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< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 385 OF 385 ·
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| May-08-08 |
| Petrosianic: <It is probably the only time a World title "winner" didnt win the oscar.> No. Korchnoi won the 1978 Oscar despite losing to Karpov in the Danneman... er, Campomanes Championship Match. |
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May-08-08
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| Knight13: <yalie> Of course I mind. It's copyrighted. (Except that I don't mind so yeah go ahead and steal it!) |
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May-08-08
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| hrvyklly: <Petrosianic: No. Korchnoi won the 1978 Oscar despite losing to Karpov in the Danneman... er, Campomanes Championship Match.> Nice. |
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| May-08-08 |
| yalie: <Petrosianic: <It is probably the only time a World title "winner" didnt win the oscar.>
No. Korchnoi won the 1978 Oscar despite losing to Karpov in the Danneman... er, Campomanes Championship Match. >
he did? well then alter my post to .. "it would have been the second time..." but thanks for pointing it out. |
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| May-08-08 |
| yalie: <Knight13: <yalie> Of course I mind. It's copyrighted. (Except that I don't mind so yeah go ahead and steal it!)> thanks. just used the stolen line in an email to a friend about a separate matter. |
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| May-08-08 |
| yalie: another bit of oscar trivia:
apart from the aforementioned Korchnoi and Bent Larsen, there has been no other Oscar winner without a / the World title. Fischer, Spassky, Karpov, Kasparov, Anand, Kramnik & Topalov have been the other winners. |
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May-08-08
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| SetNoEscapeOn: <Carlsen has good chances to win the chess oscar for this year. The kid's playing at a 2800 level almost every tournament. In a few years, all the other top players will be playing for 2nd.> His play has been phenomenal, but I doubt he will win the Oscar because of the Kramnik-Anand match, coupled with the fact that Anand has already beaten him 3 times in classical games this year, twice with black. So if Anand wins the match I don't think many people will give Carlsen the nod over him. If Kramnik wins, he'll have beaten the #1 ranked player (most likely) in a match and I'm sure he'll get the necessary "safety" performance in Dortmund or another top tournament sometime during the year. |
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May-09-08
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| Ragh: Congrats to Anand for winning the Chess Oscar for the year 2007. |
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| May-09-08 |
| humangraymatter: <sheaf > I don't mind how wise you think my comment is.In fact when I wrote it I knew that "wise" and "intelligent" people like you would attack me because of it.But that is what I really think about the relative strength of Kasparov and the other players (except Karpov and Kramnik)I want to quote from the "Kill Bill" movie where Bill says "...superman did not become superman,superman was born superman."When you become world champion at the age of 35 it is not the same with achieving this when you are only 21. |
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May-09-08
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| hrvyklly: <humangraymatter: I want to quote from the "Kill Bill" movie where Bill says "...superman did not become superman,superman was born superman." When you become world champion at the age of 35 it is not the same with achieving this when you are only 21.> Which reminds me that Paul Morphy was hailed and regarded as World Champion at age 21 too. Without any training/assistance! |
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| May-09-08 |
| yalie: article in The Hindu on Anand:
http://www.hindu.com/thehindu/holnu... the man is humble enough to admit that he got a bit lucky when he became no. 1 last April. I doubt we would find Kasparov or Kramnik making statements like that. <"Anand also disclosed how he had almost given up on becoming world number one last year. "For a moment I had given up on reaching number one last year. I had to be 30 points ahead of Veselin Topalov of Bulgaria which not only meant I had to earn but that he had to lose. There was a difference of 5 to 35 points. "But things started falling in place unexpectedly. so it was a very special year," he said. >
also on the loss with Radjabov:
<He also shared his feelings on his first loss after all the glory. "There was a cold shower when I lost my first game in the Wijk Aan Zee and then I drew some 5-6 games after a gap of couple of months. So it is very important to have memories and experience and the feel of the tension of the big chess events," he said.
