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Wesley So vs Magnus Carlsen
"So—What?!" (game of the day Dec-06-2018)
Sinquefield Cup (2017), Saint Louis, MO USA, rd 5, Aug-06
Scotch Game: Malaniuk Variation (C45)  ·  0-1
ANALYSIS [x]

FEN COPIED

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Given 7 times; par: 47 [what's this?]

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Kibitzer's Corner
< Earlier Kibitzing  · PAGE 10 OF 10 ·  Later Kibitzing>
Aug-11-17
Premium Chessgames Member
  Domdaniel: <donjova> True, too true ... the relentlessness of the obsession is ultimately overwhelming. One can *try* to have a little fun at the expense of the delusional -- but they will never really understand, will they? And it gets tiring.
Aug-11-17  epistle: Then rest!
Aug-30-17  Mats G: Dear epistle, Please stick to chess and leave evolution by natural selection to those who master it. Oranges do not descnd from apples, but speciation does happen and has indeed happened frequently during history. The ancestors of oranges belonged to another species (could have been apples, but were in fact not) and developed into oranges in remarkably few generations. Artificial selection by fruit farmers speeded up to process. Your metaphor or analogy or whatever you would like to call it is extremely ill chosen.
Aug-31-17  epistle: Sire, if you may be so kind to allow yourself to be corrected, what I actually wrote was:

<Oranges could not have come from apples no matter how many generations had passed.>

the controlling word being <generations>.

<Generation> is necessarily tied up with people, and this you may see for yourself in your dictionary. <Speciation> however takes a longer period of time, certainly not measured by the passing of generations, as it is an evolutionary process. So while it is within the realm of possibility that millions of years ago the oranges now were originally apples, that does not at all refute, or even just contradict, my statement that oranges could not have come from apples within the span of <generations>. And I also have not heard of farmers blitzing apples into oranges by artificial selection which, in any case, would really be a pointless effort since we already have apples as apples and oranges as oranges.

I therefore still maintain that Wesley is the Queen of Scotch.

Aug-31-17  Howard: And then it was Janowski who once referred to his play as being like Mary, Queen of Scots---"beautiful, but unfortunate".
Aug-31-17
Premium Chessgames Member
  keypusher: < keypusher: <<devere > <john barleycorn> described Carlsen's play as Lasker-like, and that seems accurate. Lasker was famous for sometimes playing inferior openings and then punishing an opponent who tried for too much too soon. >

Lasker played bog-standard openings, some of which Tarrasch (who had some very eccentric notions about openings, viz. his annotations to their 1908 match games) happened not to like. This whole Lasker-psychology nonsense needs to die once and for all.>

Amplifying this with an example: One of Lasker's pet lines that Tarrasch thought inferior was the Steinitz Defense to the Ruy Lopez (a line Capablanca also favored, in case it needs an endorsement from an impeccably "sound" player). But Lasker almost invariably committed to it only after White had castled kingside. That way he didn't have to worry about dealing with sharp lines arising after 0-0-0. In other words, his approach was the reverse of <[playing] inferior openings and then punishing an opponent who tried for too much too soon>.

If you were to pick an single adjective to describe Lasker from the chess journalism of the 1890s (which is when he was really active), it would probably be "correct." Maybe "sound." Solid openings, powerful middlegames, determined, resourceful defense, incredible endgame technique, strong will. That was Lasker's formula, and people in the 1890s knew it. It was only when he was semi-retired and Reti was writing his potboilers in the 1920s that the psychology nonsense took hold.

Sep-09-17
Premium Chessgames Member
  ChessHigherCat: As I believe I commented during the game, So should have played 30. Qb8 Qxh3 31. Bg2 Qc3 32. Nd7 Qe1+ 33. Kh2 and black is completely lost.

What am I missing?

Sep-09-17
Premium Chessgames Member
  ChessHigherCat: Here's the only defense I can find and it leaves the black queen permanently out of play:

30. Qb8 g6 31. Nd7 Qg7 32. g5 Be6 33. Nf6+ Kh8 34. h4

Sep-09-17
Premium Chessgames Member
  keypusher: <Premium Chessgames MemberSep-09-17 ChessHigherCat: As I believe I commented during the game, So should have played 30. Qb8 Qxh3 31. Bg2 Qc3 32. Nd7 Qe1+ 33. Kh2 and black is completely lost. What am I missing?>

33....Qe7 looks pretty good.

Sep-10-17  Mendrys: While we're on the topic of oranges and speciation as it relates to Malaniuk variation of the Scotch game I'd like to point out the esteemed opinion of no less than Dr. W A Pintwiddle who said that 19. Bf4? and the subsequent infiltration of White's second rank by Black's heavy pieces is likely what doomed So in this game.
Jun-12-18
Premium Chessgames Member
  GrahamClayton: <ChessHigherCat> Here's the only defense I can find and it leaves the black queen permanently out of play: 30. ♕b8 g6 31. ♘d7 ♕g7 32. g5 ♗e6 33. ♘f6+ ♔h8 34. h4

<ChessHigherCat>, 30. ♕b8 seems to be answered by 30...♗e6, eg 31. ♘d7 ♗xd7 32. ♗xd7 ♕b4, and the two passed pawns should win for Black.

Dec-06-18
Premium Chessgames Member
  OrangeTulip: <Domdaniel>It’s like saying something like Columbus discovered New York. Britain... I hope you are aware the Big Apple was founded by the Dutch:)
Dec-06-18  starry2013: New Amsterdam was founded by the Dutch.
Dec-06-18  bcokugras: 30. Nd7?
Dec-06-18  Saniyat24: So-What?
Dec-06-18  GlennOliver: <bcokugras>
30. Nd7 would be followed by
30. ... Nxd7
31. Qxd7 h6
32. Qxa7

At which point Black has an advantage.

