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Bobsterman3000
Member since Nov-16-03 · Last seen Jul-19-18
"Please allow me the possibility of finding good moves by myself at the board."

-- Nigel Short, surprised after being told that one of his wins was due to superior opening preparation (2008).

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   Bobsterman3000 has kibitzed 19564 times to chessgames   [more...]
   Jul-19-18 Jeremy Lim
 
Bobsterman3000: And people having been saying this for (literally) 10 years now, but it's for real this time. The Spurs are finally DONE. Their 21-year playoff run is going to be over.
 
   Jul-19-18 Kenneth S Rogoff (replies)
 
Bobsterman3000: Home Office had information on Rotherham grooming gangs in 2002 but failed to act, review finds: https://www.independent.co.uk/news/... <"The independent inquiry said an unpublished Home Office research report from 2002 described the extent of child sexual exploitation in ...
 
   Jul-18-18 thegoodanarchist chessforum (replies)
 
Bobsterman3000: <BP: I must slightly disagree with the notion that I consider <TGA> to be something of an improved version of <Jim Bartle> the <tuna from saffuna>. > <BP>, <welcome back and thanks for not calling me "new and improved" ><Jim ...
 
   Jul-16-18 Bobsterman3000 chessforum (replies)
 
Bobsterman3000: This Russia obsession stuff is getting too funny for words!!
 
   Jul-15-18 Kibitzer's Café (replies)
 
Bobsterman3000: <Mark F> is sill distraught but found himself a big, strong shoulder on which he can blubber his sorrows away. https://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/newpix/...
 
(replies) indicates a reply to the comment.

Kibitzer's Corner
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Jul-11-18
Premium Chessgames Member
  Dr Winston OBoogie: Tale of the tribe Edit
A long poem often functions to tell a "tale of the tribe," or a story that encompasses a whole culture's values and history. Ezra Pound coined the phrase, referring to his own long poem The Cantos. The long poem's length and scope can contain concerns of a magnitude that a shorter poem cannot address. The poet may see himself or herself as the "bearer of the light," to use Langston Hughes' term, who leads the journey through a culture's story, or as the one who makes known the light already within the tribe. The poet may also serve as a poet-prophet with special insight for their own tribe.

In Modern and Contemporary long poems the "tale of the tribe" has frequently been retold by culturally, economically, and socially marginalized persons. Thus, pseudo-epic narratives, such as Derek Walcott's "Omeros," have emerged to occupy voids where post colonial persons, racially oppressed persons, women, and other people who have been ignored by classic epics, and denied a voice in the prestigious genre.

Revisionary mythopoesis Edit
Various poets have undertaken a "revisionary mythopoesis" in the long poem genre. Since the genre has roots in forms that traditionally exclude poets who have minimal cultural authority, the long poem can be a "fundamental re-vision," and function as a discourse for those poets (Friedman). These "re-visions" may include neglected characters, deflation of traditionally celebrated characters, and a general reworking of standards set by the literary tradition. This revision is noted especially by feminist critical work that analyzes how women are given a new voice and story through the transformation of a previously "masculine" form.

Cultural commentary Edit
Lynn Keller notes that the long poem enabled modernists to include sociological, anthropological, and historical material. Many long poems deal with history not in the revisionary sense but as a simple re-telling in order to prove a point. Then there are those who go a step further and recite a place's or people's history in order to teach. Like revisionary mythopoesis, they may attempt to make a point or demonstrate a new perspective by exaggerating or editing certain parts of a history.

Jul-11-18
Premium Chessgames Member
  Dr Winston OBoogie: Concerns and controversies Edit
Fears of the writer Edit
Long poem authors sometimes find great difficulty in making the entire poem coherent and/or deciding on a way to end it or wrap it up. Fear of failure is also a common concern, that perhaps the poem will not have as great an impact as intended. Since many long poems take the author's lifetime to complete, this concern is especially troubling to anyone who attempts the long poem. Ezra Pound is an example of this dilemma, with his poem The Cantos.[3] As the long poem's roots lie in the epic, authors of the long poem often feel an intense pressure to make their long poems the defining literature of the national identity or the shared identity of a large group of people. The American long poem is under pressure from its European predecessors, revealing a special variety of this anxiety. Walt Whitman tried to achieve this idea of characterizing the American identity in Song of Myself. Thus, when the author feels that their work fails to reach such a caliber or catalyze a change within the intended audience, they might consider the poem a failure as a whole.

