3.
|Nov-25-10|| ||wals: No joy again. Thought 32.Bh4 was the way to go, but it was a no way move.|
depth: 17 : 6 min :
(+1.26):9...f5. Best, dxc4, +0.47.
depth: 20 : 7 min :
(=0.31):10.c5. Best, cxd5, +1.26.
depth: 20 : 6 min :
(=0.29):16...c6. Best, Bd7, =-0.23.
depth: 19 : 6 min :
(-3.24):28.Bc2. Best, Nc2, =-0.33.
depth: 19 : 3 min :
(=0.00):28...Qe3+. Best, Be3, -3.24.
depth: 17 : 3 min :
(+3.36):31...Re3. Best, Qb2, -0.19.
depth: 18 : 3 min :
(+4.30):33...Rxg3. Best, Nf5, +3.41.
depth: 20 : 8 min :
(+#7):37...Qxb3. Best, hxg6, +4.81.
Black resigned after 38.Bc2+.
1. (#7): 38.Bc2+ Kf8 39.Bxb3 Ke8 40.Qe5+ Kf8 41.Qc7 b5 42.cxb6 Ke8 43.b7 Kf8 44.b8Q#
|Nov-26-10|| ||LIFE Master AJ: <BTW theres medical evidence that continuing to use the brain greatly slows down the deterioration, and even stimulate reformation after something like a stroke. Mind you, I'm not sure its helping me :-\>|
If it makes you feel any better, I had a period of about 2-3 years when it seemed I was getting worse, not better. (I was constantly stumped in these puzzles.)
|Nov-26-10|| ||LIFE Master AJ: By stumped, I mean that when I INITIALLY looked at some of the tougher puzzles, I had no clue of what to do.|
|Nov-26-10|| ||LIFE Master AJ: Things are much better the 3-6 months. Most of the time, I look at the puzzle and ideas simply pour through my head. |
Very gratifying to see all that hard work finally pay off.
|Nov-26-10|| ||Breunor: Thanks jahaj, that really helps!|
|Nov-28-10|| ||LIFE Master AJ: I have one of those "red books" on this tournament ... they did mention a side event, (this one); but I don't think they gave any games.|
|Nov-28-10|| ||LIFE Master AJ: For any real historical bloodhounds, I would be curious to know the ORIGINAL source of these games ... and which source CB used. (They could be different.) |
I had a friend who went to a college in Germany. They paid large groups of students to input games into the (then new) database ...
it was done in a terrible sloppy manner, I personally have documented hundreds of mistakes in the ChessBase (games) database.
I am NOT saying that this gamescore is wrong, just that I would feel better if we could check against some source ... ... ...
|Nov-28-10|| ||Phony Benoni: <Life Master AJ> I no longer have a copy of the 1973 BCM reprint of the tournament book (which <jahhaj> mentioned above), but I seem to recall it mentioned that a section of games from the Vizayanagaram tournament that were published in the original book had been omitted from the reprint.|
Perhaps someone who does have either book could confirm this.
|Nov-28-10|| ||Phony Benoni: <Life Master AJ> After a little digging, I found a review of the original tournament book which stated that it contained 52 games from the Vizayanagram tournament. That was probably the source of most of the games in our database.|
|Nov-29-10|| ||LIFE Master AJ: <Phony Benoni> Good research. A friend also sent me an e-mail. (He said the same thing that you did, apparently, the original book contained all the games of the "Viz" side-event.) |
Good work. Thanks.
|Nov-29-10|| ||Phony Benoni: <LIFE Master AJ> Thanks for the compliment. I just want to clarify that the London 1883 tournament book did not contain all the games from the "Viz" side-event. This was a 26-player round robin, and a total of 324 games were played. Indeed, the editor of the tournament book (James Innes Minchin) complained that the games were not properly recorded, and hence unavailable. (See Game Collection: London 1883 Vizayanagaram Tournament).|
|Nov-29-10|| ||LIFE Master AJ: OK. (I am missing something somewhere along the way.)|
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