>
I have been thinking about the optimal number of games a top GM should play. Clearly, if you play too much .. you are tired and you have not spent time studying new things and homecooking novelties. At the same time, having long layoffs can affect your playing strength since you are not used to the tension. These contrasting effects are brought out by the following examples ... 1. Anand took two mini breaks from Chess - one in 2002 after his Dortmund debacle and the other in 2006 after the Olympiad performance and came back stronger. 2. In contrast, Kramnik did not play at all in 2002 and clearly from 03-05, he was playing very badly for someone of his ability (of course the illness also had something to do with it). While he did go +2 in Linares 03 and 04, the other results were pretty ordinary (Corus, Dortmund, Brissago). 3. Radjabov has been doing pretty badly the past 3 tournaments .. obviously he is tired from playing too much. Bottomline: i think the relation between performance and # of games is a bell curve (with the parameters being player specific). Thoughts? |
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May-09-08
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| SetNoEscapeOn: < hrvyklly: <humangraymatter: I want to quote from the "Kill Bill" movie where Bill says "...superman did not become superman,superman was born superman." When you become world champion at the age of 35 it is not the same with achieving this when you are only 21.> Which reminds me that Paul Morphy was hailed and regarded as World Champion at age 21 too. Without any training/assistance! > It's hard to use age like this without taking into account the time period when players played. For instance, Bobby was an extremely strong player at 21, stronger than Morphy ever was, but Morphy did not have Botvinnik, Petrosian, Tal, Spassky, Korchnoi, Smyslov, etc to contend with. The fact that Morphy and Kasparov became world champ at a younger age than Fischer doesn't have much bearing on whether or not they are greater overall than he is. |
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| May-09-08 |
| yalie: <It's hard to use age like this without taking into account the time period when players played. For instance, Bobby was an extremely strong player at 21, stronger than Morphy ever was, but Morphy did not have Botvinnik, Petrosian, Tal, Spassky, Korchnoi, Smyslov, etc to contend with. The fact that Morphy and Kasparov became world champ at a younger age than Fischer doesn't have much bearing on whether or not they are greater overall than he is.
>
I agree. There are also differences in training. Karpov, Kasparov and Kramnik went into formal training at a very early age. Guys like Anand and Fischer were largely self taught and made it to the top DESPITE the environment not BECAUSE of it. These differences dont exist anymore (for example, with Carlsen) since the internet, chess databases and strong engines make self training far easier. You dont have to wait for the next informant to arrive to do serious opening work. |
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| May-09-08 |
| yalie: http://www.mtelmasters.com/en/news&... I guess, in the Steintitz / FIDE line Topalov is #19 & Kramnik #20. Of course, in the Steinitz /FIDE /PCA/Braingames/Danneman/FIDE line, Topalov doesnt find a place .. while Kramnik would be #14. Funnily enough, Anand is #15 in either line. So I guess he can just call himself the 15th World Champion without controversy. |
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| May-09-08 |
| yalie: http://www.mtelmasters.com/en/news&... also I just realized the picture in the article is from last year since it shows Sasi, Shak and Nisi .. neither of whom is taking part. |
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| May-13-08 |
| Augalv: Elizbar Ubilava, who spent 10 years with Anand as a Second, says the unification match will be between Russian’s opening and Indian’s middle game MUMBAI: Elizbar Ubilava was believed to be the man responsible for Viswanathan Anand’s transformation from a rookie to a world champion. The Georgian-born Spanish Grandmaster was Anand’s second for nearly 10 years. During the period, the Indian maestro won the world championship, the world cup and rose to World No 1 position. Ubilava is now the coach of Indian women’s team. DNA caught up with him at the GM tournament in the city. Excerpts: How do you analyse Anand as a person, player and a professional?
He is well organised and disciplined. Mainly, he makes himself. He is a world champion and that speaks for itself. His greatness is his ability to maintain the highest standard for a long time. He is an absolutely exceptional talent. The chess players world over respect him. He never looks for any artificial advantage world champions like Karpov tried to obtain at different times. He wants to achieve across the board. He is also a great human being. I was lucky for my association with him. My contribution to his growth, though, is modest. How did it all start?
It started in Spain through some common friends. We still stay in the same city in Spain, which is very close to Madrid. Vishy invited me once in 1994. We played some rapid games. Then he asked me to join him for the world championship cycle in Hyderabad against Gata Kamsky. We worked for about 10 days before coming to Hyderabad. That was the starting point. It was not the best start right? Vishy lost to Kamsky 3.5-1.5.