Poets attempting to write a long poem often struggle to find the right form or combination of forms to use. Since the long poem itself cannot be strictly defined by one certain form, a challenge lies in choosing the most effective form.[4]

Generic conundrums Edit
Inclusivity

The long poem has been considered a problematic genre for women writers. Its roots in epic make the genre appear to be non-inclusive of female writers. This is due to the epic's long history of being primarily a realm of writing for men.[5]

Lyric intensity

Some critics, most emphatically Edgar Allan Poe, consider poetry as a whole to be more closely tied to the lyric. They complain that the emotional intensity involved within a lyric is impossible to maintain in the length of the long poem, thus rendering the long poem impossible or inherently a failure.[6]

In his article "The long poem: sequence or consequence?" Ted Weiss quotes a passage from M. L. Rozenthal and Sally M. Gall's "The Modern Poetic Sequence" inspired by Poe's sentiments, "What we term a long poem is, in fact, merely a succession of brief ones.... It is needless to demonstrate that a poem is such, only inasmuch as it intensely excites, by elevating, the soul; and all intense excitements are, through a psychal-necessity, brief. For this reason, at least one half of the Paradise Lost is essentially prose—a succession of poetical excitements interspersed, inevitably,with corresponding depressions—the whole being deprived, through the extremities of its length, of the vastly important artistic element, totality, or unity, of effect. In short, a poem to be truly a poem should not exceed a half hour's reading. In any case, no unified long poem is possible."[7]

Multivocality

One genre theory claims that once a poem takes on multiple voices, it becomes a novel. Many long poems do make use of multiple voices, while still maintaining all the element of a poem, and therefore cause even more confusion when trying to define their genre.[citation needed]

Naming and subgenres

Critic Lynn Keller also expresses concerns about the genre in her essay "Pushing the Limits." Keller states that because of the debate over and prevalence of subgenres and forms within the overarching genre of long poem, critics and readers tend to choose one subgenre, typically the epic form, as being the "authentic" representative form of the genre. Therefore, this causes the other equally important subgenres to be subject to criticism for not adhering to the more "authentic" form of long poem.[8] Other critics of the long poem sometimes hold the belief that with long poems, there is no "middle ground." They view long poems as ultimately being either epics or lyrics.[citation needed]

Many critics refer to the long poem by various adjective-filled subgenre names that often are made of various components found within the poem. These can lead to confusion about what a long poem is exactly. Below you will find a list describing the most common (and agreed upon) subgenre categories.[3]

Jul-11-18
Premium Chessgames Member
  Bobsterman3000: <Winston> C'mon now.

Don't make me do it.

Jul-11-18
Premium Chessgames Member
  Dr Winston OBoogie: You want 45732 more pages? Okay then, lol. STOP MOCKING ENGLAND!! USED TO BE MY HOMIE.... 🦁 🦁 🦁! 🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧 🖕🇺🇸
Jul-11-18
Premium Chessgames Member
  Count Wedgemore: <Dr.Winston OBoogie: Many critics refer to the long poem by various adjective-filled subgenre names that often are made of various components found within the poem.>

That approach seems strikingly idiosyncratic and cannot be effectively used as a foundation for making some standardized generalization of rules for the long poem and its structural characteristics in a meaningful way that is both objectively persuasive and productive for further literary analysis and study.

Jul-11-18
Premium Chessgames Member
  Bobsterman3000: Thanks for the great contributions, boys. One of my undergrad degrees is in English Literature.

<Winston> I was writing papers on Wyatt and Surrey while you were studying at the SOHK. LOL

My upper-level coursework included Samuel Johnson's dictionary, as well as Marlowe's tragedies.

Jul-11-18
Premium Chessgames Member
  Count Wedgemore: <Bobsterman3000: ..Marlowe's tragedies.>

I'm more into Philip than Christopher.

