< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 554 OF 554 ·
|Aug-17-17|| ||saffuna: <Generals don't "want" things. They follow commands.>|
He had a choice: stay with the US Army, or join the Confederate Army, which had the express goal of breaking up the United States.
|Aug-17-17|| ||technical draw: <saffuna> Sorry, my long time friend, but I believe your understanding about what an army is and does is flawed.|
|Aug-17-17|| ||saffuna: No it is not. Lee (whom I do admire) had a choice: remain in the US Army or join the Confederate Army.|
|Aug-17-17|| ||technical draw: <understanding about what an army is and does is flawed.>|
See? I'm talking about an army and you're talking about a specific General.
|Aug-17-17|| ||cormier: Gospel
Jesus answered, "I say to you, not seven times but forgive up to seventy-seven times.
|Aug-17-17|| ||cormier: http://www.usccb.org/bible/readings...|
|Aug-17-17|| ||saffuna: Exactly. I started talking about a specific general and continue to do the same.|
Lee chose to leave the US Army and fight against it. Nobody gave him an order to do that.
|Aug-17-17|| ||technical draw: Generals don't fight anyone without orders. Even generals are subject to a hierarchy.|
|Aug-17-17|| ||technical draw: I don't like these debates with friends so I'll quit and leave you with the soothing Beethoven 5th piano concerto:|
|Aug-18-17|| ||cormier: Gospel
"He said to them, "Because of the hardness of your hearts
Moses allowed you to divorce your wives,
but from the beginning it was not so."
|Aug-18-17|| ||cormier: http://www.usccb.org/bible/readings...|
|Aug-18-17|| ||playground player: <optimal play> I've been reading <Barrakee> and enjoying it very much, although I can see how Upfield refined his technique as he gained in experience as a writer. I do find shocking some of the racial remarks by some of the white characters who don't seem to think the murder of an aborigine ought to count as a serious crime. But I don't think Upfield would have put them in if he hadn't heard them himself at one time or another.|
<Big Pawn> You're awfully hard on my friend <saffuna>, who is welcome here even though we disagree about virtually everything except the SF Giants.
<Esteemed Colleagues> For your enjoyment, I offer a wee satire:
|Aug-18-17|| ||optimal play: <playground player: <optimal play> I've been reading <Barrakee> and enjoying it very much, although I can see how Upfield refined his technique as he gained in experience as a writer. I do find shocking some of the racial remarks by some of the white characters who don't seem to think the murder of an aborigine ought to count as a serious crime. But I don't think Upfield would have put them in if he hadn't heard them himself at one time or another.>|
I think 'The Barrakee Mystery' was written in the late 1920's and our history would indicate that Upfield accurately reflects the prevailing attitude of white Australia to aborigines at that time.
I won't say anything further until you've finished.
<<Big Pawn> You're awfully hard on my friend <saffuna>> Our good mate BP is hard on everybody but we've all become accustomed to his irascible character by now.
No one takes it personally.
|Aug-19-17|| ||cormier: this is some of the emissions i liked to listen when i was very young ,along with mr.dressup and the friendly giant ... https://ca.search.yahoo.com/yhs/sea...|
|Aug-19-17|| ||cormier: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r2J...|
|Aug-19-17|| ||playground player: <cormier> Thanks for the video--very pleasant.|
|Aug-19-17|| ||cormier: Gospel
"Let the children come to me,
for the Kingdom of heaven belongs to such as these."
|Aug-19-17|| ||cormier: http://www.usccb.org/bible/readings...|
|Aug-20-17|| ||cormier: Gospel
Then Jesus said to her in reply,
"O woman, great is your faith!
Let it be done for you as you wish."
|Aug-20-17|| ||cormier: http://www.usccb.org/bible/readings...|
|Aug-20-17|| ||playground player: <optimal play> I have to say I was disappointed in the resolution of <The Barrakee Mystery>. Apparently it was widely believed, in the first half of the 20th century, that "blood" would make a person behave as his "race" behaved: that is, one inherits learned behavior. Scratch a Darwinist, find a Lamarckian. Edgar Rice Burroughs made that a big part of <Tarzan of the Apes>, published in 1914: descended from English nobility, even though he was raised by apes, Tarzan would just naturally behave as an English lord and gentleman. So in Upfield's book, Ralph, because his father was an aborigine, just can't help falling for a black girl and "going bush." It's in his blood.|
It's in Bony's blood, too, but Bony overcomes it by learning to use it in the pursuit of is career.
Otherwise, <Barrakee> is a good start to a great series.
|Aug-21-17|| ||optimal play: <playground player> Yes, Upfield reflects the prevailing attitudes of his time and place, both as regards hereditary assumptions and cultural prejudice. Certain suppositions I had never before heard perplexed me. For example...|
'"Like many half-caste children — even like myself — the baby was white of skin. For years the black strain in his blood was held in abeyance by his upbringing and education; for years the pigmentation of his skin remained white. But the inevitable change of colour began much earlier than the heredity of character. The cessation of college life, the return to the native bush of his father, hastened the hereditary urge, so that Ralph’s reversion to ancestral blackness was accelerated."'
I doubt there's any evidence that this is typical of "half-caste children".
You highlight the contrast of Ralph with Bony, the only difference being that Bony's father was white and his mother black, whilst Ralph's father was black and his mother white; not something that would significantly affect their respective maturation.
I'm not sure to what extent the racism in the book is an attempt by Upfield to highlight its disturbing aspect or just matter-of-factly part of the environment in which the story is set.
'Kate shivered. “I hate black people,” she said. “Every time I look at them I go cold, especially when I see the whites of their eyes. If one came for me, or ran after me, I’d die.”'
And Kate's one the sympathetic characters!
Anyway, I always find the introductory book of a series important in that it enables the reader to identify how and when the protagonist first appears. It's something I'll keep in mind as I read Bony's subsequent adventures.
|Aug-21-17|| ||playground player: <optimal play> If I may be allowed what seems to be an ignorant question, why would Upfield write that half-caste babies "turn black" as they mature into adulthood, if he hadn't observed it? Was belief in this so strong that people "saw" it even if it didn't happen?|
I mean, most of us know interracial couples, right? Their babies are not born white and then turn black as they age. Who ever heard of such a thing?
<Barrakee> was published in 1929. To the extent that the racism in the book shocks you and me today, to that extent the world has changed. But no one who has read more than a couple of Upfield's books can accuse him of racism.
As for the inheritance of learned behaviors--well, there are still people who seem to believe in that, and some of them call themselves scientists... and very many of them are collidge prefessers.
|Aug-21-17|| ||cormier: Gospel
Jesus said to him, "If you wish to be perfect, go,
sell what you have and give to the poor,
and you will have treasure in heaven.
|Aug-21-17|| ||cormier: http://www.usccb.org/bible/readings...|
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