|
< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 11 OF 24 ·
Later Kibitzing> |
Jun-09-08
 | | SetNoEscapeOn: <SetNoEscapeOn: <square dance: did she really throw the piece? to me it looked like she just pimp slapped it off the board.>
This is probably the most accurate description, better than the one I gave.> I was wrong- <squaredance> was not competely correct. Irina did not pimp slap the King because a Pimp Slap Proper must be accomplished with a backhand. Besides, Irina is not a pimp. |
 |
| Jun-09-08 | | Petrosianic: <The rules in baseball are that a fan gets to keep a ball that gets hit into the stands. Do the spectators in chess get to keep a piece after it gets pimp slapped into the stands?> That has got to be the best question I've heard all year. I read Braunlich's statement again, and it doesn't say ANYTHING about that. |
 |
| Jun-09-08 | | square dance: i actually thought she did back hand the king when i first saw the clip. i guess i wasnt watching too closely. |
 |
| Jun-09-08 | | centercounter: What happens then if you have 20 seconds to 3? Can you play mind games by making your move and waiting 3 seconds to hit your clock? Am I making an illegal move in classical chess by moving when my opponent has forgotten to hit his clock? This is what happens when you decide a classical chess tournament with blitz. Might as well be darts or tiddlywinks for the relevance. It's too late now because of the bad blood, but they should have been declared co-champions. |
 |
| Jun-09-08 | | Petrosianic: <What happens then if you have 20 seconds to 3? Can you play mind games by making your move and waiting 3 seconds to hit your clock?> I don't see why not. People do that in online games a lot too, though it only works there if the move is something totally unexpected. <Am I making an illegal move in classical chess by moving when my opponent has forgotten to hit his clock?> No, only a foolish one. Wait for him to notice it first. According to the USCF it's not illegal in Blitz so it's not illegal in slow chess either. <It's too late now because of the bad blood, but they should have been declared co-champions.> You can't strip somebody of half a title because the loser isn't happy about losing. If they did that, there'd be no point in having any playoffs ever. |
 |
| Jun-09-08 | | centercounter: <Petrosianic: <It's too late now because of the bad blood, but they should have been declared co-champions.> You can't strip somebody of half a title because the loser isn't happy about losing. If they did that, there'd be no point in having any playoffs ever.> That's my point. There shouldn't be any playoffs. If the players manage equal scores in the event, using a different event to break the tie is silly. Imagine using a sprint to break a photo finish in a marathon. |
 |
Jun-09-08
 | | SetNoEscapeOn: <Can you play mind games by making your move and waiting 3 seconds to hit your clock?> You can, but I don't think it would be a very effective mind game. Your opponent could have already moved, and when you hit your clock, they can hit it back immediately, losing no time at all. You can do this now under the current "perceived rules" and the only difference is your opponent would have to wait to move instead of waiting to hit the clock. <Am I making an illegal move in classical chess by moving when my opponent has forgotten to hit his clock?> Good point, and yes, according to my definition that would be illegal. Without revisions, it would mean that your opponent would have to notice that his clock wasn't hit, or lose on time. I admit that this is not ideal... |
 |
Jun-09-08
 | | SetNoEscapeOn: Also- who is the jackass laughing (or squealing, or whatever he's doing) as the game finishes in the video? |
 |
Jun-09-08
 | | SetNoEscapeOn: Not that anybody knows the answer to this quesiton. Still, what a silly jackass. |
 |
| Jun-09-08 | | Petrosianic: <That's my point. There shouldn't be any playoffs. If the players manage equal scores in the event, using a different event to break the tie is silly.> How do you feel about tiebreak points?