Jul-11-18
Premium Chessgames Member
  Bobsterman3000: < Count Wedgemore: <Bobsterman3000: ..Marlowe's tragedies.> I'm more into Philip than Christopher.>

What about Ibsen? What's his real reputation in Norwegian schools today?

The thing about 16th-17th century English is the sheer beauty of the language. (as seen in the King James Bible, for instance)

But I never was good with meter so I sucked at writing poetry myself.

Jul-11-18
Premium Chessgames Member
  Dr Winston OBoogie: <<Count Wedgemore: <Bobsterman3000: ..Marlowe's tragedies. <<<I'm more into Philip than Christopher>>>>>

^^ I see you two are getting on. I'm gonna check in tomorrow (or Friday or Saturday) and talk about this World Cup in the cafe, Wedgie. I know you don't want to miss that.

Bobbi ^^^^ You're <filthy!> 😂 😂 😂

Jul-12-18
Premium Chessgames Member
  Count Wedgemore: <Bobsterman3000: What about Ibsen? What's his real reputation in Norwegian schools today?>

His reputation is stellar and on very solid ground. Both in the school curriculum and among the general public.

As I am sure you well know, as time passes, many literary greats of the past are the subject of reassessment, and the more problematic aspects of their personality, outlook and writings are scrutinized and revised.

This process is in my opinion both unnecessary and unjustified. Too often past writers are judged by today's standards and not the standards of their era. They are seen through a "modern day" lens, one could say.

In your country, the USA, this seems to have gone totally overboard in the last few years: I recently read about a "reassessment" of Mark Twain's writings based on the assumption that he held "demeaning views on native Americans". Absolute madness.

And just last week I read about the wonderful American writer Laura Ingalls Wilder (well known here in Norway because of the TV series based on her biographical "Little House on the Prairie" books, one of the most popular television shows ever to have been broadcast on Norwegian TV) and an award named after her, the 'Laura Ingalls Wilder Medal'. Well, the award was recently renamed 'the Childrenfs Literature Legacy Award' in light of: "..alleged racist language in Wilder's works which the American Library Association perceived as biased against Native Americans and African Americans".

Oh, the wonders of Cultural Marxism!

Unfortunately I see more and more of this nonsense, here in Norway as well. Perceived "racism" and "misogynism" in classical literary works are being highlighted and condemned.

Not so for Ibsen, though. He has by and large steered clear of the poisonous revisionism of the Cultural Marxists. He is widely considered a progressive, a man that was in many ways ahead of his time, for instance in his view on women (as I'm sure you know, one of his most famous plays, 'A Doll's House', is about the emancipation of a woman from the bourgeoisie). So he is safe, for now..and highly revered here in Norway, by almost everyone.

<The thing about 16th-17th century English is the sheer beauty of the language. (as seen in the King James Bible, for instance)>

Oh, absolutely. And I did in fact in my youth read Marlowe's 'Doctor Faustus'. But since English is not my first language I remember I struggled a bit with understanding all the words..after all, it was written some centuries ago! But I wasn't really nspired by it, not the same way that Shakespeare inspired me, later (when I read English better). My own poetry is more Baudelaire than Shakespeare, though (and some Scandinavian poets that you probably (and naturally) don't know that much about, like Karin Boye, a Swedish literary genius and one of the most remarkable women I can think of).

<But I never was good with meter so I sucked at writing poetry myself.>

Then forget about the metres, it doesn't have ro be metric. Do your own thing: it doesn't have to rhyme and you can make up your own rules..seriously. Poetry allows for experimentation.

Jul-12-18
Premium Chessgames Member
  thegoodanarchist: <Oh, the wonders of Cultural Marxism!

Unfortunately I see more and more of this nonsense, here in Norway as well. Perceived "racism" and "misogynism" in classical literary works are being highlighted and condemned.>

Yes, it's appalling! Cultural Marxism is literally destroying Western Societies. This is one reason Trump won.

Jul-13-18
Premium Chessgames Member
  Bobsterman3000: <Count Wedgemore> I am thoroughly impressed that a Norwegian despises cultural Marxism!!

I thought you were all like that <Bureaucrat> guy.

