< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 3 OF 3 ·
|Jul-05-06|| ||lblai: A correction of my previous note: Twice, I wrote, "Staunton-Lasa match". In both places, I should have written "Staunton-Lasa series of games". In view of the absence of any known 1844 reports of a Staunton-Lasa series of games (and the other reasons that I mentioned above), it seems to me to be clearly inappropriate to refer to a supposed 1844 Staunton-Lasa series of games as if it were an unquestioned historical fact. Of course, the situation would become quite different if a record from that time is located.|
|Jul-05-06|| ||Poulsen: Von der Lasa and Staunton played a match in Brussels 1853 - i.e. at a point of time at which Staunton was no long considered the strongest player in the world - but still was perhaps the most famous name in chess.|
Von der Lasa was a true diplomat of chess - his importance should not be underestimated. In the 1870's he was preussian representative in Denmark and his efforts boosted danish (or rather Copenhagen) chess to its first "golden age".
At his time in Denmark the strongest danish player was considered to be Martin Severin From - the first dane to participate in an international chesstournament (Paris 1867).
|Jul-05-06|| ||SBC: <Poulsen>
<At his time in Denmark the strongest danish player was considered to be Martin Severin From - the first dane to participate in an international chesstournament>
Can you offer more information on From?
|Jul-06-06|| ||Poulsen: <SBC> I have written some data on Martin Severin From on "his" page ...|
|Jul-06-06|| ||SBC: <Poulsen>
I figured he was the one for whom the Froms Gambit was named.
You mentioned that Lasa was the "Prussian representative in Denmark" whose efforts helped bring Denmark into it's Golden Age of Chess. Are there any specifics about this that you can share?
|Jul-07-06|| ||lblai: While there is agreement that Staunton and Lasa DID play in 1853, there does not seem to be agreement that it was a match. To some extent this may be a definition disagreement instead of a historical disagreement. My own feeling is that a series of games should not be considered to be a match if there was no in-advance agreement that specified what would terminate the series of games and determine the winner. Again, it should be emphasized that this is a sort of dispute that is quite different from the dispute about 1844 where evidence is lacking that Staunton and Lasa were even in the same country.|
|Aug-08-06|| ||tamar: Jerry Spinrad has some thoughts on Lasa http://www.chesscafe.com/spinrad/sp...|
Most notably he concludes that the match in 1844 did not happen, and that its source was probably Nathan Divinsky. Since it is a subject of speculation on this page, I give the quote.
<However, I later was informed that Divinsky wrote in the Proceedings of the Chronicle of Chess Historians, 2002 that Lasa played 7 games with Staunton in 1844, at Berlin, and won 5 to 2. Thus, I now imagine that Divinsky was the source for the Companion’s claim. However, since Staunton writes in the Chess Player’s Chronicle that he had the pleasure of making the personal acquaintance of von der Lasa in their 1853 encounter, I still do not believe that the two played in 1844.>
|Oct-17-06|| ||BIDMONFA: Baron Tassilo Heydebrand und der Lasa|
VON HEYDEBRAND DER LASA, Tassilo
|Oct-17-06|| ||lostemperor: He must be really good if he beat Staunton and Anderssen!?|
|Oct-17-06|| ||technical draw: <LE> They lost on time writing down his name.|
|Oct-17-06|| ||TheBB: <technical draw> Lol..! :)|
|Oct-19-06|| ||lostemperor: <technical draw> your avatar, is that Kramnik as a child :)|
|Mar-04-07|| ||antarney: where can i get games showing von der lasa's gambit (center game c21) ?|
|Mar-04-07|| ||SirBruce: <antarney>
|May-19-07|| ||Themofro: <Lostemperor> He was one of the early greats of the 19th century that no one really remembers, on http://db.chessmetrics.com/CM2/Play... he's ranked as world number one for 15 months.|
|May-19-07|| ||SBC: |
<Jerry Spinrad has some thoughts on Lasa - http://www.chesscafe.com/spinrad/sp... >
< However, since Staunton writes in the Chess Player’s Chronicle that he had the pleasure of making the personal acquaintance of von der Lasa in their 1853 encounter, I still do not believe that the two played in 1844.>
Raymond Keene mentioned that Ken Whyld informed him that the 1844 meeting was incorrect, that Staunton wasn't in Berlin in 1844 .
But, according to a letter (published here by WilhelmThe2nd, but can be read here: http://sbchess.sinfree.net/LasaStau...) from v.d Lasa to The City of London Chess Magazine and published in the January 1875 issue, concerning Staunton:
"Having been during more than thirty years on friendly terms with the deceased [Staunton, who died in 1874]...
Thirty years prior to 1874 is, of course, 1844.
|Aug-13-07|| ||An Englishman: Good Evening: If only there was some way to guess how good players like von der Lasa would be today.|
I feel that if you traveled back in time, snatched v.d.L, and brought him to the present, he would be completely flummoxed playing against Queen Pawn openings, the Pirc, Alekhine, and Caro-Kann. At least until he caught up with theory. He would also have to learn how to cope with the pawn structures seen most often in today's chess (d5 & e4 vs. d6 & e5 from the Ruy, Pirc, and KID, for example).
But what if the good Baron had been born in 1985? He would have grown up with today's theory and strategy, as well as worked with computers.
I think he would rank among the world's best. I know many programs tend to rate the 19th Century players lower than today's, but I believe that the algorithms don't consider the lack of quality opponents and state of endgame theory back them. Endgame theory back then was almost non-existent, which is why the endings from the mid-19h Century include so many errors. In any case, it's a pity there is no way to find out.
|Oct-17-07|| ||MUNGOMYERS: this guy can play plenty of wins against the great adolf anderssen and the great howard staunton big respect|
|Oct-17-07|| ||keypusher: A Spinrad article about von der Lasa
(The one SBC linked to was about Bilguer, though it had a lot of interesting information about his friend and co-star.)
|Dec-27-07|| ||myschkin: His fabulous chessbook collection (mentioned in the cg.com biography above) seems to be intact until these days: .... Es stellt deshalb ein ganz außerordentliches Verdienst dar, daß Herr Professor Sierpowski und Frau Maria Luczak von der <Bibliotheka Kórnika in Kornik bei Poznan (Posen)> in Polen vom 16. bis 18. September 2002 eine internationale Veranstaltung von Schachhistorikern veranstalteten. Mit der Veranstaltung wurde einem größeren Publikum die <bedeutende Schachbuchsammlung von der Lasas>, die bereits seit 1990 von Schachforschern besucht und genutzt werden konnte, zugänglich gemacht. .... (erschienen in Schach Nr. 11/2002)|
|Sep-13-08|| ||JonathanJ: <chessgames.com> his complete name is "Baron Tassilo von Heydebrand und der Lasa".|
|Oct-17-08|| ||brankat: From the good Baron's Biography:
<During his time as a diplomat he collected a chess library of over 2000 items which was reported to still be intact in Poland in 1957.>
Wouldn't mind laying hands on that treasure ;-)
R.I.P. Master und der Lasa.
|Oct-17-10|| ||Dredge Rivers: This is the short version of his name!|
|Apr-29-12|| ||TheTamale: His friends just called him Tass.|
|May-18-13|| ||The17thPawn: Its a shame he never played Morphy. Would have produced some interesting chess.|
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