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|Mar-08-11|| ||morfishine: <Once>...<I think it depends on what you want to get out of these puzzles...> A most accurate and succinct statement <One really important chess skill - possibly the most important - is spotting the best replies by your opponent> And here, I definitely let my guard down by not considering either 8...0-0 or the better 8...f6. The ironic thing about this game is that while black did find 8...0-0, he too overlooked 8...f6 as a possible defense, probably out of shock.|
|Mar-08-11|| ||gofer: <8 Qxd4 ...>
8 ... Nxd4 9 Nf6+ Kf8 10 Bh6#
8 ... Nxd5 9 Qxh8#
8 ... Rf8 9 Nf6#
8 ... Rg8 9 Nf6+ Kf8 10 Bh6+ Rg7 11 Nxh7+ Ke8 12 Bxg7 black is a rook and pawn down and mate is still threatened! Time to go quietly...
However, we need to remember that any defense is okay as white was a piece down,
so even after 8 Qxd4 material is even. But is there a defense?
<8 ... f6>
Okay so now we have a choice; Qxf6 and Nxf6+
9 Qxf6 Rf8 10 Qg7 d6 and black seems to wriggle free!
<9 Nxf6+ Kf7>
<10 Qf4 d6>
<11 c5 ...>
Okay, black has survived, but at what cost???
click for larger view
The issues are legion;
1) moving Ne7 loses the queen
2) moving Nc6 loses Ne7 to Nd5+
3) Rf8 loses a pawn and the exchange
4) Re8 loses quickly to Nh5+ mating
5) Re1 or O-O-O is coming
6) e4 and Bc4+ are coming
Time to check...
|Mar-08-11|| ||eblunt: <agb2002:) C 8... f6 9.Qxf6 Rg8 (9... Rf8 10.Qg7 with the threat 11.Nf6+) 10.Qf4 with the double threat 11.Nxc7+ and 11.Nf6+.>|
10 ♕f4 ♘xd5 and black can struggle on possibly. 10 ♕f3 is much better.
This is the best play line from both sides IMO. White has regained the piece, and wins rook for knight with the fork on f6 very soon.
|Mar-08-11|| ||zb2cr: 8. Qxd4 recovers White's piece with a terrific attacking setup, since 8, ... Nxd4; 9. Nf6+, Kf8; 10. Bh6#.|
|Mar-08-11|| ||Sharpen Your Tactics: after a quick look. It seems like I settled for less...|
then??? take rook or nh7+
|Mar-08-11|| ||eblunt: <Once : The sternest defence seems to be 8...f6 when this might happen 9. Nxf6+ Kf7 10. Qf4 h6 11. Ng4+ Ke8 12. Nxh6 White has won a couple of pawns but there is no quick mate in sight.>|
Better for white is 8 ... f6 9 ♕xf6 ♖g8 10 ♕f3 and white has regained the piece, but also black can't escape the Knight fork coming on f6 that will win rook for knight for white. With R+P for N white should be comfortable from there.
|Mar-08-11|| ||Once: <eblunt> Yes, I think 9. Qxf6 also wins for white. Fritz finds it hard to choose between that and 9. Nxf6 - both with an eval of around +3.7 to +4. In other words, either move gives white a healthy material advantage by scooping up pawns and/ or winning the exchange. But not a forced mate.|
After five minutes of chewing on it, Fritzie marginally prefers 9. Nxf6+ (+4.04) to 9. Qxf6 (+3.83). But in human mode and as white, I would be happy with either.