<Imagine using a sprint to break a photo finish in a marathon.> Is it really all that different from extra-innings? Or how about those silly shoot-outs they do in certain soccer games? I agree this particular playoff was pretty silly. At the end it wasn't a contest of chess skill. But surely there are reasonable playoff formats they might have used in its place. Like maybe playing individual Classical speed games until somebody wins. There is a certain rationale in having <A> tiebreaker. The Champion is supposed to be have the right to say that they're the best in the country. But neither one can say that if the other one has half their title. |
 |
| Jun-09-08 | | diabloprancer: The real tragedy here is that the Women's World Champion was decided by an Armageddon game. It is UCSF's fault, not the players', that they were moving at the same time and knocking over pieces, etc. It's clear from the video that neither player was trying to cheat; it's just the nature of this ridiculous time control that ridiculous things happen. In the future they should just keep playing blitz games until someone loses. Any player would prefer 20 blitz games to this nonsense. |
 |
| Jun-09-08 | | dumbgai: For the poor sportsmanship discussion: I remember something like five years ago the late GM Aleks Wojtkiewicz lost two games in a blitz tournament to a local amateur player, and in anger overturned the board and propelled several pieces at his opponent's body. Although I'm guessing this kind of behavior happens everywhere from time to time. Maybe Cheparinov at Corus this year might make the top ten list. |
 |
| Jun-09-08 | | square dance: anyone who flips the board in their opponents direction deserves to get punched. thats just plain disgusting behavior. not like punching someone isnt. ;-) |
 |
| Jun-09-08 | | Vollmer: Petrosianic , I still think 10sec/move is a reasonable alternative to the current format . Does anyone else agree? |
 |
| Jun-09-08 | | savagerules: < dumbgai: For the poor sportsmanship discussion: I remember something like five years ago the late GM Aleks Wojtkiewicz lost two games in a blitz tournament to a local amateur player, and in anger overturned the board and propelled several pieces at his opponent's body. Although I'm guessing this kind of behavior happens everywhere from time to time. >
How about this one, a drunken IM at a Canadian Open a few years ago, urinated on the board during the tournament!! That's the tops in my book for rude behavior. As for Aleks, he was obviously boozed up as usual, since he lost both games to a weak player and then tossed the board. |
 |
| Jun-09-08 | | square dance: <How about this one, a drunken IM at a Canadian Open a few years ago, urinated on the board during the tournament!!> i heard about that! |
 |
| Jun-09-08 | | square dance: <vollmer> i like your idea. the sudden death game should be 10sec/move. its much better than these stupid time and color odds armageddon games. |
 |
| Jun-10-08 | | KnottyQueen: Where did chess go? Anyway, I suggest the ties should be broken by having both contenders play a complicated tablebase win against a computer. Whoever finishes first wins the match. Stepping into a draw is grounds for immediately losing the match. |
 |
Jun-10-08
 | | lostemperor: These sudden death tie-breakers are made for drama. And with all due respect to miss Krush, it should be Zatonskih who could have claimed a fault by her opponent. We can see miss Krush. in the heat of the battle, push one of her rooks off the board which should be there still. Time to link the video in question again, which gets pretty much hits by all this drama, http://nl.youtube.com/watch?v=fNQjX.... You can see it at 1:07 minutes. If miss Zatonskih had lost that game she could made a successful protest of something illegal done by miss Krush. As it is now, Zatonskih was so busy hitting the clock, she did not even noticed. |
 |
| Jun-10-08 | | RookFile: <KnottyQueen: Where did chess go? > Chessboard and pieces are irrelevent.