Jul-13-18
Premium Chessgames Member
  Count Wedgemore: <Bobsterman3000: I thought you were all like that <Bureaucrat> guy.>

No, there are actually quite a few people like me up here, but it's dangerous speaking out, so mostly we have to hide and meet in secret :)

All jokes aside, Cultural Marxism has indeed invaded all spheres of public discourse here, and as a Christian Conservative in a VERY liberal country I do feel a little alone now and then (he muttered in a sorrowful voice wiping a tear from his eye)..LOL.

By the way, I enjoy very much reading your posts on the Rogoff page. I only wish that the discussions were a little more civil, too many insults flying around all the time. But, keep up the good work! You are a really good debater.

Jul-14-18
Premium Chessgames Member
  Dr Winston OBoogie: <Haiku as Queer Tourism: From Bashō to David Trinidad JUSTIN SHERWOOD DEC 11, 2013 CRITICAL PERVERSION MULTI PAGE SHARE ON FACEBOOK SHARE ON TWITTER Coming out is a form of travel. First, the metaphor of removal: the ostensibly heterosexual subject is located one place (in the closet, what have you) and then must move out to another. This idea has been tacitly accepted through the stock phrase of gay liberation, but even tourism scholars acknowledge that gay subjects have a particular affinity for travel, beginning from that first shattering movement. Howard L. Hughes, in an article in Tourism Management, argues that the travel requirement for the gay subject becomes an indelible part of her identity: “Given that the fulfillment or achievement of gay identity often involves travel and is thus, in practice, a variation of tourism, it may also be argued that the search for gay identity is itself conceptually a form of tourism.” [1] To come out as gay is to be a tourist.

Tourism finds its poetic form in the Japanese haiku and haibun. Matsuo Bashō (1644-1694), among the most revered of the haiku masters by modern poets, belonged to a tradition wherein removal and homosocial formations were inextricable from poetic practice. [2] Haiku, commonly translated from the Japanese into three-line poems with seventeen syllables (five syllables in the first and last lines, seven in the middle), are complicated little machines. Traditional haiku capture a moment in nature, speak of the poet’s emotional resonance with that moment, and also demonstrate the poet’s knowledge of the haiku tradition. Bashō’s most famous haiku, for reference (here translated into four lines):

Breaking the silence
Of an ancient pond,
A frog jumped into water—
A deep resonance.

In order to link these moments into a cohesive travel narrative, Bashō turned to a variation on the haiku form, the haibun. Haibun are texts comprised of both prose and haiku, and the integration of the haiku into the prose should be seamless. An example of Bashō’s haibun:

Mount Kurokami was visible through the mist in the distance. It was brilliantly white with snow in spite of its name, which means black hair.

Rid of my hair,
I came to Mount Kurokami,
On the day we put on
Clean summer clothes.[3]>

Part one of 2217 :)

Jul-14-18
Premium Chessgames Member
  Dr Winston OBoogie: <<<Haibun are extended, sometimes book-length poetic sequences. The prose is used to advance the narrative, whereas the haiku pause to capture a single moment or image the poet encounters on his journey. Haiku and haibun were traditionally written collaboratively by two master, male poets. In the excerpt above, Bashō wrote the prose passage, while his compatriot Sora wrote the haiku. In Bashō’s time, the poetic tradition was dominated by men, and the world of haiku composition, as well as the content of the poems, was entirely homosocial: men writing to, of, for, with, men.

In 1981, poet John Ashbery discovered Hiroaki Sato and Burton Watson’s newly published anthology of Japanese poetry, From the Country of Eight Islands.[4] Ashbery began experimenting with the haiku and haibun forms, both of which would appear in his poetry collection, A Wave (Viking Press,1984). Midway through that collection, a sequence of five haibun appears, each titled “Haibun” with a corresponding number. As the critic John Shoptaw notes, these haibun are hugely significant poems in John Ashbery’s oeuvre, as the first poem from the sequence, <“Haibun,” is the only poem in his considerable body of work to use the word “homosexuality,” and indeed the entire 5-haibun sequence is concerned with homosexual encounter—a rare, explicit treatment of homosexuality as a subject by the poet who otherwise does not overtly thematize homosexuality in his poetry. [5]>

Jul-14-18
Premium Chessgames Member
  Bobsterman3000: <Count Wedgemore: <Bobsterman3000: I thought you were all like that <Bureaucrat> guy.> No, there are actually quite a few people like me up here, but it's dangerous speaking out, so mostly we have to hide and meet in secret :)>

How many of you are there, <Count Wedgemore>? You have a roundabout count? Enough to form 2 Nordic divisions? :-)

We can smuggle you weapons through the arctic route. :-)

Just kidding.

