|
< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 2 OF 2 ·
Later Kibitzing > |
Dec-21-04
 |
| Benzol: Sarah, that's great! The info I have in some cases is sketchy at best and if you and the others can offer more I'm pleased to see it.
So far as Mary Bain's concerned I have no games of hers which is a pity but there is this one
M Bain vs Santasiere, 1939 which may or may not be her listed in the database.
Look forward to more from you . I'll keep posting the info I have out of date though it maybe to help things along.
:) |
 |
| Dec-21-04 |
| OJC: Ba4? Wow, I never thought I would see such a blunder from Capablanca, blindfold simul or not. < SBC > Do you know how many opponents were in the simul? Was Capablanca generally a strong blindfold player (like Morphy/Alekhine)? Thanks. |
|
| Dec-21-04 |
| SBC: <Benzol>
I would guess M Bain vs Santasiere, 1939 would be our Mary Bain since I can't imagine any other M. Bain playing in 1939. Here's her win vs. Belova. I think Belova threw away her game with that unsound rook sacrifice (a blunder?) [Event "WWC candidates tournament"]
[Site "Moscow"]
[Date "1952.10.??"]
[Round "-"]
[White "Bain, Mary(Weiser)"]
[Black "Belova, Valentina"]
[Result "1-0"]
1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 g6 3. Nc3 Bg7 4. e4 d6 5. Bg5 O-O 6. f4 c5 7. Nf3 cxd4 8.
Nxd4 Qb6 9. Nf3 Ng4 10. Qd2 Nc6 11. Nd5 Qd8 12. h3 Nf6 13. Bd3 Nxd5 14.
cxd5 Nd4 15. Nxd4 Bxd4 16. Bc4 Qb6 17. Rb1 Bd7 18. Ke2 Rac8 19. Bd3 e6 20.
dxe6 Bxe6 21. b3 Rfe8 22. Rhc1 f5 23. Kf3 Bd5 24. Rxc8 fxe4+ 25. Kg3 Rxc8
26. Bf1 Rc3+ 27. Kh2 Kg7 28. Rd1 Bg1+ 29. Kh1 Rxh3+ 30. gxh3 e3+ 31. Qxd5
h6 32. Bh4 e2 33. Bxe2 black resigns
1-0
<OJC>
I don't know anything about Capablanca's talent as a blindfold player, though he apparently did play some. I had that game for a long time, but I didn't know if it was fake or not. Then I came across an article on Mary Bain that specifically mentioned that game - so I knew then it was real. |
|
| Dec-21-04 |
| Milo: She's also the governor on "The Simpsons", I think ;). |
|
| Dec-22-04 |
| OJC: Thanks < SBC >
Regarding the above blindfold game, my ancient Saitek GK2100 comp gives the following line instead of 10. Ba4? 10. f3 Re7 11. Ba4 b5 12. Bb3 a5 (eval -0.6; depth 11 ply) This doesn't much surprise me because Capa's game was not looking too good even before his 10th move. However, the GK2100 comp analysis with Capa's move is the following: 10. Ba4 Ne2+ 11. Kh1 Nxc1 12. Nc5 Rh4 (eval -2.6; depth 11 ply) I find it interesting to see how great players handle the handicap of being blindfold. I guess some have a better knack for it than others. Morphy's blindfold games, for example, seem to be of particularly high quality ; full of complications and essentially free of errors. His blindfold games are in fact almost indistiguishable from his sighted games to me (I hope this says more about Morphy than me). Other greats sometimes make serious blunders, such as Capablanca in this game or Karpov ("forgetting" about his Queen on his 13th move in the game below). Karpov vs Sadler, 1998 |
|
| Feb-27-05 |
| RichWhy: Hi, I am the grandson of Mary Bain. I don't know much about this match or does my mother, but she was a great player who never did as well against women as she did in open tourneys. Mary was a great blindfold and simul payer herself and always played men better than women. I think that's why she only won a single woman's title. In any case if anyone has some specific questions, I can see about getting some answers. I also have some of her memorabilia that I can look through Regards... |
|
| Feb-27-05 |
| WMD: <I don't know anything about Capablanca's talent as a blindfold player, though he apparently did play some. I had that game for a long time, but I didn't know if it was fake or not. Then I came across an article on Mary Bain that specifically mentioned that game - so I knew then it was real.> On the strength of its mention alone or because of the credibility of the source? Edward Winter's book on Capablanca (1989) is agnostic: 'The score exists of a 1933 loss to Mary Bain that was briefer, although contemporary sources are inconsistent. See C.N.s 1653 and 1804.' It's not clear if Winter is uncertain about the game's authenticity or the score itself. Perhaps <RichWhy> or someone with access to the relevant Chess Notes could shed some light on the matter. |
|
Feb-27-05
 |
| Calli: I don't have the early Chess Notes, but have a comment in my database: "According to Chess Life & Review, January 1973 it is claimed that when Capablanca resigned at move 12, Black 'would not accept victory and conceded the game as a draw. Raul graciously accepted' " Fo course that doesn't clear anything up, but thought it was interesting. |
|
| Feb-27-05 |
| WMD: I wonder if Capa also graciously invited Mary to his hotel room. With suitable apologies to <Richwhy>. |
|
| Feb-27-05 |
| RichWhy: If she accepted the invite, could my mommy be Capa's love child? :) |
|
| Feb-27-05 |
| SBC: <On the strength of its mention alone or because of the credibility of the source?> The credibility of source of the article.
