< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 2 OF 3 ·
|Aug-24-04|| ||tintin: Mingrelia??? Where is this place. But it seems like he was a pretty good player, even if he did mostly play weak opponents. Did he have GM status does anybody know?? |
|Aug-24-04|| ||karnak64: Tintin, Mingrelia's in Western Georgia, by which I do not mean the Alabama border (as you might surmise if you're a Yankee)...|
It lost its independence and was annexed by Russia sometime before the Great War.
|Aug-24-04|| ||Zenchess: He was probably only master strength; he hardly ever played any of the established GM's and when he did, he lost.|
Other players of master strength who have a lot of one-sided wins against weaker players include Bill Wall and Emil Joseph Diemer.
|Aug-24-04|| ||otoss: All 28 games of Prince Andrey Dadian of Mingrelia in this page: |
|Aug-24-04|| ||Zenchess: According to the link, Tchigorin was the player who Daidan saw fit to turn away from a tournament for criticizing his games. |
|Oct-16-04|| ||Eatman: Fascinating history information! The prince must have been quite a character. |
|Jan-09-06|| ||SBC: .|
A fellow chessgamesian and I have worked in collusion to try to bring some of Prince Dadian's history to light. Having working with <WilhelmThe2nd> on this for about a year now, I believe anyone interested in Dadian will find something of interest at:
|Jan-09-06|| ||Sneaky: Excellent work as always SBC! It's going to take some time for me to go through everything you've put together. I've always like the Prince's games, real or not. |
Say, you write that there are only 27 games of his known. Here we have 26. Does anybody know which one is missing?
|Jan-10-06|| ||chessgames.com: <SBC> Do you mind if we use parts of your essay to create the biography for this page?|
|Jan-10-06|| ||SBC: <chessgames.com>
be my guest.
Thanks. I believe I have the 27 games. If so, I think one could easily compare and find the odd game.
|Jan-10-06|| ||EmperorAtahualpa: Excellent job on the research you have done, <SBC> and <Wilhelmthe2nd>. I love your site!|
|Jan-10-06|| ||chessgames.com: <SBC> Thanks. We'd also like to appropriate this wonderful photograph http://sbchess.sinfree.net/AndriaDa...|
|Jan-10-06|| ||chessgames.com: Here's the 27th game (it was under a different name) -- Prince Dadian vs NN, 1900|
|Jan-10-06|| ||SBC: <chessgames.com>
Just so you know, I can't tell you the pedigree of the photograph.
Thank you, your majesty.
|Jan-10-06|| ||Laskerfan82: <SBC> That's a great site ... I second the emperor's comments.|
|Jul-02-06|| ||SBC: A game missing on these pages is a consultation game between Dadian & Schiffers vs. Lebedev & Yurevich in 1903.|
This game is of particular interest since Schiffers and Dadian had an argument about move 9 - Dadian insisted on a very dubious piece sacrifice - and Schiffers left rather than to play such a move. Dadian won the game.
I won't post the link to the page detailing that game, but to the main page instead since the story of Dadian should be followed in context.
One will find there several published bios of Dadain (including one by Karpov from the Russian Encyclopedia of Chess, one from the Chess Monthy 1892 and one from the British Chess Magazine 1897), 3 games annotated by Chigorin, some detailed information on Mingrelia and the House of Dadiani, Pictures of Dadian, as well as pictures and details about people involved with Dadian: Chigorin, Panov, Schiffers, Hoffer, Kemény, de Rivière and Duz-Khotimirsky, and, of course more specific information about the tournament at Monte Carlo in 1903 where Chigorin and Dadian had it out.
<Wilhelmthe2nd> did excellent research: http://sbchess.sinfree.net/dadiani....
|Jul-02-06|| ||Calli: <SBC> The discrepency in the dates on the "Cast of Characters" page is only apparent. The old Russian calendar was 13 days behind, so, for instance, October 30 and November 12 are the same day.|
|Jul-02-06|| ||SBC: <Calli>
What a surprisingly odd, though useful, bit of trivia!
|Jul-02-06|| ||TheAlchemist: The Eastern Orthodox church still uses this calendar, e.g. they celebrate Christmas and the New Year on January 7 and 14 respectively.|
|Jul-02-06|| ||Calli: Usually, the dates are converted and old ones omitted to avoid confusion. No one, for instance, gives Alekhine's birthday in the old Russian calendar, although, of course, his birth certificate would not match the date we give today.|
|Jul-08-06|| ||SBC: |
It's a common belief that Prince Dadian's games were either contrived or faked. I used to subscribe to that belief, which has never been conclusively demonstrated, but I'm becoming less and less convinced the more I learn.
Recently <Wilhelmthe2nd> sent me the contents of the 1903 "Literary Digest" article in which Napier annotated the consultation game - Dadian-Schiffers vs. Lebedev-Yurevich and an accompaning article by Isodor Gunsberg from the London "Daily News". (http://sbchess.sinfree.net/Dadian-S...)
As mentioned below, this game, which was given from Schiffer's 1903 Niva chess column, contained the mind-blowing move 9.Nc3?! (http://sbchess.sinfree.net/Dadian-S...) after which Schiffers, who disagreed with the piece sacrifice, left the board.
"Nc3 ... in this particular position the move is somewhat staggering and difficult to deal with by an analyst, we will content ourselves by describing it as an intense effort of Oriental imaginativeness, which may pass without further sacrilegious, cold reasoning comment. It seems, however, that Schiffers is not imbued with the same reverential feeling toward imaginativeness as we are, for he would not give his consent to this move, and actually left the board, only resuming play a few moves later on when he discovered that there is more in such moves than actually meets the eye for the moment."
This doesn't sound like the play of a man who contrived his games.
Dadian, however, was probably rightfully criticized for sending in for publication his wins while conveniently forgetting to send in his losses.
|Oct-31-06|| ||shota: http://tinyurl.com/y2bm93
This page offers two more games by Dadiani (the page is in Ukrainian). It's also said there that a Georgian master Tengiz Giorgadze published a book on him back in 1972. Apparently June-July issue of the Chess Monthly Magazine from 1982 has his bio with a few games. As far as why he didn't participate in official tournaments, Duz-Khotimirsky explains that being a general and a high-ranking official he couldn't do it. Though Duz is a source of various accusations against Dadiani, from his memoirs published in Duz's "Selected games" it seems that at least their game from 1901 which appears in the database wasn't pre-arranged. V. Panov seems to be a vehement critic of Dadiani (unrelated to this topic, but Panov is known for some weird opinions), but on the other hand Peter Romanovsky was supportive of Giorgadze's research. I also read somewhere that in 1955 in his book "Shkola shakhmatnoi igri" Alexander Koblents published a game by anonymous players which he said he picked from some old German magazine. It turned out that the winner actually was Dadiani and the game was played in 1887 somewhere in Western Georgia. In his 1962 republication Koblents indicated Dadiani's name. I have this book, but it's rather difficult to browse through it since it has no index. Will try to locate the game...
|Oct-31-06|| ||Calli: <shota> Is that another game against Kolisch? барон І. КОЛІШ is Baron I. Kolisch, yes? However, the date is 1891 and Kolisch died in 1889. Maybe I misunderstood.|
|Oct-31-06|| ||shota: <Calli> Yes it's another game against Kolisch which they claim was played in 1891. I'm also puzzled by the date. Maybe it was published in 1891 and they mistook it for a date it was played?!|
|Oct-31-06|| ||Calli: <shota> The game is actually the well-known Prince Dadian vs Kolisch, 1867 Don't know why they errored on the date.|
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