< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 1 OF 2 ·
|May-12-11|| ||laskersteinitz: This game is an insult to the fans, I'm outraged!|
|May-12-11|| ||tpstar: This game will be used as evidence in favor of a DRR Candidates tournament next time instead of matches. For San Luis 2005 and Mexico City 2007, there were four games each round, so if one fizzled out early we had three others to follow. In these semifinals, a short draw in one bracket only leaves one game remaining for fans and spectators.|
Anyone saying the final position doesn't have any play left has lost it.
|May-12-11|| ||Kinghunt: I see this more as proof that the matches are too short. Grischuk thinks he has a good chance of holding out against Kramnik in his two blacks, so he immediately draws as white to try and force tiebreaks. This strategy wouldn't be viable with longer matches.|
|May-12-11|| ||Ezzy: <laskersteinitz: This game is an insult to the fans, I'm outraged!>|
<tpstar: ....only leaves one game remaining for fans and spectators.>
Unfortunately for us fans, players don't play chess for the fans, they have more serious thoughts of a world title match at stake.
|May-12-11|| ||tpstar: <players don't play chess for the fans> Well maybe they should! =)|
These elite players cannot complain about lack of sponsorship and reduced funding for professional chess, then put forward these weak efforts where serious players can tell they aren't even trying, much less the non-playing general public.
This is just like Brissago 2004 - Kramnik & short draws all over again.
|May-12-11|| ||Jim Bartle: Today chess games are followed largely on the Internet, so it's not really a huge loss for the fans. But what about the days when actually attending a WC was a big deal, and tickets were expensive. How would you like to pay serious money, make the effort to get to the site, and then watch the players call it a day after 15 moves?|
|May-12-11|| ||bronkenstein: The final position is completely equal , unfortunatelly ( and Kramnik most likely had it in his comp prior to the game , he played 15.Kh8 instantly and Grish offered the draw on the very next move). |
Grischuk tried , but failed to put some new problems in front of Kramnik with whites (5.Bf4 deviates instead of 5. Bg5 leading to Lasker´s defence = all the easy and fast black draws kramnik made against Radj in quarterfinals ), ie he simply admits that his team failed to find any improvement there.
Just to ilustrate the truely satanic preparation job Kramnik´s databases contain :
In his 3rd game against Radjabov , Radjabov thought for almost an hour before making his last move , which repeats the position for the third time by perpetual . On the press conference , Kramnik stated that he , actually , had the final position in his comp (33rd move !!).
|May-12-11|| ||Pygeum Lycopene: <These elite players cannot complain about lack of sponsorship and reduced funding for professional chess>|
Maybe still have time to change this, with potential fischer-like media star in magnus.
|May-12-11|| ||laskersteinitz: "FIDE Candidates Semis G1: Gelfand and Kamsky draw
12.05.2011 – You might be wondering why no mention is made of Grischuk-Kramnik in the title. The reason is that it wasn't a draw, it was a joke. First game of the semifinals of the Candidates and they draw in sixteen moves? Come on... That is embarrassing to both the players and chess fans alike." (Chessbase.com)
|May-12-11|| ||Ezzy: <"That is embarrassing to both the players and chess fans alike.">|
The players are not one bit embarrassed, and the only embarrassment the fans are feeling is that they are a million miles away from the class of these 2 candidate Grandmasters.
|May-12-11|| ||Maatalkko: <Ezzy> Dude, the position is in no way a draw. It was agreed drawn due to match strategy. Grischuk is not even trying to win the classical games. He didn't press as White against Aronian either. He figures Aronian, and now Kramnik, are better than him at classical so he should just head straight for the playoff. |
Kramnik, for his part, sees no point in trying to win with Black when he has White next round. Then he will press moderately hard, taking no risk, to try and see if Grischuk cracks.
It's not their far superior understanding of chess that made this a draw. It's just their match strategy. I think the strategy is pretty unsportsmanlike, particularly on Grischuk's end. He is trying to qualify for the Classical World Championship via rapid & blitz games.
