|
< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 1 OF 3 ·
Later Kibitzing> |
| Dec-11-11 | | Whitehat1963: Wednesday puzzle after 16...h5. What a great finish! |
 |
Dec-11-11
 | | FSR: Indeed. Instead of the lackadaisical 9...Rc8, Black should have played 9...Ng4! 10.Nxc6 Nxe3 (10...bxc6 11.Bd4 Bxd4 12.Qxd4 Qb6 is also fine) 11.Nxd8 Nxd1 12.Bxf7+ Kxd8 13.Raxd1 e6 14.f5 exf5 16.exf5 Bxf5. |
 |
Dec-11-11
 | | FSR: Another line (from that given in my prior post) is 12.Nxf7 Nxc3 13.Nxh8 Nxe4 14.Nf7 (14.Rfe1 Bd4+!) Bd4+ 15.Kh1 Nf2+. |
 |
Mar-10-12
 | | Phony Benoni:  click for larger view<17.?>
The first order of business was spending about three minutes trying to figure out how that pawn got to g7. Seeing the pawns on c2/c3 made me think it might be a French and I could just let <Once> explain it, but a deeper assessment based on the Black pawn at e7 led to the conclusion that it probably wasn't a French after all. So I tried to do something with the pawn, probably by cracking open Black's kingside with a sacrifice. Another three minutes was spent evaluating 17.Rxf7, and certainly 17...Kxf7 18.e6+ with possibly 19.Qxg6 to follow looked promising. However, I then spotted the subtle defense 17...hxg4, and put that line of reasoning away. But it doesn't look right to move the queen. Does White have another forcing move? Yes, <17.e6> looks interesting. After 17...fxe6 18.Qxg6+ Kd7 19.Rd1+ wins Black's queen (there is no wrong rook in this case.) After some thinking, I decided 17.e6 hxg4 18.exf7+ Kd7 19.Rad1+ was optimal, taking Black's queen to weaken the back rank before doing the promotion thing. Naturally I didn't see the defense Black chose or Najdorf's brilliant refutation. (By the way, I that 20.Bh6? falls to 20...Qb6+ followed by 21...Bxg2+ and 22...Qxe6.) But that didn't matter. I was in too much of a hurry to play over the game and find out how the pawn got to g7. |
 |
Mar-10-12
 | | gawain: Wow. I felt sure that it would begin with 17 e6--so far so good--but I was not convinced that W wins after 17... hxg4. I looked a little at 18 Rxf7 but that is no good. I also looked at 18 exf7--but I wrongly thought that Black is OK as his King escapes. Najdorf was 15 or 16 when he pulled this off. |
 |
| Mar-10-12 | | darshandatta: Guys please check out 17. g5 xg7 18. h6 i know there's lot of possible continuation but i am finding white wins atleast an exchange. I know this is not better than the Najdorf but if it is not refuted i will be glad . |
 |
Mar-10-12
 | | Marmot PFL: 17 Qg5 is a little slow, 17...Qd5 and I think black is OK |
 |
| Mar-10-12 | | rilkefan: Well, I'm going to play e6 in this position regardless, so why bother analyzing? Anyway, here 17...hxg4 18.exf6+ Kd8 19.Rad1 is crushing, so 17...Rxg7. Here I'm still looking at 18.exf6+ and after ...Kf8 white has Bh6 and Rad1 (or possibly doubling on the f file) coming, and with the queens still on I doubt black can survive the attack anyway ignoring the exchange. Pretty easy Sunday I think if the above holds up. |
 |
Mar-10-12
 | | mig55: Rilkefan, it's saturday:-) |
 |
| Mar-10-12 | | Jason Frost: Saw 17. e6 hxg4 18. exf7+ Kd7 19. Rd1+!
 click for larger viewquickly, but was too lazy to follow up on 17...Rxg7. I think 18. exf7+ should win easily, but not quite the solution today. |
 |
Mar-10-12
 | | sevenseaman: Equal, 12 each.