|Mar-08-11|| ||Marmot PFL: It had to be blitz (or blindfold) for Karjakin to lose like that.|
|Mar-08-11|| ||ChessNewbie55: got it in 1 sec. ho hum.|
|Mar-08-11|| ||Patriot: 8.Qxd4, without a doubt, seeing that 8...Nxd4 9.Nf6+ Kf8 10.Bh6#. And seeing that moves like 8...f6 (9.Qxf6) or 8...Nxd5 (9.Qxh8#) or 8...h6 (9.Qxh8+ Ng8 10.Qxg8#) fail to refute anything. It's odd that I didn't consider 8...O-O--apparently I didn't know it was an option here. In addition I didn't realize white was down a piece, but there seemed to be no better move than 8.Qxd4 regardless.|
<sofouuk> <hmm. this is tuesday, so presumably we are not intended to work out the totality of your variations. given that white is a whole piece down and otherwise lost, isn't it enough to just say '8. Qxd4 only move with ongoing attack'?>
<Once> explained it well--it depends on what you want to get out of <CG>. Analyzing further helps flex your visualization skills. Another approach, which I think is also very important, is to stop analysis when it becomes unnecessary. That might sound contradictory but it isn't. During a game when your time is diminishing it is very important to stop analyzing as soon as you prove your top candidate move as best. In this position, once you see that 8.Qxd4 is tactically justified and there is no other candidate that is at least as good...you're done! It doesn't hurt to do a "sanity check" before playing the move as long as you have time to do it.
In my opinion, failure to practice this approach can cause you to over-analyze during a game, costing unnecessary time on the clock. Likewise, failure to analyze "in-depth" can make your visualization suffer when it's necessary to analyze deeper. My suggestion is to strike some balance. Practicing some measure of both methods is necessary for improvement.
|Mar-08-11|| ||beenthere240: I'm sure in the game 8.Qxd4 was played without a second of thought -- otherwise 7. Nxd4 makes no sense. No calculation was needed, since black had simply fallen into a trap that's in many books. They probably both had a laugh about this. Perhaps the theme this week is GM blunders in the opening.|
|Mar-08-11|| ||alachabre: Contrary to yesterday, today the solution immeidately leaps off the board. A lesson for me in how best to improve my chess vision!|
8. Bxe7 Nxe7 (other moves obviously drop the queen)
Up a piece already, and the rook and checkmate are threatened.
9. .... Rf8 or even O-O and White is comfortably ahead. Still pondering
8. Nxe7, forecasting disaster on the black squares, but this line is less forcing. Also, any immediate discovered attack by the knight leaves the bishop en prise. Looks harder to hang on to the extra piece in this variation.
OK, peeked at the answer while posting, and while I considered Qxd4, I rejected it because I didn't see the continuation based on the weakness at f6. So it goes. After 8. ... O-O, White can now capitalize on the weakness on the black squares around the king.
|Mar-08-11|| ||KingV93: I'm embarrassed to say that I did not get this one. I didn't look long enough, thinking it was obvious, then compounded that mistake by not working it through completely or correctly. Yeesh. Bad chess thinking. A nice example of why my chess has stunk badly as of late; lack of patience, inaccuracy, incompleteness. wow. I'd better shape up. At least I know what to do.|
|Mar-08-11|| ||TheTamale: Fun puzzle. A little more depth than meets the eye.|
|Mar-08-11|| ||knight knight: Tuesday, white to play, knight down.
8. Qxd4 looks like the move, since if 8...Nxd4 9. Nf6+ Kf8 10. Bh6#. Meanwhile the rook on h8 is threatened. If 8...Rg8 9. Nf6+ Kf8 10. Bh6+ Rg7 11. Nxh7+ Ke8 (11...Kg8 12. Qxg7#) 12. Qxg7 rook ahead and probably mating soon. If 8...Rf8 9. Nf6#.
Black can't defend the rook with any piece. After 8...O-O, white could play 9. Nf6+ Kh8 (9...Kg7?? 10. Ne8/h5++ and 11. Qg7#) 10. Qh4 h5 11. Nxh5 and if 11...gxh5 12. Qxh5+ Kg8 13. Bf6 Ng6 14. Bxd8 Nxh4 15. Bxh4 white is two pawns up.
|Mar-08-11|| ||knight knight: Or play 9. Ng4+ and force checkmate!!|
|Mar-08-11|| ||knight knight: Also missed 8...f6 as a defensive attempt.|
|Mar-08-11|| ||Mariusfj: 8 Sxe7!
