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Nov-26-11
 | | kb2ct: <AylerKupp: <kb2ct> I don't know why you consider not voting for 29...Qxf3 "unprofessional". Please explain.> I shouldn't have to explain. His move was a draw offer. Would you refuse a draw if he offered one in words?? :0) |
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| Nov-26-11 | | ajile: Time to end it with a flourish.
29..Qxh3 |
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| Nov-26-11 | | Zanderix: Also voted Qxh3 with draw offer, as it seems to me the position leads to a black perpetual check (... Nxf3+; Kf1 - Nh2+ ; Kg1 - Nf3+ and so on). |
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| Nov-26-11 | | Waitaka: What about Nxf3+ how bad is that?
(please be gentle, I am drinking wine) |
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| Nov-26-11 | | Waitaka: Oh, and <AylerKupp>, I am cooking that fish right now, here you can see a picture: http://m.facebook.com/photo.php?fbi... |
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Nov-26-11
 | | AylerKupp: <kb2ct> Probably not, but I'm still old fashioned enough, I guess, to expect draw offers (from eiher side) to be explicit and not implied. But I don't think that refusing even an explicit draw offer would make me unprofessional. Naive, stubborn, pig-headed perhaps, but not unprofessional. At least not in this position. If we had a tablebase draw that would be another story; even my pig-headedness has it's limits. |
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Nov-26-11
 | | Check It Out: <Waitaka> It drops a piece with no follow up attack. 29...Qxh3 |
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Nov-26-11
| | AylerKupp: This may be an even sillier issue than the draw etiquette that we discussed earlier, but those voting for 29...Qxh3 (which may include me) need to decide what we want the final game score to be. Do we want the game to end with 29...Qxh3 or 30...Nxf3+ (assuming 30.gxh3)? And, in case anyone is concerned, if 29...Qxh3 wins the vote and there's no draw offer in effect, I will DEFINITELY vote for 30...Nxf3+. Again, pig-headedness only goes so far. ;-) |
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Nov-26-11
 | | M.Hassan: 29....Qxh3 with draw offer
My vote |
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| Nov-26-11 | | Waitaka: I voted Qxh3, and I think the draw offer is unnecessary. The move itself is a draw offer. |
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| Nov-26-11 | | KINGZOSER: I voted definitely for 29... Qxh3
Now, if W replies 30.gxh3? Black mates next move or W 'll lose his Q + R.
Black 'd be 2 ps up then. |
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| Nov-26-11 | | karpkasp: 29... Qxh3 is a quick and elegant draw.
29... Ng6 30. Ne3 Rc6 31. Re2 Rc1 32. Rxc1 Qxc1+ 33. Kf2 Qc7 is equal.29... Rc4!? is a third alternative and GMVA has two options. 1) 30. Qd2 Rc2 rep
2) 30. Qe3!? Re6
The variations below show an equal queen ending and an equal knight ending. 31. b4 Nc6 32. Qf2 Qd8 33. Rd2 Rd4 34. Rxe6 Rxd2 35. Re8+ Qxe8 36. Qxd2 Qe5 37. Kf2 Nd4 38. Ne7+ Kf8 (or 38... Qxe7 39. Qxd4 =) 
click for larger view39. Nc8 Nc6 40. f4 Qe6 41. Qd6+ Qxd6 42. Nxd6 =
click for larger view |
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| Nov-26-11 | | Zanderix: If draw has to be, let it be with finesse. So cheers for the fall of pawn h3. |
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Nov-26-11
 | | Tabanus: Voted 29...Qxh3 with draw offer. |
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Nov-26-11
 | | morfishine: Voted <29...Qxh3>, but forgot to offer the draw; What the heck: If he offers, then accept |
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| Nov-26-11 | | Penguincw: I voted for 29... xh3.
click for larger viewIf 30.gxh3 then 30... xf3+ 31. f1  xe1+ 32.xe1 xd4 and it's looks good (assuming I didn't miss anything). 
click for larger viewAlso, in my opinion, there's still plenty to play for so let's not go with the draw. |
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Nov-26-11
 | | Pedro Fernandez: In my opinion the question is: if we play Qxh3, which side should offer a draw? (obvious, if there is not a specific rule for this). I don't think GM Akobian plays until the perpetual check takes effect. |
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| Nov-26-11 | | Penguincw: The draw offer at 51% and with still more than 24 hours to go it will be interesting. |
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Nov-26-11
| | Pedro Fernandez: <morfishine: Voted <29...Qxh3>, but forgot to offer the draw; What the heck: If he offers, then accept>
Yeah! That's what I meant. <kb2ct> has the reason in the sense Ng6 doesn't lead to a victory for black. |
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Nov-26-11
| | kb2ct: <Penguincw:>
Yes it is delicate, With his queen on d4 he has to answer Qxh3 with Ne7 check to get his queen off d4 and avoid the final knight fork. This may be the reason Rybka preferred Qb4 over Qd4 last move. :0) |
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| Nov-26-11 | | Zanderix: I don't think Qxh3 gives W plenty to play for. After 30. Ne7+ Rxe7 (Kh8 leaves W up a knight for 2 pawns, and Kh7 is suicidal, because of Qe4+), W will be forced to play 31. Qd8+ and eventually forced to capture Qh3, which automatically leads to perpetual check. So in such position I think whatever side offers the draw, it will be accepted. |
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Nov-26-11
| | kb2ct: <Pedro Fernandez:>
There is a better chance of a blunder after Qxh3 than Ng6 which is really to say no chance at all. :0) |
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Nov-26-11
| | kb2ct: Without a draw offer the next team argumebt will be about aesthetics. I happen to think straight Rybka is the prettiest forcing a draw a qyeen and a rook and an exchange down. Others may hmve different opinions
:0)
29. Qd4 Qxh3 30. Ne7+ Rxe7 31. Qd8+ Re8 32.
Qxe8+ Kh7 33. gxh3 Nxf3+
click for larger view |
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| Nov-26-11 | | fref: please folk, do not offer a draw
why not play on and "exhaust" the position? |
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Nov-26-11
| | kb2ct: There really are not many options to one perp or another. We can perp him or force him to perp us. Diehards might want to try the pawns for knight ending, but in CC it is probably no better than a draw and the chess engines favor white initialy. :0)
29. Qd4 Qxh3 30. Ne7+ Kf8 31. Ng6+ Kg8 32.
gxh3 Nxf3+ 33. Kf1 Rxe1+ 34. Rxe1 Nxd4 35. Re8+ Kh7 36. Nf8+ Kg8 37. Ne6+ Kh7
38. Nxd4 Rxb2
click for larger view |
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