First thoughts: I wish I could sac the Q (hanging at the moment) at g6. The R then checks at f8 and other R is in line. Wishful! I am falling a piece and a tempo short. (It would work if the Rs were doubled already). Is there any move that can help further my utopian plan? Yes, e6 looks a great candidate except that my Q continues to hang. Can I afford that? Emphatically yes, on a/c of the R-backed check making Black's hapless R a grand target. And it will renew my Q with devastating effect. (The Black K cannot help on account of g7). 17. e6 hxg4 18. exf7+ and 1-0.
 click for larger viewSorry folks, my plan was based on the automatic <17...hxg4> A valid question. Why would Black R continue to sit at g8 and lose the game pathetically? Why shouldn't Black take g7 and ignore the Q for a while. That'll make my exf7+ useless. My Utopia goes awry; who tosses away a Q on a half baked plan. How about 17. Qxc4 doubling pressure on f7. But...
17. Qxc4 Bd5 18. Qa4+ Rc6 and its a cul-de-sac. I saved my Q but Black will take g7 in good time. Its very tough going today! What now?
Go back and see if I can handle <17...Rxg7>. After all, my Q has a temporary reprieve in this line. 17. e6 Rxg7 18. Rxf7 ( I shun exf7 now, if Rxf7, I say exf7+ and save my Q. So <now Black is under pressure>) 18...hxg4 19. Rxg7 Kf8 (a must to avoid Rf8#) 20. Rxg6 and I am in control.  click for larger view21. Rf1+ and K is forced back to e8 with my e6 P ensuring mate with 'g' R. That should be it. Not a picnic at all. A trek or excursion more like. |
 |
Mar-10-12
 | | Once: Hmmmm - very tricky. The main idea is not too hard to spot: 17. e6 to threaten exf7+ and black's world falls apart. But the position after 17. e6 is a GOOT. Black is not in check, we haven't captured anything and we are not threatening imminent mate. That means that black has lots of choices about how to respond ... and we have a lot of variations to analyse. M'learned colleagues do variations far better than I can, so I'll just chip in one from the imagination of herr Fritz: 17...Bd5.  click for larger viewBlack simply brings up another defender for f7, blocks the d file and ignores the saucy strumpet of a white queen on g4. One sample line: 17... Bd5 18. exf7+ Bxf7 19. Qg5 Rxg7 20. Rad1 Qc7 21. Qh6 Rg8 22. Qh7 e5  click for larger viewWe have lost our two advanced pawns but black's position is a train wreck. He surely can't survive much longer ... although I can't see an immediate way to win for white. Good puzzle, fascinating position, but I can't claim the full point because I didn't come near to examining all the variations. Now, if you'll excuse me, <phony> has set me a little challenge... |
 |
Mar-10-12
 | | WinKing: I tried everything - 17.Rxf7, 17.Qf4, 17.Qg5 & 17.e6. What happens after 17.e6 Bd5 18.exf7 Bxf7 ? click for larger viewI failed miserably today but I don't see a clear win here with the above continuation. |
 |
Mar-10-12
 | | Once: So just how did a white pawn land on g7? Here's a selection, a buffet, a smorgasbord of theories. #1 - the detective. Putting my deerstalker on and asking Watson to put his service revolver in his pocket (why oh why didn't the army ask for it back when he retired?) (and doesn't this mean that he had very large pockets?) (or a very small revolver?) (which might be why his marriage didn't last) ... Material is level and white's doubled c pawns show that there have been piece exchanges. So the most logical explanation is that there have been a series of mutual exchanges. Black's advanced c4 pawn and the striking immobility of the e7 pawn suggests that Lestrade was not on best form when he suggested that the killer came from France. Sicily seems nearer the mark. And if we are into the realms of the sicilian, we can conjecture that white has chucked his f pawn forwards, landing on f6 from thence to capture a Bg7. #2 - but why would black