< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 163 OF 558 ·
|May-09-12|| ||cormier: http://www.usccb.org/bible/readings...|
|May-09-12|| ||playground player: <achieve> My research has not advanced to the point where I can conduct an Agenda 21 tutorial. And again, nobody wants to hear about it. |
Nevertheless, here is Lesson 1, written by Tom DeWeese in 1996.
I also think an understanding of <The Humanist Manifesto II> is crucial to understanding the origins of Agenda 21.
Yes, I know--to some of our <Esteemed Colleagues>, we sound like conspiracy nuts on a George Nouri broadcast. For someone like me, who came dangerously close to losing his livelihood because he refused to believe in a particular cluster of conspiracy theories, the irony of the position is a little hard to bear.
P.S.--What the hell is a "majority consensus"? That's not even decent English! When was the last time you heard of a "minority consensus"? And there's the underlying stupid argument: "If everybody agrees it's true, then it must be true."
There's no one dumber than the smartest people in the world.
|May-09-12|| ||YouRang: <playground player><<YouRang> Instead of getting into another eschatological debate with you, I've decided to look at it this way:>|
Actually, I wasn't really looking to get into an eschatalogical debate -- I was just responding to the Scofield view that you had referenced.
|May-10-12|| ||achieve: <For someone like me, who came dangerously close to losing his livelihood because he refused to believe in a particular cluster of conspiracy theories, the irony of the position is a little hard to bear.> I understand that. Believe me.|
<P.S.--What the hell is a "majority consensus"? That's not even decent English!> Abuse of language, indeed. Where to start?!
But rest assured, if correct behaviour and language, the old English way, was "concerned,", properly, we wouldn't be in the darn shytehole we are in. It would have been much worse, much sooner. Ok - maybe the comparison is of little use, to put it misleadingly understatedly.
Thanks for lending an ear, Lee, while I am learning to read some signs I'd rather not be able to read. Very tough sledding, here.
|May-10-12|| ||achieve: <pgp> -- http://www.newswithviews.com/DeWees...|
How come we all seem to come late to the party?
Thanks for the link though. It proves that human inquiry can not be killed.
As can not Love.
|May-10-12|| ||OhioChessFan: <And there's the underlying stupid argument: "If everybody agrees it's true, then it must be true.">|
As far as I can tell, that's the primary selling point of Darwinism.
|May-10-12|| ||playground player: <OCF> Right on.
<Steamed Colleagues> My column for this week: http://www.newswithviews.com/Duigon...
<achieve> We do have an immense job ahead of us, don't we?
|May-10-12|| ||cormier: http://www.usccb.org/bible/readings...|
|May-10-12|| ||achieve: <pgp>-<We do have an immense job ahead of us, don't we?> One'd think so, yes, unfortunately. It's getting to the point of ... *censored*|
And speaking of "leisure time", if by any chance such exists for us, you might want to watch the much hyped feature film <The Hunger Games> -- the society depicted there almost had me fall off the couch. Sort of.
In case you'd want to know more, *pause*, about the "who's who and then some" of the environmental movement and UN Earth Charter etc. - I'd recommend reading this research article, <The Sustainable Prince>, by Joan Veon:
|May-11-12|| ||cormier: http://www.usccb.org/bible/readings...|
|May-11-12|| ||playground player: <achieve> It's very hard to take Balmy Prince Charlie seriously. He seems to have the intelligence of a neon tetra. But perhaps that's just protective coloration. Maybe Maurice Strong's eccentric religious enterprises are purposely staged so that we won't take him seriously, either. Then again, maybe, in addition to being a billionaire, he genuinely is a nut.|
After all, you don't need to be particularly intelligent in order to do great harm to others. I am reminded of a line in <I, Claudius>, spoken to Sejanus by one of his victims: "You are a lesson to me, Sejanus... in how one small intellect, united to a complete lack of scruple, can undo a whole republic of clever men..."
<YouRang> If you think C.I. Scofield did not understand the Bible, you're not alone! Welcome to a rather large club.
Nevertheless, his <Scofield Reference Bible> was, and still is, probably the single most influential religious book ever written in America. The man in his personal life was a typical 19th-century mountebank... And, yes, he did encourage Christians to disconnect themselves from the world, on the presumption that the Rapture was coming any day now.
An interesting aspect of Scofield's career is that he often received strong financial support and social favors from business tycoons who otherwise displayed no interest at all in Christianity, church growth, evangelism, etc. Why did they help Scofield?
Nobody really knows; but we are permitted to guess.
|May-11-12|| ||achieve: <May-11-12
playground player: <achieve> It's very hard to take Balmy Prince Charlie seriously. He seems to have the intelligence of a neon tetra. But perhaps that's just protective coloration. Maybe Maurice Strong's eccentric religious enterprises are purposely staged so that we won't take him seriously, either. Then again, maybe, in addition to being a billionaire, he genuinely is a nut.>
Not getting into detail here, but your response here to my post is so outer-wordly that I might begin to consider that you are a slice off the same bread. That being not the case, however, I am left simply asking you:
After you supposedly reading the context Joan Veon offered, is this still a response I should take even remotely seriously?
Strong a nut? Charles a "neon tetra"? What?
Would be tough for a bunch of "nutters" like that to achieve what they have, no? Of course they are pathologically burdened, but you obviously mean this in a rather odd context.
As of today I find it hard to see myself communicate with you on any consistent and profound enough level, hence my dedision to withdraw from active participation.
|May-11-12|| ||playground player: <achieve> Sorry you feel that way. You and I don't always communicate very well.|
I think the desire to rule the world is, by definition, loony. Prince Charles has never struck me as a great mind: he seems more suited to be a useful tool in the hands of slyer men.
