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Later Kibitzing> |
Mar-26-11
 | | offramp: How did Feller get into the top 100 - that is the problem! |
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Mar-26-11
| | offramp: Actually, the combination started by 19...Nc2 is really original! |
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Mar-26-11
| | offramp: Howell Feller played. |
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Apr-02-11
 | | An Englishman: Good Evening: Rather a fine article on this in the Guardian. http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/201... Let that be your lesson--never sent the text "Hurry up, send moves" during your games. |
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| May-13-12 | | vinidivici: Here's the news.......judge yourself guys
39th Chess Olympiad
In October 2010, Feller scored 6/9 (+5 =2 -2)[4] during the 39th Chess Olympiad and won the Gold medal for best individual performance on board 5. However, the French Chess Federation accused Feller, along with French players GM Arnaud Hauchard and IM Cyril Marzolo,[5] of cheating during the Olympiad. While Feller was in the playing hall, Marzolo was in France where he checked the best moves on the computer. Marzolo then allegedly sent the move in coded pairs of numbers by SMS to Hauchard. Once Hauchard had the suggested move, he would position himself in the hall behind one of the other players’ tables in a predefined coded system, where each table represented a move to play. The French Chess Federation claims, in all, 200 text messages were sent during the tournament. The scam was supposedly uncovered by Joanna Pomian, the federation's vice-president.[6] |
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| May-09-21 | | Messiah: 'Howell a FellerBird Plays'
(obviously plagiarized from <offramp> - thanks!) |
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| Dec-01-24 | | goodevans: A fascinating incident of which I was hitherto unaware. I thought at first the pun was somewhat lacklustre until I noticed the engine at the heart of the controversy. That certainly elevates it hugely. |
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Dec-01-24
 | | Teyss: I remember this incident, it made the news in France. 19...Nc2 is difficult to spot because one has to see the whole combination and eventually figure how to win with Q vs R+2Bs thanks to the central Ps. Cheating is foul, but you have to give credit to the three culprits for their creativity notably how Hauchard indicated the moves to Feller just by standing behind the boards:
"- The opponent of Vachier-Lagrave was A and 1
- The opponent of Fressinet was B and 2
- The opponent of Tkachiev C and 3
- The opponent Feller D and 4
- Feller himself was E and 5
- Tkachiev was F and 6
- Fressinet was G and 7
- Finally Vachier-Lagrave was H and 8"
Very handy there are four boards in an Olympiad so that times two it matches the notation! The first stand was for the letter, the second for the number. "Incidentally it is usually sufficient to signal the destination square – a 2600+ (or even much weaker) player is easily able to determine which piece should be moved there." https://en.chessbase.com/post/frenc... Also let's give credit to the rest of the French team (MVL, Fressinet) and the French Chess Federation for bringing this forward instead of hushing it up. |
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Dec-01-24
| | offramp: The pun <"Foul Play"> is based on the firebird chess program and the firebird called the Baltimore oriole. The oriole is a type of fowl bird, kept in battery cages. They lay tiny blue eggs that are used to make small omelettes. The Baltimore oriole is a passerine. It is therefore a passer, like the d-pawn here:
click for larger view |
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| Dec-01-24 | | stone free or die: Something a little "off" in <offramp>'s post. |
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| Dec-01-24 | | Damenlaeuferbauer: I don't understand, that chessgames.com publishes a game as "game of the day", where the winner was obviously cheating. Even a game between two very beginners with blunders like dropping pieces on nearly every move etc. is much more worth than this - because they are thinking independently with their own brains! Sebastien Feller isn't a grandmaster of chess, but just a poor guy. |
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| Dec-01-24 | | stone free or die: <Damenlaeuferbauer> well, <CG> has always cared more about getting a good pun in, than having a great game.