A) 8...Sxe7 9 Dxd4
B) 8...h6 9 Sxc6 Dxg5 10 Sxd4
|Mar-08-11|| ||1.e4effort: If you're going to fianchetto you have to commit to being patient, otherwise, what is the point?|
|Mar-08-11|| ||David2009: D Andreikin vs Karjakin, 2010 White 8?|
Can't believe Karjakin fell for this one (8 Qxd4 etc): time to check how this
Blitz explains all. The move before the blunder:
click for larger view
(D Andreikin vs Karjakin, 2010 White 7?) After 7 Nxd4 f6! keeps losses down to one Pawn. AFter 8.Bxf6 Crafty End Game Trainer defends with 8...Bxf6 9.Nxf6+ Kf7 10.Nxc6 Nxc6 11.Nd5 d6 12.g3 Re8 13.Bg2 Ne5 14.b3 c6 15.Nc3 Qa5 16.Qd2 Bh3!?
This would be excellent if White could not castle (the EGT assumes castling is disallowed). After 17.0-0 Bxg2 we reach
click for larger view
(D Andreikin vs Karjakin 2010 variation, 18?) with a further Crafty EGT link
White to play wins (slowly but surely) starting 19 Kxg2. Enjoy finding the win aainst the robot!
For a really stiff challenge, try winning against the EGT from the move 7 position without castling. Link: http://www.chessvideos.tv/endgame-t.... Following the earlier line, I tried 17. Kf1 (instead of 17. 0-0 disallowed) but lost to the robot. Good luck if you try it out!
Postscript: nice analysis by the regulars of the puzzle position itself (raher than one move before as in my effort).
|Mar-08-11|| ||kevin86: Black steps aside from a two move mate by knight and bishop,only to fall into mate by the same forces in reverse order!|
A Monday queen-sac problem on Tuesday.
Hey! I got this one!
|Mar-08-11|| ||Oliveira: Funny to see a GM like Karjakin in the 2750+ elite getting caught into such a known trap.|
All these games ended the same way in the English:
And this one was in the Scotch:
B Blumenfeld vs NN, 1903
Idel Becker, a well-known chess writer in Brazil, also registers a game Hopkins vs NN, London, 1932, which ran identical to Blumenfeld's above.
|Mar-08-11|| ||CHESSTTCAMPS: In this opening position, white is temporarily down a piece, but black's play has left fatal weaknesses on critical dark squares, especially f6. Evidently black has just played 7...Bg7xd4 instead of 7... Nxd4 8.Bxe7 winning the queen. From the puzzle position, white simply plays:|
8.Qxd4! leaving no good defense.
Interesting but weaker is 8.Bxe7? Nxe7 9.Qxd4 O-O! 10.Nf6+ Kh8 (Kg7? 11.Ne8+ Kh6 12.Qh4#) 11.Nxd7+ f6 12.O-O-O Nf5 with counterplay. Of course, keeping the DSB on the board to exploit the weak dark squares makes much more sense.
A) 8... Nxd4? 9.Nf6+ Kg8 10.Bh6# is obvious. So is
B) 8... Rf8? 9.Nf6#
C) 8... Rg8? 9.Nf6+ Kf8 10.Bh6+ Rg7 11.Nxh7+ Ke8 12.Qxg7 wins.
D) 8... O-O 9.Nf6+ Kh8 10.Qh4 h5 11.Nxh5 gxh5 12.Qxh5+ Kg7 13.Qh6+ etc is a familiar winning tactic.
E) 8... f6! 9.Nxf6+ Kf7 10.Qf4 d6 11.Nd5+ Bf5 (Kg7? 12.Bf6+ Kxh7 13.Qh4+ etc) 12.Nf6 with +2P and threat of 13.e4.
More to this one, I think, than first meets the eye. Time to review...
|Mar-08-11|| ||stst: That's the first move I saw, not much Bk can do, nor, as one says, view it as a gym, today's a very light exercise, not much we extract from it.|
Since W's Q-B pair is already in a mating position, W's N cannot be taken either, otherwise QxR mate.
Maybe it's some fun we can muse ourselves--that Karjakin (among the top 10) allowed such a position (blitz though) in such an early stage, and the opponent is not too well-known (doubt if he's in the top 20 / 30 Elo list.)
Guess the editor wishes to give some candies occasionally (it's only Tuesday!)
|Mar-08-11|| ||BOSTER: Reading many comments in this site you can create the image that chess is collection of many simple rules. But if one from the top players in the world lost the game after 8 moves (even in blitz), maybe chess has something more then such "collection".|
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