do this to himself? Here I see two possible explanations - (a) that he wasn't a very good player and (b) that he had a cunning plan. #2a - The mysterious Frenkel appears thrice in our database, each time as black and each time scoring a fabulous duck egg against his name - 1-0. He even managed to lose one game in 10 moves. So I'm guessing that he's not a contender for "strongest player who never became world champion". #2b - sad to say, but my lowly playing strength means that I am closer to understanding the thought processes of patzers than I am the divine inspirations of the masters. My guess is that Frenkel's cunning plan was a kingside storm against white's castled king. He figured that he would have time for Rxg7, then h4-h3 and grisliness would happen. One of those players, perchance, who thinks more about his own plans and attacks than his opponent's. #3 - the Oncian whimsy. I'm moderately hooked at the moment on one of your televisual serial offerings - The Walking Dead. Or, as the characters insist on calling it, the Wocking Dead. Here's the deal. For some reason which is never ever explained, dead people come back to life and shuffle around moaning with nothing on their minds except an insatiable appetite and very poor dress sense. It's like Thriller without the music or Michael Jackson grabbing his crotch. Our attention is centred on a group of surviving living. I'd be more interested if we focussed on a group of wockers and heard their story. But maybe I'll have to write that one myself. What I don't get is the lack of precautions that these living take. I'm not talking about the fact that one of them has fallen pregnant, although she seems so skinny that standing up would be a challenge. No, it's the fact that they've chosen to live in tents near a farm. Hello, people! It's a post apocalyptic zombie world. How about putting some fences up? And/ or living inside bricks and mortar rather than under canvas. The inevitable happens. Every now and again a zombie wocks into their camp and someone gets grued. Just like today's visitor on g7. But, come on folks. The clue is in the title. They are called the Walking Dead for a reason... That's "walking" as in to locomote by means of legs and feet, not "Wocking" as in to fry chopped up vegetables in an oriental frying pan with Ken Hom's signature on the wooden handle. |
 |
Mar-10-12
 | | lost in space: After a long think (also about move like 17. Qxg6 I found the following line as best one: 16. e6! Bd5! 17. exf7 Bxf7 18. Qg5 Qd5 19. Qh6 Rc6 20. Rd1 Qe6 21. Bd4 I guess the other more obvious lines (taking the queen with the pawn, allowing exf7, or lines with Rxg7 are already covered, so I have not posted them (again) In the final position of my line white is better, most probably enough to win
 click for larger view |
 |
| Mar-10-12 | | galdur: 17. e6 hxg4 is easy 18.exf7+ Kd7 19.Rad1+ Ke6 20.Rxd8 Rcxd8 21.f8Q Rxf8 22.gxf8Q and curtains. But black can play 17...Bd5 when it doesnŽt seem quite as easy although white is probably winning. Think IŽll wait for the usual diligent analysis here. |
 |
Mar-10-12
 | | sevenseaman: Crafty defends 17. e6 with Bd5 which I scarcely thought of during the solution. EGT is very resourceful. I have yet not found a way around this defense. 17...Bd5 may yet spike the solution that looked good. The link at 17. ?
http://www.chessvideos.tv/endgame-t... |
 |
| Mar-10-12 | | ColeTrane: even after 20. ... Qb6 black ends up in Najdorf's mating net! |
 |
| Mar-10-12 | | gofer: Another queen sacrifice on a Saturday! After two minutes, I see a
move that is going to cause black serious problems... <17 e6 ...>
17 ... hxg4 18 exf7+ Kd7 19 Rad1+ Kc7 20 Rxd8 Rcxd8 21 f8=Q  17 ... f6/f5/fxe6 18 Qxg6+ Kd7 19 Rad1+ Kc7 20 Rxd8  17 ... Qd5 18 exf7 Kd8 (Qxf7 Qxc8#) 19 fxg8=Q+ Qxg8 (Kc7 Qxc8+ mating)
20 Rf8+ mating
So black only has one option...