<Missy> (aka <MissScarlett>) selects the puns, and maybe hit a foul ball? Or should that be - laid an egg? |
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| Dec-01-24 | | goodevans: <stone free or die>, <Damenlaeuferbauer> The zenith is when we have a great game as GOTD but I’ll happily settle for an interesting game as second best even if the interest is in what happens off the board rather than on it. This game has that and a good pun too, which I consider to be a bonus. I’d ask anyone thinking of submitting a poor game, like one with <with blunders like dropping pieces on nearly every move>, to kindly reconsider even if the pun is brilliant. |
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Dec-01-24
| | Teyss: Hi Damenlaeuferbauer & stone free or die,
I second <goodevans> on this one, the historical aspect of the game is sometimes worth a GOTD as long as we're aware of it, in this case through posts. The scandal was relatively important because it involved a team captain and was quite new: honestly, who would think about codes by just standing behind boards? There's creativity here. Additionally the game is interesting, making abstraction of the context of course: just assume it's a human against a cyborg. |
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| Dec-01-24 | | stone free or die: Lest people get the wrong idea, despite my occasional criticism of <Missy> I think s/he's mostly doing a crackjack job selecting the GotD. (I still think that <CG> has no qualms picking a sub-standard quality game for the sake of getting a good pun in, a tendency long predating <Missy> yeoman work) * * * * *
Now, since we're talking about this game, did FIDE reject it for rating purposes? Given the cheating objection, pretty much confirmed by the French team's confession, I assume that's the case. Then should <CG> provide some kind of notice to the casual user who pulls up the game? I'm thinking that such a user might not read through all the comments, and so never notice the controversy surrounding the game. . |
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Dec-01-24
| | Teyss: <stone free or die: Something a little "off" in <offramp>'s post.> There's a typo in your post: you forgot a "s" at the end. |
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Dec-01-24
 | | Williebob: <offramp: The pun.. is based on the firebird chess program and the firebird called the Baltimore oriole..>
That is a suspiciously deep combination you made there, <offramp>.. |
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| Dec-01-24 | | stone free or die: Teyss - ha! |
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Dec-01-24
| | Teyss: Hi stone free or die,
We posted at the same time. Considering the pun, would say the punster was well aware of the context. Don't exactly know what you mean with "did FIDE reject [the game] for rating purposes?" The Olympiad was over when the whole affair was judged but TBH didn't have time to look what retroactive decisions FIDE could take. |
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| Dec-01-24 | | stone free or die: <Teyss> - the "ha" was for the missing "s". And yes, of course <Missy> was well aware, and not shy of "stirring the pot", as usual! * * * * *
RE: the game itself.
Now, if a player is up against a computer, and loses both the game and rating points, well, I think that's a little much. FIDE generally annuls cheating games I believe, for rating purposes. I also think it forfeits the game. I was using FIDE's decision to avoid any question about the cheating - so that we can say the game was a cheat as a fact. It was a shorthand qualifier to save me from researching the sorry affair. My main point (that is, if I have one) is that <CG> should have a red banner or something to point out games that are cheats. (There should be a PGN tag, as well, to avoid a program using the game for statistics or even opening explorer, etc.) |
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Dec-01-24
| | Teyss: Hi stone free or die,
I see what you mean now with "Then should <CG> provide some kind of notice to the casual user who pulls up the game?" I thought you meant the punster, sorry for the confusion. Good point about the flag or the tag. The main question is where do we draw the line?
* What if the cheating is suspected but not clearly proven?
* Should we also flag pre-arranged draws like the (in)famous horse dance between Dubov and Nepo? How about when it's not certain? Surely this is not insuperable for instance with orange and red flags. I would still keep the games for stat purposes including opening explorer though, because it's difficult to say how much moves where influenced by cheating and anyhow they already include humans vs computers. |
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| Dec-01-24 | | stone free or die: <Teyss> this is a good discussion for the <Biographer Bistro> I think. But just to finish - I suppose I would only flag games that had official "cheating" status, i.e. relying on FIDE's determination. Otherwise, maybe if there was a clear historical consensus. |
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| Dec-01-24 | | whiteshark: At bottom he is not a bad Feller. |
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Dec-01-24
| | Williebob: Maybe a silly suggestion, but if we were looking for a ready-made idea for how to properly display this game: What about appending "Firebird" to Feller's name for this one? Like we see in consultation games?
Of course that leaves out any indication that the 'consultation' was surreptitious and against the rules of fair play, but I think that the pun also nudges the casual observer toward understanding that something about this game is not on the level. |
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| Dec-02-24 | | stone free or die: <Maybe a silly suggestion, but if we were looking for a ready-made idea for how to properly display this game: What about appending "Firebird" to Feller's name for this one? Like we see in consultation games?> Actually, there's a touch of brilliance here. |
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