< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 17 OF 28 ·
|Aug-06-13|| ||HeMateMe: BF is a loser, crying out for attention. His posts on other pages resemble the above^^.|
|Aug-06-13|| ||Natalia Pogonina: <BlackFront> Grandmaster of Russia is a title that is rewarded for outstanding results in chess - both having a high rating and having performed well at top international official competitions. The RCF has removed the list of title holders from the website for some reason, but I can reassure you that it is by far less common than the GM title. I would estimate the ratio to be about 4 Russian FIDE GMs to 1 GM of Russia. Most 2600+ GMs don't have the title, because, for example, one has to finish in the top-6 at World Chess Championship or top-3 at European Chess Championship to qualify. To give you another benchmark, GM Alekseev, who has been rated above 2700 for a few years already, has only earned this title in 2012. I have been awarded mine in 2006.|
You remark about Chess Olympiad vs. Olympics is factually correct, but rather irrelevant. First of all, we are not talking about public perception of players outside the chess community. Within the chess world if you are an Olympic champion, you are one of the top-10 most established team players in the world by definition. Secondly, it is not easier to win a Chess Olympiad than any other Olympic event. With 150+ stongest federations participating, it is hard to clinch first place. If chess was included into the Olympics and a few more federations would send their sub-2000 players to the competition, it wouldn't make it any more challenging. Hence, I don't see what exactly you are trying to point out. That Chess Olympiad isn't as prestigious in the eyes of the laymen as the Olympics? It goes without saying. And if you are thus implying that it's easy to win it, then I have explained above why you are wrong.
On a separate note, I am always puzzled by certain individuals who think that being a GM is so cool that I am supposed to be dying to use the title to promote myself. In fact, the ladder goes like this:
no title-title-holders-winners of strong international tournaments-popular winners of strong international tournaments. Now you can guess on which step of the ladder I am standing.
When colleagues want to describe my level of achievements to a stranger who doesn't know who I am, they would never use the word "grandmaster" as the key description, because there are over 1400 GMs in the world right now. Instead they would refer to one of my CURRENT titles (ignoring the ones I have won in the past):
Olympic Women’s Chess Champion (team & individual gold), European Women’s Team Chess Champion (team & individual gold), Russian Women’s Team Chess Champion (team & individual gold), Russian Women’s Chess Champion. Oh yes, I also have team & individual bronze from the Women's World Team Chess Championship, but usually list only gold medals :P
|Aug-06-13|| ||twinlark: <Natalia Pogonina>
Well done in the recent European Championship. Does this result qualify you for the Women's World Championship Tournament next year?
|Aug-07-13|| ||Bureaucrat: Chess Olympiad 2012, Istanbul:
Russia won the women's team event, and are thus the reigning champions. The team:
Board 1: GM Tatiana Kosintseva
Board 2: IM Valentina Gunina
Board 3: GM Nadezhda Kosintseva
Board 4: GM Alexandra Kosteniuk
Reserve: WGM Natalia Pogonina
Indivudual gold medals in the women's event:
<All board prizes were given out according to performance ratings. Nadezhda Kosintseva on third board had the best performance of all players in the tournament:
Board 1: Hou Yifan 2645
Board 2: Zhao Xue 2574
Board 3: Nadezhda Kosintseva 2693
Board 4: Huang Qian 2547
Reserve: Natalia Pogonina 2487.>
Natalia Pogonina played 8 games in the Olympiad, scoring six wins, one draw and one loss, against a rating average of 2266.
|Aug-07-13|| ||gromguten: Skill levels in general:
GM > IM > WGM > FIDE Master.
For Gents: Grandmaster of Russsia > GM
For Ladies: GM > Grandmaster of Russia
(a title no one ever heard of, btw.)
Our grandmaster has so far been awarded the WGM title. Her user profile is correct about this, but her rating of 2501 in the profile is outdated (3 years old). Her current rating is 2478.