I have interviewed a two people who know Maurice Strong. They were members of the American staff at the UN. Both laughed aloud when I mentioned Strong's name, and both wrote him off as a crazy man.
I believe it would be a mistake to attribute more than ordinary intelligence to any of these wannabe world-rulers. That does not mean they aren't dangerous!
Meanwhile, I don't know what you wanted from me... so what can I say?
|May-12-12|| ||cormier: <<<<<<<Jn 15:18-21> Jesus said to his disciples:
"If the world hates you, realize that it hated me first.>
If you belonged to the world, the world would love its own;
but because you do not belong to the world,
and I have chosen you out of the world,
the world hates you.>
Remember the word I spoke to you,
'No slave is greater than his master.'>
If they persecuted me, they will also persecute you.>
If they kept my word, they will also keep yours.>
And they will do all these things to you on account of my name,
because they do not know the one who sent me.">
|May-12-12|| ||playground player: <YouRang> I did say up-front that I was oversimplifying Scofield's position--but not, I think, unjustly.|
Is the Rapture part of your eschatology? (If you already answered that, way back when, please bear with me. I can't remember everything.) It seems to me that one can be solidly Premillenial without it.
Meanwhile, notice we are on the same team in the Thematic Challenge... so we must agree about something.
I've played the Albin Countergambit fairly often, but some of these moves the computers are coming up with are new to me. I don't have chess software, have never used it, so the various analyses and kibitzing are mostly incomprehensible to me.
|May-13-12|| ||cormier: http://www.usccb.org/bible/readings...|
|May-14-12|| ||cormier: http://www.usccb.org/bible/readings...|
|May-14-12|| ||achieve: <pgp> <Meanwhile, I don't know what you wanted from me... so what can I say?> Not entirely clear here.|
I mainly realized that showering each other with article after article, new insight after new insight, infowar in action, after... That made me realize that we might better limit the destabilizing news articles we send and demand answers to.
That's how the alternative media makes things beyond difficult. They spar among themselves. Draining those involved.
For us the challenge to not overburden and leave enough room to support each other.
I withheld commentary for a few days because of my dad's awful health, taking a lot of our time, and because I wish to not overburden anyone with yet another article/theory. In fact I was just trying to get a grip, and place it.
In agreement with your last post, though, as was to be expected, and thank you Lee for clarifying the way you did.
|May-14-12|| ||playground player: <achieve> Niels, I am very sorry to hear about your father, and I pray he will get better soon. We are all old enough, alas, to know how hard and draining that kind of family crisis can be.|
|May-14-12|| ||achieve: <pgp> It's Okay - this is what is called the final countdown - and I should keep myself in check regarding discussions we have. But i did feel we share too much negative info, perhaps disinfo, and may react, at different times, like a wounded knee. |
Mrs. W. Knee
I miss Jess.
|May-14-12|| ||playground player: <achieve> It won't hurt us to lay off the hard stuff for a while. And I imagine Jess will be back with us soon--she just got a promotion, and she's awful busy, right now.|
|May-14-12|| ||achieve: Thanks. Yes, the irony is that inevitably within the current availability and abundancy of sources and number of contacts we may have, each of those forwarding the next bit of info and article to "make it viral", is seen as a long way to exposing and thereby fighting the "evil" forces, while in reality we are spinning to such a degree, that we debilitate our capacity of undertaking "actual action" ..... |
Just paasing on information, "doesn't buy our lunch" - though somehow many infowarriors believe that it does, as we raise awareness and "consciousness"... That last one seems to be <the> buzzword.
But in actual fact we may be stretched beyond our limit to process it all, and knowing the exact contours of the rabbit hole, basically is just that, nothing more. Unless....
So there, I'll be laying low, re-assess, and as it happens Agenda 21 was mentioned over at <Domdaniel>'s, but I won't be getting into it again now, and <frogbert> was nice enough to refer to your page for information.
Aloha, Lee, stay healthy, and I'll drop by when I get the chance.
|May-15-12|| ||cormier: http://www.usccb.org/bible/readings...|
|May-15-12|| ||YouRang: <playground player><Is the Rapture part of your eschatology? >|
Yes -- I know eschatology isn't your favorite subject, but I think there a few passages that cannot be adequately explained apart from an actual rapture event. For example, how would you explain 1 Cor 15:51-52, or Matt 24:37-42, or 1 Thes 4:16-18? However, the *timing* of the rapture is more hotly debated amongst pre-millennialists.
Most pre-mils believe there will be a 7-year end times period with the final 3 1/2 years being the "great tribulation" which concludes with the return of Christ. And I think all agree that the rapture would take place at some point during this 7-year period.
There are pre-tribbers who think it happens at the start of the 7 years, post-tribbers who think it happens at the end of the 7 years, and mid-tribbers who think it happens (you guessed it) at the midpoint (i.e. the beginning of the great tribulation).
I currently prefer a different timing called the "pre-wrath" view, which says that the rapture happens near the end of the 7-years, just prior to the "bowl judgments" described in Rev 16. IMO, this is the only timing that makes sense of all the eschatalogical scriptures.
This means that Christians will go through a time of great persecution and even martyrdom on earth, and many professing Christians will effectively apostasize (as Jesus described in Matt 24, and Paul in 2 Thes 2).
|May-15-12|| ||playground player: <YouRang> Thanks to our many exchanges, I'm getting more comfortable, talking about eschatology. However, I don't have as much time today as I'd like.|
My studies indicate to me that the Rapture was not a well-known eschatological motif until it was popularized by the Plymouth Brethren in the late 19th century, and much more so by Scofield in the early 20th. I am unaware of any explicit discussion of the Rapture earlier than the 19th century.
Trying to figure out the mind of God is difficult!
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