This sort of thing is horrible for sponsorship though. Draws are possible in soccer, but imagine if the two teams could call a draw after the first half if they so chose! No sponsor or organizer would allow it. New chess fans already find draws perplexing - try explaining this to them.
|May-12-11|| ||bronkenstein: <Dude, the position is in no way a draw.>|
Maatalkko , the ending position is pretty uninteresthing draw acording to any computer , basic chess knowledge , Shipov´s or Rublevsky´s online comments and whatnot.
Grischuk had chances to try and attack few moves earlier ( again , acording to Shipov or Ryblevsky live analysis) but i am not sure Kramnik would agree on that, since he spent 10 minutes on the whole game (!) , walking, drinking coffie while Grish was thinking for almost an hour . So prolly Kram´s seconds knew better.
IMO, Grischuk has no choice but to go for the tiebreaks ,something that almost worked for Radjabov . Nothing unsportsmanlike about that , he could do it or pack and go home .
Ofc, we would like to see them in sharp , spectacular tactical fight , taking the risks and hitting each other , but it´s easy to play with other people´s lives :)
Since Grish would have , lessay , 10-20% chance to live through Kramnik´s preps and novelties , I wouldn´t blame him for the optimal style he opted for.
|May-12-11|| ||ARubinstein: the problem is the classical match is just four games. that's absurd. of course in a longer match Grischuk would sometimes go for short draws with White as well, but he wouldn't be able to do it all the time to just hold out for the rapid/blitz tiebreaks.|
|May-12-11|| ||ARubinstein: One can't fault Grischuk for his strategy. If Kramnik doesn't win in the classical stage, Grischuk will have a much higher chance of advancing. In blitz I think he'll be the slight favorite.|
|May-12-11|| ||kkdogg: Bronkenstein,
Isn't it a bit much to call something an elementary draw when each side still has a queen, two rooks, and three minor pieces on the board?
Do you think Fischer or Kasparov would offer a draw here? Or would they try to fine ways to present puzzles to their opponents? Maybe the outcome would still be a draw, but for cripes sake, make Kramnik earn it!
|May-12-11|| ||HeMateMe: the younger man is playing to draw a quick match, and go for the tie break games. That's where all that excitement was in the first round; until the matches are longer, that's where the excitement will be here.|
|May-12-11|| ||lost in space: boring and trivial|
|May-12-11|| ||BobCrisp: I'm just glad that <Bobby Fischer> isn't alive because this game would have killed him.|
|May-12-11|| ||drnooo: a farce pure and simple in tennis it would be the eqivalent of two super players sending underhanded lobs back and forth with Charlie Chaplin as the line judge.|
|May-12-11|| ||drnooo: how low will chess have to descend in order to find the guts to rise again?|
|May-12-11|| ||drnooo: Never in his entire career, did Fischer ever play a game like this even if he had the flu food poisoning and a bleeding ulcer. Whatever else you have to say about him, he was a fighter.
This is embarrassing folks. Now I honestly dont care who gets to the final with Anand. With this game I have lost all respect for Krammnik, and I had plenty. I am not even going to watch the rest of this stupidity. That I will leave to all of you still hanging breathlessly on the outcome.
What a pair of losers.|
|May-12-11|| ||OhioChessFan: <This game is type: CLASSICAL (Disagree? Please submit a correction slip.) >|
I disagree. There is nothing classical about it.
|May-12-11|| ||Maatalkko: <brokenstein> Equal does not necessarily mean it's drawn. Besides, had Grischuk chosen to fight instead of offer a handshake, he could have chosen a different 16th move to make it more interesting. Grischuk had a position that would lead to sharp play and instead he curled up into a little ball and begged Kwamnik not to huyt him.|
|May-12-11|| ||lolchair: <drnooo: Never in his entire career, did Fischer ever play a game like this even if he had the flu food poisoning and a bleeding ulcer. Whatever else you have to say about him, he was a fighter.> |
Fischer vs Benko, 1960
Yeah.. Fischer was a real chess saint
|May-12-11|| ||Maatalkko: <lolchair> OK that was one instance. Thus far, Grischuk has drawn his classical Whites in 22, 17, and 16 moves. He doesn't even care enough to pretend he's trying.|
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