<RichWhy>
Why don't you make a site on your grandmother? |
|
Apr-15-05
 |
| refutor: was there not an article on her last year in chess life, including some games? maybe the only game listed was the one v. belova...i'll have to go see if i can dig up the issue |
|
| Apr-15-05 |
| aragorn69: <chessgames.com> Your database gives Capa as Black (and winner) in the blindfold game cited above by <SBC> (whereas she gives Capa as White, i.e. the loser). Any explanation for this discrepancy ? Anyone with access to the early Chess Notes ? |
|
| Apr-15-05 |
| aragorn69: After looking at the other games here attributed to Mary Bain, I must say I am pretty sure that Capa was Black (as stands in cg's database) in that blindfold game... Ms. Bain was no stranger to losing pawns or pieces in the opening, which was not exactly the Cuban's case. Sorry <RichWhy> ;-) |
|
| Apr-15-05 |
| Jamespawn: I entered this game with Capa in the computer and it has Black winning. I wonder why he resigned ? |
|
| Apr-15-05 |
| Jamespawn: I see one poster that says Capa was white so that makes more sense. |
|
| Apr-15-05 |
| marekg248: <aragorn69> Chess explorations by Edward Winter has it this way: J.R.Capablanca (simultaneous) - M. Bain, Hollywood, 21 May 1933 (CN 1653) |
|
Apr-16-05
|
| refutor: i was able to dig up some mary bain games from the megabase...there's a bunch of games from the 1963 olympiad as well, but not against anyone i've heard of...i will post some of them and submit them [Event "Ventnor City"]
[Site "Ventnor City"]
[Date "1939.??.??"]
[Round "11"]
[White "Bain, Mary"]
[Black "Ulvestad, Olaf"]
[Result "1/2-1/2"]
[ECO "B02"]
[PlyCount "55"]
[EventDate "1939.??.??"]
[SourceDate "2005.01.01"]
1. e4 Nf6 2. Nc3 d5 3. exd5 Nxd5 4. Nf3 Bg4 5. Be2 Nf4 6. O-O Nxe2+ 7. Qxe2 c6
8. d3 e6 9. h3 Bh5 10. Ne4 Qc7 11. Ng3 Bg6 12. b3 Nd7 13. Bb2 O-O-O 14. Ne5
Nxe5 15. Bxe5 Bd6 16. Bxd6 Qxd6 17. Rfe1 Qc5 18. a4 Rd5 19. Rac1 Rhd8 20. Qe3
Qa5 21. Ne4 h6 22. Nd2 Bxd3 23. cxd3 Rxd3 24. Nc4 Qb4 25. Qxa7 Rxb3 26. Ne5 Qb6
27. Nxc6 bxc6 28. Qa8+ 1/2-1/2
[Event "Ventnor City"]
[Site "Ventnor City"]
[Date "1939.??.??"]
[Round "3"]
[White "Reinfeld, Fred"]
[Black "Bain, Mary"]
[Result "1-0"]
[ECO "D61"]
[PlyCount "101"]
[EventDate "1939.??.??"]
[SourceDate "2005.01.01"]
1. Nf3 Nf6 2. c4 e6 3. d4 d5 4. Nc3 Be7 5. Bg5 O-O 6. e3 Nbd7 7. Qc2 c6 8. Rd1
h6 9. Bf4 Qa5 10. Nd2 Re8 11. Be2 Bf8 12. O-O e5 13. dxe5 Nxe5 14. Nb3 Qb6 15.
cxd5 cxd5 16. Nxd5 Nxd5 17. Rxd5 Ng6 18. Bg3 a6 19. Rd4 Be6 20. Bc4 Rac8 21.
Qe2 Ne5 22. Bxe5 Bxc4 23. Rxc4 Rxc4 24. Qxc4 Rxe5 25. Rd1 Re8 26. Rd7 Re7 27.
Rxe7 Bxe7 28. Qc8+ Bf8 29. g3 g6 30. Qd7 Bg7 31. Qe8+ Bf8 32. Qd7 Bg7 33. Qd2
h5 34. h4 Kh7 35. Qd5 Kg8 36. Nc5 Qxb2 37. Nxb7 Bf8 38. Nd8 Qf6 39. Nc6 Kh7 40.
