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Nov-28-09
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| kb2ct: <kormier>
The only really serious thing that can happen with flu shots is Guillain–Barré syndrome. If your legs aren't rubbery, you are OK. My father got GBS from the swine flu shot in 1976. :0) |
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| Nov-28-09 |
| kormier: actually at 75% of ussual after 16 hfrom SFs, feeling better, i should have been noticed by the healt sector to take a 8 oz of water with a touch of salt and sugar (optional + pepper if needed) at least every hour after it.....tks |
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| Nov-28-09 |
| kormier: kb2ct; tks, it was like i had taken to much coufting syrup effect to me, i still have some muscle stiffness here and there .....by by |
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Nov-28-09
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| kb2ct: <kormier:>
It isn't unusual to develop symptoms similar to a mild case of the flu from flu shots. Redness where you were injected is also common. A slight headache is actually a good sign. Symptoms should be gone in two days.
Be sure to report what happened to the clinic.
:0) |
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| Nov-28-09 |
| Jim Bartle: Here's a scary poll for the Democrats. First number is voters likely to vote in 2010, second those not likely to vote: Republican Voters: 81/14
Independent Voters: 65/23
Democratic Voters: 56/40
In other words, even if the Republicans remain a minority, they are likely to win a lot in 2010 because they are highly motivated to vote, while Democrats are not. |
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| Nov-28-09 |
| kormier: i will now take another look at the w cup 09.....tks |
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Nov-28-09
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| whatthefat: <Jim Bartle>
I remember seeing a similar poll from 2007 regarding same-sex marriages. There were 2 questions: the first was whether you support them, the second was whether you would vote for a candidate who did/didn't support them. Now on the first question, it was very close to a 50/50 split. But on the second question, those who did support same-sex marriages indicated that the candidate's view on this point was not a deciding factor in which way they would vote; it played some role of course, but it was relatively weak. Of those opposed to same-sex marriage, the majority said they would reject such a candidate out of hand. It was a stunningly clear indication that even if more than half of the population supported same-sex marriage, it would be a losing political move for a candidate to express the view of the majority, due to the knee-jerk reactions of those opposed to the idea. |
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Nov-28-09
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| whatthefat: <Jim Bartle>
I'd also say that your poll is a good illustration of why compulsory voting is healthy for a democracy. If you wish to accurately represent the people, you need to first hear their views. Come to think of it, I wonder just how much of the money spent on advertising political campaigns could be saved if you at least knew people would make it to the polling booth. |
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Nov-28-09
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| OhioChessFan: I've always been skeptical of the expected voter polls. I'm mostly surprised anyone admits they don't plan to vote. As a flip side to <whatthefat> view, I think if a person isn't interested enough to vote, I'd just as soon not have his voice heard anyway. |
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Nov-28-09
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| whatthefat: <OhioChessFan: As a flip side to <whatthefat> view, I think if a person isn't interested enough to vote, I'd just as soon not have his voice heard anyway.> That's the rationale I guess, but I think once you force people to vote, they are naturally encouraged to think more about the politics and how it affects them. Without compulsory voting it is easy to just take the mentality that since you're in a minority anyway, your vote won't make any difference so you won't bother, which results in dilution of minority views. |
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Nov-28-09
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| OhioChessFan: Let me take that under advisement <whatthefat> There's a good point in that, though I'd suggest many who voluntarily vote don't think about it much. |
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Nov-28-09
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| Marmot PFL: How can you force people to vote without telling them who to vote for? It sounds like Stalin or Saddam Hussein. |
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| Nov-28-09 |
| kormier: Jim Bartle; queen slightly slap's harper's hand and un chairman spoke about ....alwright, that's the way, it's a beginning; Wesley So is only 15 y old!!!.....tks |
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Nov-28-09
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| whatthefat: <Marmot PFL>
Same way you make someone perform any civic duty: fine them if they don't. There are many democratic countries that do this. |
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Nov-28-09
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| Marmot PFL: Doesn't sound very democratic. How much would the fine be? I bet Thoreau would go to jail before paying it. |
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| Nov-28-09 |
| Dredge Rivers: <whatthefat>
What the heck, <whatthefat>? It always amazes me that otherwise intelligent people can hold such silly ideas as compulsory voting. It brings to mind the (perhaps non-existent) South American dictator who once said, "I am determined to bring democracy to my country, and anyone who is opposed to that; I will jail, I will crush!"Rule #1 of politics, unless one has both the ability and desire to impose your will on the situation at hand, YOU DON'T MATTER! Harsh, but true. Therefore, IMHO, if a person cannot motivate themself to vote, to heck with them. Any country that needs compulsory voting to save it is too far gone to be worth saving. |
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Nov-28-09
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| whatthefat: <Marmot PFL>
The system works very well in Australia - the fine is small, something like $20. <Dredge Rivers: Rule #1 of politics, unless one has both the ability and desire to impose your will on the situation at hand, YOU DON'T MATTER! Harsh, but true.> If that's your ideology, then you are fundamentally opposed to democracy. Democracy is not about the voice of the strongest, it is about the voice of all. |
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| Nov-28-09 |
| kormier: Dredge Rivers; how about having them listening a motivator.....tks |
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Nov-28-09
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| Marmot PFL: < the fine is small, something like $20> Still too negative. Let's reward instead of punish. Maybe give each voter a coupon for free fries at McDonald's or a free Starbucks coffee. You could see record turnout. |
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| Nov-28-09 |
| Jim Bartle: Voting is mandatory here in Peru. If you don't vote there's a small fine, but more important you can't do anything with a government office, or sign anything at a notary public (a big deal here) if you don't have the sticker on your ID. And it means standing in a long line to pay the fine. |
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| Nov-28-09 |
| Dredge Rivers: <whatthefat> Rule #1 is not my ideology, it's a cold, hard fact. I'm sorry you can't deal with it, but reality kind of doesn't care what we think. |
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| Nov-28-09 |
| Dredge Rivers: <whatthefat> BTW, I am not opposed to democracy. I do not, however, beleive it should be an end in itself. It is a means towards an end, and that end is liberty. Which brings us to: Rule #2: If love of country dies in the heart of its people, that country will not long survive, and does not deserve to. All the force in the world will not change that fact. |
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Nov-28-09
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| whatthefat: <Dredge Rivers: Rule #2: If love of country dies in the heart of its people, that country will not long survive, and does not deserve to.> Well in that case America is finished. Only 62% of the population voted in 2008. |
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Nov-29-09
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| kb2ct: Palin's book debuts at #1 on the NY Times non fiction best seller list. http://www.uclick.com/client/nyt/jd/
:0) |
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Nov-29-09
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| Red October: <Democracy is not about the voice of the strongest, it is about the voice of all.> you mean it is <supposed> to be the voice of all... the challenge of true democracy is how to get all of those voices heard |
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