Our grandmaster is a very talented chessplayer, and has excellent results in women's (team) competitions, congratulations.
|Aug-07-13|| ||Bureaucrat: By the way, I wrote the above post in order to provide some details as to how grandmaster Natalia Pogonina became <the reigning Olympic Chess Champion>, the term used in her resume on www.pogonina.com.|
|Aug-07-13|| ||gromguten: Current world rank: 1198 (female player #26 )
I can only imagine it must be hard to make a living from chess when there's 1200 players better than you. It's reassuring to read she's studying for an MA in Law. Professional chess is not for everyone!
|Aug-07-13|| ||Natalia Pogonina: <twinlark> Thanks. I have qualified for it last year, so this year I didn't even have to do it. However, I did.|
<Bureaucrat> You are posting well-known facts (available at the official website, Wikipedia, Olimpbase - anywhere) while trying to supply them with multiple links and proofs, as if someone was trying to dispute them or conceal the truth. Also, you didn't actually comment on the results. What exactly is your point? Do you have a problem with the way I (or our team overall) played?
<gromguten> First your make certain assumptions about how GM and GM of Russia titles can be compared and then follow it up by saying that "no one has heard of" the latter title. Don't you see an obvious controversy in your own words? If you haven't heard about it, then how do you know which one is more prestigious? :-)
Also, the profile here correctly states:
>Last FIDE rating: 2478
>Highest rating achieved in database: >2501
Where did you find the "currently rated 2501" line?
Moreover, I am not in charge of editing my profile here. Hence, it is inappropriate to make it sound as if I am the one responsible for what it says. I would have probably rewritten it in a different fashion, but it's up to the website's administration to run the site the way they want. I don't feel like I should interfere, as long as there are no SERIOUS mistakes in the bio. And even if there were, I have more important things to do than to monitor all the chess websites in the world and see what they have written about me :-)
|Aug-07-13|| ||Natalia Pogonina: <gromguten> If you continue making personal attacks here instead of discussing something meaningful, I will have to ban you. Also, I have my degree in Law and am not planning to work as a lawyer anyway. For me personally chess is more interesting and pays better.|
Please don't be concerned about my earnings. I make more than an average 2700+ GM. Instead, please tell us how successful you are in your area of expertise. Since you are obviously not impressed with my titles and a pathetic (according to your views) #26 spot on the women's chess rating list, I guess you are the one of the world's top-10 scientists, enterpreneurs, singers, writers, etc.? Or...?
|Aug-07-13|| ||gromguten: I said your user profile, mylady, which says FIDE 2501 :-)|
Natalia Pogonina chessforum
|Aug-07-13|| ||Bureaucrat: <What exactly is your point?>|
I got interested in how you became the reigning Olympic Chess Champion, and I thought others might be interested too. This is a good place to post such information, as it is the Natalia Pogonina player page.
|Aug-07-13|| ||gromguten: I'm well off, thanks :-)|
|Aug-07-13|| ||Natalia Pogonina: <gromguten> Thanks for the heads-up. I have completely forgotten about that profile. Updated now. Hope you are happy. 23 rating points is no joke!!!|
|Aug-07-13|| ||gromguten: You're welcome!|
|Aug-07-13|| ||BlackFront: Padded resume is like padded bra; that we like to know what's on top, doesn't mean we don't like what's underneath.|
<<BlackFront> Grandmaster of Russia is a title that is rewarded for outstanding results in chess - both having a high rating and having performed well at top international official competitions. The RCF has removed the list of title holders from the website for some reason, but I can reassure you that it is by far less common than the GM title.>>
When was this title instituted, or is it a continuation of:
<In 1927, the Soviet Union's Chess Federation established the title of Grandmaster of the Soviet Union, for their own players, since at that time Soviets were not competing outside their own country. This title was abolished in 1931, after having been awarded to Boris Verlinsky, who won the 1929 Soviet Championship. The title was brought back in 1935, and awarded to Mikhail Botvinnik, who thus became the first "official" Grandmaster of the USSR. Verlinsky did not get his title back.>
Is there a formal ceremony of investiture or do you simply get a letter through the post?