<17 ... Bd5>
<18 exf7+ Bxf7>
Now we get to the interesting bit. Can white play Rxf7? The rook cannot be taken 19 Rxf7? Kxf7+ 20 Rf1+ Kxg7 (Ke8 21 Qxg6+ Kd7 22 Rd1+ Kc7 23 Bf5+ mating)
21 Qg5! Rh8 22 Bd4+ Qxd4 23 Qxe7+ Kh6 24 cxd4
But white is giving up a whole queen to keep the attack going! 19 Rxf7? hxg4 20 Raf1 Qd6 and that seems too much, but the idea is very
interesting! Especially the <19 Rxf7 Kxf7+ 20 Rf1+ Kxg7 21 Qg5! Rh8
22 Bd4+ Qxd4 23 Qxe7+ Kh6 24 cxd4> varation. So why not play Qg5
and watch black squirm! The rook sac is now availble and so is the
queen invasion on h6!
<19 Qg5 ...>
Now black must protect against the rook sac as it leaves Pg6 vunerable <19 ... Qd5>
At this point white could play Qh6, but I think the queen swap is in
white's favour.
<20 Qxd5 Bxd5>
<21 Bh6! Bf7>
<22 Rf2 ...>
Okay now it is really getting murky. d6 and Rc6 are available both lose
a pawn and leave black's position in tatters. I think you can probably
say that white is clearly winning...
Time to check...
~~~~~
Hmmm, not even close to the continuation. I didn't look at Rxg7 as a
reply. It doesn't look that great considering what it lead to, but that
is just me being miffed that I didn't consider it.
So what is black's best defense? Time to read what everyone else thinks... |
 |
| Mar-10-12 | | dragon player: Complex position today. White has a lead in development,
black's king is still in the center and black is not
coordinating. But how to exploit this? After some thinking,
this line comes up to my mind:
17. e6 hxg4
What else? 17... fxe6 18. Qxg6+, if 17... Bd5
18. Rd1. Wait, maybe 17... Rxg7. However, white can play
18. exf7+ Rxf7 19. Qxg6 with too many threats to handle. 18. exf7+ Kd7
19. Rd1+ Kc7
20. Rxd8 Rgxd8
21. f8(Q) Rxf8
22. gxf8(Q) Rxf8
23. Rxf8
And white is a rook up. This must be the solution.
Time to check.
-----------------
The game went different than my line, but I was right. 6/6 now. I'm doing well. |
 |
Mar-10-12
 | | scormus: I spent a while looking at 17 Rxf7 before I realised hoe easily it is refuted by hxg4. Instead e6 looks very strong but I dont know if I have it completely, might have missed something. 17 e6 hxg4 (... fxe6 18 Qxg6+ Kd7 19 Rad1+) 18 exf7+ Kd7 19 Rad1+ Kc2 or Ke6 20 Rxd8 Rcxd8 21 f8=Q Rdxf8 22 gxf8=Q Rxf8 23 Rxf8 seems to win |
 |
Mar-10-12
 | | scormus: I should have spent a bit more time .... |
 |
Mar-10-12
 | | scormus: ... but I thought 17 ... Rxg7 would be met by 18 exf7+ Rxf7 19 Qxg6 followed by Rad1. It looks clearer than 18 Rxf7. To me anyway |
 |
Mar-10-12
 | | Memethecat: This is a juicy position, e6 stands out as a way to trap the K & I'm tempted to sac the Q. 17e6 hxg4 18Rxf7 Qd6 19Rf8+ Rxf8 20gxf8=Q+ not working 17e6 hxg4 18exf7+ Kd7 19Rd1+ Kc7 20Rxd8 Rxd8 21f8=Q Rxf8 22gxf8=Q Rxf8 23 Rxf8 ***
So close. I'm disgusted the offer of the Q wasn't accepted the 1st time around, how can anybody foresee that. |
 |
| Mar-10-12 | | JG27Pyth: Wow! Worked on this enough to appreciate it. Beautiful finish. |
 |
 |
|
< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 1 OF 3 ·
Later Kibitzing> |