Now watch <Winston O'Foolish> go berzerk-o-bonkers monkey bananas crazy at that joke.

Jul-14-18
Premium Chessgames Member
  Count Wedgemore: <Bobsterman3000: We can smuggle you weapons through the arctic route>

Thanks, but no thanks. We Norwegians are a peaceful lot, and not so fond of weapons as you yanks are. Besides, it's really too cold up here for an armed uprising. Revolutions need hot heads and hot weather (probably the reason why Quebec never bothered to break out of Canada, hehe). No, it's better to play the long game and work from the inside to MNGA (Make Norway Great Again) :=

Jul-15-18
Premium Chessgames Member
  Bobsterman3000: <Count Wedgemore> I appreciate you noticing how much liberal butt I've been kicking in the Rogoff forum as of late.

I won't specify any names, but several of the regular posters in there won't dare tussle with me at all, after seeing me embarrass <Jim> and <Al Wazir> with regularity. They will simply back out of discussion on a topic if I jump into the fray.

The liberals in there have very poor debate skills and react in emotive ways with little foresight or foreknowledge of the subjects at hand - flaws very common amongst dingbat cultural marxists.

<Winston> is a different case entirely, he just argues about whatever he sees on Lady Gaga's Instagram feed that morning.

Jul-15-18
Premium Chessgames Member
  thegoodanarchist: < Count Wedgemore:

it's better to play the long game and work from the inside to MNGA (Make Norway Great Again)>

Yes, but I cannot pronounce MNGA. Or, if I do, it sounds like Manga.

I propose MaNoGA!

Jul-15-18
Premium Chessgames Member
  Count Wedgemore: <tga: I propose MaNoGA>

I like the sound of that. MANOGA it is.

Jul-15-18
Premium Chessgames Member
  Count Wedgemore: <Bobsterman3000: The liberals in there have very poor debate skills and react in emotive ways with little foresight or foreknowledge of the subjects at hand - flaws very common amongst dingbat cultural marxists.>

Well, the problem for liberals is that their arguments are seldom based on facts, so in order for them to make their case they have to be duplicitous or outright lie, most of the time.

And yes, I've noticed that several of the regular Rogoff posters have become a little reluctant to engage you in the debates..you should take it as a compliment!

Jul-15-18
Premium Chessgames Member
  TheFocus: <Bobsterman3000: <Count Wedgemore> I appreciate you noticing how much liberal butt I've been kicking in the Rogoff forum as of late. I won't specify any names, but several of the regular posters in there won't dare tussle with me at all, after seeing me embarrass <Jim> and <Al Wazir> with regularity. They will simply back out of discussion on a topic if I jump into the fray. The liberals in there have very poor debate skills and react in emotive ways with little foresight or foreknowledge of the subjects at hand - flaws very common amongst dingbat cultural marxists.>

I don't post a lot, but I do enjoy watching you tear them limb from limb on a daily basis.

Jul-15-18
Premium Chessgames Member
  diceman: <Bobsterman3000:

<Count Wedgemore> I appreciate you noticing how much liberal butt I've been kicking in the Rogoff forum as of late. >

You should get some type of special award after the Trump election.

Their lies actually broke Richter's scale!

Jul-16-18
Premium Chessgames Member
  Bobsterman3000: This Russia obsession stuff is getting too funny for words!!
Jul-17-18
Premium Chessgames Member
  thegoodanarchist: <Bob> this is what happens when people abandon the scientific method.

With the scientific method, we form a hypothesis. Then we test it, analyze the data, and come to a conclusion.

Trump haters start with the conclusion, and then interpret the world to fit the predetermined conclusion. Reality is not permitted to enter into the discussion, if it contradicts the already formed conclusion.

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