Kg2 Kg8 41. e4 Qe6 42. Qxe6 fxe6 43. Nd8 e5 44. Kf3 Kg7 45. Ne6+ Kf7 46. Nxf8
Kxf8 47. Ke3 Ke7 48. Kd3 Kd6 49. Kc4 Kc6 50. f3 Kd6 51. f4 1-0 [Event "Hollywood op"]
[Site "Hollywood"]
[Date "1954.??.??"]
[Round "?"]
[White "Rossolimo, Nicolas"]
[Black "Bain, Mary"]
[Result "1-0"]
[ECO "E60"]
[PlyCount "67"]
[EventDate "1954.??.??"]
[SourceDate "2005.01.01"]
1. c4 Nf6 2. g3 c5 3. Bg2 g6 4. b3 Bg7 5. Bb2 Nc6 6. Nf3 O-O 7. O-O d6 8. d4
cxd4 9. Nxd4 Bd7 10. Nc2 Qc8 11. Re1 Bh3 12. Bh1 Rb8 13. Nc3 a6 14. Ne3 Re8 15.
Rc1 Bh6 16. Ncd5 Nxd5 17. cxd5 Bd7 18. dxc6 bxc6 19. Qd4 f6 20. f4 c5 21. Qc3
Bg7 22. Nc4 Qc7 23. e4 Bc6 24. Rcd1 Red8 25. Bf3 e5 26. Rd2 exf4 27. gxf4 f5
28. Qxg7+ Qxg7 29. Bxg7 Kxg7 30. Rxd6 Bb7 31. Rf1 Rxd6 32. Nxd6 Bc6 33. Rf2 Rd8
34. Nxf5+ 1-0
[Event "Hollywood op"]
[Site "Hollywood"]
[Date "1954.??.??"]
[Round "?"]
[White "Bain, Mary"]
[Black "Kalme, Charles"]
[Result "1-0"]
[ECO "A24"]
[PlyCount "79"]
[EventDate "1954.??.??"]
[SourceDate "2005.01.01"]
1. Nf3 Nf6 2. g3 g6 3. Bg2 Bg7 4. c4 d6 5. Nc3 e5 6. O-O O-O 7. d3 Nbd7 8. Rb1
c6 9. b4 Ne8 10. e4 Nc7 11. Be3 f5 12. Ne2 Nf6 13. exf5 gxf5 14. b5 Bd7 15. b6
axb6 16. Bxb6 Rxa2 17. c5 Nfe8 18. cxd6 Be6 19. dxc7 Nxc7 20. Bxc7 Qxc7 21. Ng5
Bf7 22. Nxf7 Qxf7 23. Nc3 Ra3 24. Qc1 Rfa8 25. Qb2 e4 26. dxe4 Rxc3 27. Qxb7
Qxb7 28. Rxb7 fxe4 29. Bxe4 Rd8 30. Re1 Rf8 31. Re2 h5 32. h4 Bd4 33. Kg2 Rf7
34. Rb8+ Kg7 35. Rc8 Re7 36. f3 c5 37. Rc6 Bf6 38. Rd2 Ra7 39. Rd5 Ra2+ 40. Kh3
1-0 |
|
Apr-16-05
 |
| Karpova: <refutor>
never heard of fred reinfeld or nicolas rossolimo?
Fred Reinfelds wrote several books on chess while rossolimo has his rossolimo attack in the sicilian defense. |
|
Apr-16-05
|
| refutor: i meant there was no one in the 1963 olympiad that i had heard of...i have heard of reinfeld, rossolimo, ulvestad and kalme...that's why i posted these here
btw, the mary bain article was from January 2004 of chess life ...btw that chess life article mentions here 11 move win over Capablanca |
|
Apr-16-05
|
| Karpova: <btw that chess life article mentions here 11 move win over Capablanca> you already mentioned that but it doesn't seem to be clear that capa was the one to lose.
i doubt capa would fall for something like that after 30 years of chess. |
|
Apr-16-05
|
| refutor: <i doubt capa would fall for something like that after 30 years of chess> why? capa wasn't infallible...he could've resigned in 11 moves in this game Samisch vs Capablanca, 1929 |
|
Apr-16-05
|
| Karpova: i never claimed capa to be infallible but thanks for the link.
i know that game and it's quite intersting since capa goes on playing (against saemisch so why ahould he resign against mary bain??) and makes saemisch work hard for his win. |
|
| Aug-08-06 |
| BIDMONFA: Mary Bain BAIN, Mary
http://www.bidmonfa.com/bain_mary.htm
_ |
|
| Aug-08-06 |
| blingice: <OJC: Ba4? Wow, I never thought I would see such a blunder from Capablanca, blindfold simul or not.> rofl |
|
|
< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 2 OF 2 ·
Later Kibitzing > |