Just put a clock between the two players, set at 5 minutes each. Both players take turns punching the clock. The one whose flag falls first loses. |
 |
Jun-10-08
 | | keypusher: <Petrosianic: <In the absence of a TD specifying clock placement, the player with the Black pieces may choose on which side of the board the clock should sit, unless Black is late arriving to the round, and White arrives before Black does, with a clock.>
That's the current rule. The old rule was that the clock goes on Black's right, but they changed that several years back.> Thanks for the clarifications, all. I am a left-hander so I like having the clock on that side. :-) I wouldn't have a tiebreaker in any event except the world championship and elimination matches/tournaments. |
 |
| Jun-10-08 | | Petrosianic: <Vollmer> <Petrosianic , I still think 10sec/move is a reasonable alternative to the current format . Does anyone else agree?> 10 seconds a move used to be a really popular format before speed chess took off. I wouldn't mind seeing that come back. I still don't like Blitz playoffs, but that would be a lot better than 5/G. Chessmaster 6 (and presumably later versions) has this time control available if you want to experiment with it. They also have a thing called Hourglass time, in which the time one player uses gets credited to the other player. For example, if each player starts with 30 seconds, and white uses 5 seconds on his first move, then he's got 25 seconds and Black has 35. If Black uses 6 seconds for move 1, then White has 31 seconds on Move 2, and so forth. Fritz is a stronger program, but Chessmaster has a lot more frills and interesting things like that for someone who wants to actually PLAY chess with their program, rather than analyze with it. |
 |
| Jun-10-08 | | Petrosianic: <keypusher> <Thanks for the clarifications, all. I am a left-hander so I like having the clock on that side. :-)> I'm left handed too, but I still always put the clock on the right when I have Black, just because I got used to it that way, and now it feels like putting a white square in the wrong corner to do it the other way. I just got used to thinking "Reach left when you're playing white, reach right when you're playing Black." When I first started playing rated games, I thought Black had the choice, but someone pulled rank on me and showed me the rule saying it went on Black's right side. So I just got used to doing it that way myself so that nobody could force me to do it a way I didn't want. Later on, I pulled out the book myself to show that Black didn't have the choice. Then they changed the rule so that Black did have the choice. (So I was just ahead of my time?) <I wouldn't have a tiebreaker in any event except the world championship and elimination matches/tournaments.> A tiebreaker is a lot better than draw odds for the defending champion. But I wouldn't use Blitz. I still think the best tiebreaker is the one used in the Bronstein-Boleslavsky match. Keep playing single classical games until somebody wins one. I wouldn't even mind if they had play every single day with no timeouts, until somebody broke. It's better than blitz. |
 |
| Jun-10-08 | | littlefermat: In kibitzers' cafe, <Yourang> asked an question about the armageddon playoffs--anybody have an answer? I complained: <I'm not sure if the better chessplayer wins or the player with the better reflexes.> And he said:
<Exactly. We would be presented with an interesting problem if one of the players was physically handicapped, making it impossible to move quickly. Wouldn't blitz play then be a form of discrimination against handicapped people?> Are there specific rules to take into account these kinds of circumstances? |
 |
Jun-10-08
 | | SetNoEscapeOn: <diabloprancer: The real tragedy here is that the Women's World Champion was decided by an Armageddon game> You mean, the 2008 US Women's Championship.
And I don't know... I feel as if was decided by the entire tournament, where Irina (and I have great respect for this player) failed to demonstrate her superiority in their individual classical game, then in the tournament, then in all the other tiebreak games. <square dance: <vollmer> i like your idea. the sudden death game should be 10sec/move. its much better than these stupid time and color odds armageddon games.> I think the spirt of this solution could have been accomplished (and the issues actually seen avoided) simply by using a time delay or increment. I assume that there is a logical reason that chess moved away from 10 seconds/move- namely, that the outcome of the game seems even less likely to be decided on "chess merits" than in blitz, since some positions simply require more than 10 seconds to calculate/ think about. Expanding this to say three minutes/move for classical games, any halfway decent theoretical novelties at the top level would win almost by default. I suppose my question is: what are the benefits of 10 seconds/ move over normal blitz with time delay or increment? <Is it really all that different from extra-innings? Or how about those silly shoot-outs they do in certain soccer games?> It is directly analogous to the former, just like overtime in other American sports (with the exception that the course of the game may have implications for the extra periods, such as foulded-out players in nba games), and much superior the latter. I think a chess "penalty shootout" would be something like giving both players a tactical problem and seeing who could solve it faster. Or five tactical problems. I love "soccer", and it's truly the most absurd way I've seen of deciding a game in all major sports. |
 |
 |
|
< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 11 OF 24 ·
Later Kibitzing> |