|Aug-07-13|| ||Bureaucrat: <while trying to supply them with multiple links and proofs, as if someone was trying to dispute them or conceal the truth.>|
Nope. When sharing information it is customary to provide the sources of that information. Besides, the sources provide <additional> information, for anyone interested.
|Aug-07-13|| ||Natalia Pogonina: <BlackFront> The phrase about a padded bra is witty, but completely irrelevant here, because nothing has been padded at all. |
The title is in some way derived from the one you have mentioned. I guess it exists from the early 90s, but I don't remember the exact date since I was probably a small girl when it was introduced. You can google it as efficiently as myself (hopefully).
There is a formal procedure of application that is identical to the FIDE one - collect documents, certify them, apply, wait for a decision, receive your document and badge (if the application gets approved).
|Aug-07-13|| ||TheFocus: <(a title no one ever heard of, btw.) >|
The following information is supplied by Wikipedia. <Grandmaster (chess)>
<Non-standard and Soviet usage before 1950>
Before 1950, the term grandmaster was sometimes informally applied to other world class players. The Fédération Internationale des Échecs (FIDE, or World Chess Federation) was formed in Paris in 1924, but at that time did not formulate criteria on who should earn the title.
In 1927, the Soviet Union's Chess Federation established the title of Grandmaster of the Soviet Union, for their own players, since at that time Soviets were not competing outside their own country. This title was abolished in 1931, after having been awarded to Boris Verlinsky, who won the 1929 Soviet Championship. The title was brought back in 1935, and awarded to Mikhail Botvinnik, who thus became the first "official" Grandmaster of the USSR. Verlinsky did not get his title back.>
|Aug-07-13|| ||BlackFront: <The phrase about a padded bra is witty...>|
Confucius say it.
<because nothing has been padded at all.>
How about <sexed-up>? It would appear you take umbrage at the implication that you are more concerned with self-promotion than chess promotion, but I don't understand why, as the two are not mutually exclusive. If you do indeed make more from chess than your average 2700+ ELO, then congratulations are in order.
<You can google it as efficiently as myself (hopefully).>
Your Russian is probably slightly better than mine.
<There is a formal procedure of application that is identical to the FIDE one - collect documents, certify them, apply, wait for a decision, receive your document and badge (if the application gets approved).>
I see. I was labouring under the misapprehension that it was bestowed upon one, as if from the gods. Is the title prestigious enough that all eligible players would apply?
|Aug-07-13|| ||TheFocus: <gromgruten> The US also used to award GM titles that were not FIDE titles.|
<On the national rating List, Robert Fischer has a rating of 2626, a U.S. grandmaster's rating. The only other active grandmaster is Samuel Reshevsky with a rating of 2713 – Chess Life, March 5, 1958, pg. 5.>
Fischer had a US GM title before he received his FIDE GM title. He received it when he finished well in Portoroz 1958 qualifying for the Candidates.
|Aug-07-13|| ||gromguten: Thank you TheFocus. Fischer is one of my all time favourite chess players!|
Exciting times, this week we've learned about two gm-titles unknown to mankind :-)
|Aug-07-13|| ||MarkFinan: Gromguten.. It baffles me what goes through people like yours minds.
Even if what you said was true, does it matter? Is it Important to you personally?|
|Aug-07-13|| ||TheFocus: <Exciting times, this week we've learned about two gm-titles unknown to mankind :-)>|
What a stupid remark. Act your age, and not your ignorance.
|Aug-07-13|| ||gromguten: I will be banned from this page now, but that's not important right now.|
Mark Finan, I don't like arrogant braggers, that's all :-)
|Aug-07-13|| ||gromguten: Like jfq and alexmagnus for instance. But I'm done, sorry for the interruption :-)|
< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 17 OF 28 ·