However, I for one am unable to convert that advantage into a win for Black, no matter how many times I play through the continuation.

Every attempt ends up with White achieving draw by repetition.

Suggested winning lines for Black would be very welcome.

Dec-06-18
Premium Chessgames Member
  thegoodanarchist: <OrangeTulip: <Domdaniel>It’s like saying something like Columbus discovered New York. Britain... I hope you are aware the Big Apple was founded by the Dutch:)>

Not only that, the state of New York (not just the city) was settled by Dutch to a great extent.

I've never seen a Dutch Reformed Church anywhere but in Woodstock, NY, and I've been all over this country.

The Dutch word for a stream or brook, "kill", is used for many bodies of water and also for the name of the Catskill Mountains south of the capital, Albany.

Dec-06-18  WDenayer: Good anarchist: the word 'kill' does not exist in Dutch.
Dec-06-18  thisisasign: <WDenayer> http://dutchkillscivic.com/history/
Dec-06-18  JohnBoy: Moves like 20...Bxd6 show me that naysayers wrt Carlsen’s tactical prowess are way off base. No doubt he saw the possibility of 25...Rb1. He manages to hide his tactical knife just a bit better than anyone else. And he knows well when to pull it out.
Dec-06-18  eaglewing: 30 Bd5 Qd4 31 Nc6 ... ?
Dec-06-18
Premium Chessgames Member
  cormier:


click for larger view

Analysis by Houdini 4 d 26 dpa done

<1. = (-0.17): 20.Bxd7> Qxd7 21.exd6 Bxd6 22.Rxe8+ Qxe8 23.Bxd6 cxd6 24.Qxd6 h6 25.Ne5 Kh7 26.Nxg6 fxg6 27.Qxc5 Re2 28.Qd5 Qf8 29.Rf1 Qf6 30.Qb3 a5 31.a3 Qc6 32.c4 Qc5 33.Qd3 Ra2 34.h4 Rxa3 35.Qe4 Rh3 36.h5 Qd6 37.hxg6+ Qxg6 38.Qxg6+ Kxg6 39.Ra1 Kg5 40.Rxa5+ Kxg4 41.Kg2 Rc3 42.c5 Rc4

<2. = (-0.24): 20.Re3> h6 21.Qc1 Rb6 22.Qd2 Rf8 23.Rae1 Nxe5 24.Bxe5 dxe5 25.Qxd8 Rxd8 26.Nxe5 Bg5 27.R3e2 Kh7 28.Bb3 Rf6 29.Nxg6 fxg6 30.Re8 Rf8 31.Rxd8 Bxd8 32.Re6 Bf6 33.Bc2 Rd8 34.Ra6 Rd2 35.Be4 Re2 36.Bd3 Re1+ 37.Kg2 Rc1

Dec-06-18
Premium Chessgames Member
  cormier:


click for larger view

Analysis by Komodo 9

19.b3 Qc8 20.exd6 Bxd6 21.Bxd7 Qxd7 22.Bxc5 Rxe1+ 23.Nxe1 Rd8 24.Bxd6 Qc6 25.Qe2 Rxd6 26.Rd1 Rxd1 27.Qxd1 h6 28.c4 Qf6 29.Qe2 Bb1 30.Kg2 c5 31.a3 Qc3 32.Nf3 Qxb3 33.Nd2 Qb7+ 34.Qf3 Qxf3+ 35.Kxf3 Bc2 36.Ne4 Bd3 37.Nd6 f6 38.Ke3 Bc2 39.Nf5 + / = (0.52) Depth: 31

19.b3 Qc8
+ / = (0.45 --) Depth: 32

Dec-07-18
Premium Chessgames Member
  cormier:


click for larger view

Analysis by Komodo 9 d 32

1. + / = (0.59): 17.e5 Rb8 18.b3 Bxf3 19.Qxf3 Nxe5 20.Qe4 Rf8 21.Bxc5 dxc5 22.Qxe5 Bd6 23.Qe4 Rb6 24.Rad1 Qf6 25.c4 Rfb8 26.g3 Bf8 27.Qg2 Rd6 28.Rxd6 Bxd6 29.Bc6 Rd8 30.Qf3 Be5 31.Qe4 g6 32.Qxe5 Qxc6 33.Qg5 Rd3 34.Qh6 a6 35.h4 Qa8

2. + / = (0.50): 17.g4 Bg6 18.e5 Rb8.
. 19.b3 Qc8 20.exd6 Bxd6 21.Bxd7 Qxd7 22.Bxc5 Rxe1+ 23.Nxe1 Qc6 24.Bxd6 Rd8 25.Qf3 Be4 26.Qe2 Rxd6 27.Rd1 Rxd1 28.Qxd1 h5 29.f3 Bg6 30.Qd8+ Kh7 31.Qd2 hxg4 32.hxg4 Qc5+ 33.Kf1 f5 34.g5 f4 35.Ng2 Qxg5 36.Qxf4 Qa5 37.Qh4+ Kg8 38.Qd8+ Kh7 39.Nf4 Qa6+ 40.Kf2 Qxa2+ 41.Kg3

Dec-07-18
Premium Chessgames Member
  thegoodanarchist: <WDenayer: Good anarchist: the word 'kill' does not exist in Dutch.>

<thisisasign: <WDenayer> http://dutchkillscivic.com/history/>

Thank you both for your replies. I should mention that in NY I always see "kill" used as a suffix.

For example, Catskill or Cobleskill (in Schoharie County, which most likely is also a Dutch name)

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