That’s right. Anand should have won all those five games. But he made errors here and there and then went on to lose it. It was a big setback for the Indian fans but I thought he had a home disadvantage. A lot of people would interrupt his preparation, to convey their best wishes. It was not an ideal situation for him. However, our association continued. I took a break in 2001. The last tournament was 2005 Linares. How do look back at the time you spent with Vishy? Any highpoints that you recall?
We had fantastic time together travelling all over the world. It is difficult to nominate one or two watershed moments. Probably, the 2000 world championship was a milestone. Then the 2001 World Cup. In 1997, he practically won the world championship. It was unjust of Fide to ask Anand to play Karpov after he came though knock-out system in the Netherlands. Two days after winning the knock-out tournament, he had to play Karpov. In the championship match, he made it 3-3 before losing in the additional game. It was completely unjust. Karpov was very fresh and Vishy was totally exhausted. He was the best player in the Fide cycle. He proved that by ripping apart Karpov some months later 5.5-.5. But what I would like to stress is that we always tried to do different and new things. In that sense, it was a successful collaboration. What are the areas you helped him develop?
Mainly opening. It is a huge, huge area. Today Vishy’s opening range is unbelievable. When we started, his opening repertoire was not as vast. There is a marked improvement in his middle and end games too. He is now a complete player. Psychologically he is very strong. He handles success and failure perfectly. Ok, how do you rate Vishy of 1994 and 2008?
Now, he is a 2800 player, the best player in the world. What else one wants? I’m sure he will stay there for some more years. He stabilised himself as the highest level player. When we started, he was 2700 player. Source: DNA India |
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| May-13-08 |
| cannibal: <Elizbar Ubilava, who spent 10 years with Anand as a Second, says the unification match will be between Russian’s opening and Indian’s middle game> Unification match? The unification match was between the Russian's bathroom and the Bulgarian's blunders, as far as I know. |
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| May-13-08 |
| yalie: <Unification match? The unification match was between the Russian's bathroom and the Bulgarian's blunders, as far as I know.
>
Ah, bathroom visits & blunders - beautifully put! Here's wishing you an unending supply of tasty humans just for that nice comment. |
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| May-13-08 |
| yalie: Thanks <Augalv>. Here is the link: http://www.dnaindia.com/report.asp?...
<Finally, do you think Vishy was unlucky to have played in Kasparov’s era? In another generation, he would have would have had more world titles.I don’t think so. What would have happened if Fischer had played Karpov? We’ll never know. Vishy needed Kasparov’s greatness to be recognised as a great player. Anand is one of the three best players I’ve seen (Kasparov and Magnus Carlson are the other two). Today Vishy is a world champion, world No. 1 and a 2800 player. What else would he want? History will give Vishy an honourable place.
>
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| May-15-08 |
| chessblind: This is with respect to comparing Anand with Fischer or Fischer with Morphy. Such comparisons are meaningless as is evident from:(1) each generation of chess masters 'shoot'from the shoulders of the earlier generation.(2) communication of ideas got better and faster as science progressed (3)More and more players took to chess at younger age as chess theory was developed into systematic language and formats.(4) computer facilities made chess learning easier and faster. A chess master from the nineteenth century is a beginner from the standards of present days.Even amongst the contemporaries,no two players can really be relatively assessed as objectively as one would wish.One can only comment on their relative achievements in various tourneys,championships. Nothing more. |
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May-15-08
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| hrvyklly: <chessblind> I stand and applaud you brother (if I may use such a term), so much childish bickering, such little insight, until you came along. When will 'they' understand the term "standing on the shoulders of giants"? For the trolls: Stephen Hawking is a much better physicist than Sir Isaac Newton, but Hawking is building upon many others' discoveries reaching back through time, back through Newton's, back through the renaissance, back through the Islamic re-discovery of scientific thought, back to ancient Greece, and further on... and on a much more insignificant and smaller scale: Anand stands on Karpov's shoulder's, who stands on Smyslov's, who stands on Capablanca's... |
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Later Kibitzing > |
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