Egypt, Assyria, Babylon, Persia, Greece, Rome... and then?

It seems, after two world wars and a cold war, that people have given up on the idea of conquering the world by military force. Instead, those who wish to rule the world have adopted such methods as lies, seduction, and subversion. If they play their cards right, we won't realize what they've done to us until we wake up in Revelation Chapt. 17.

But before we can pursue that, we have one more Revelation symbol to deal with--the Woman, drunk on the blood of saints and martyrs, who sits atop 7 mountains. What or whom does she represent?

LOL!

<But mind you, I don't know if you're right or not: all I can say is that your argument is reasonable.>

Good -- because I can't say if I'm right or not either, and "reasonable" is all I'm really aiming for.

<Egypt, Assyria, Babylon, Persia, Greece, Rome... and then?>

Yes, there's that 7th kingdom -- who could that be? Again, let's resist the temptation to guess, and see what the scripture says.

Rev 17:10 [referring to the seven heads, which represent kingdoms and kings] <they are also seven kings, five of whom have fallen, one is, the other has not yet come, and when he does come he must remain only a little while.>

Clearly, the 7th kingdom is described as "the other" which "has not yet come, and when he does come he must remain only a little while."

I would say then, that the 7th kingdom must satisfy these three requirements:

(1) In order to be counted among this group of kingdoms, it must (like the others) at some point dominate and persecute Israel.

(2) According to Rev 17:10, this kingdom must be in the future *relative to John*. In fact, it must be some kingdom that comes (at some point) after the 6th kingdom (Rome), i.e. 480 AD or later.

(3) This kingdom must remain a "only little while". This is unspecific, but I think it must be safe to say that the 7th kingdom must be short in comparison to the previous six.

In reviewing these requirements, I would say that there has been exactly one such kingdom: Hitler's Nazi Germany.

I'm not sure why, but I'm imagining that you're rolling your eyes. I was reluctant to consider this at first myself, but the more I thought about it, the more it made sense to me. Does it not fit the above requirements perfectly?

(1) If God is putting together a list of Satanically inspired kingdoms that have or will dominate and persecute Israel, how could he NOT include the Nazi Holocaust? Incredibly, they succeeded in murdering a full one third of the entire world's Jewish population (estimated to be 18 million prior to WWII). My reading of the accounts of the Holocaust leaves me with no doubt that this was a Satanically inspired kingdom if there ever was one.

(2) Nazi Germany certainly satisfies the timing of being after John's day and after Rome.

(3) The "king", Adolph Hitler, certainly reigned for a short time in comparison to the other kingdoms (only about 12 years, 1933 - 1945). Yet in just this short time (really just part of it) he targeted and persecuted the nation Israel to a degree completely unrivaled by the previous kingdoms.

Furthermore, I believe that Hitler's kingdom was a major event from the standpoint of Biblical prophecy. In addition to satisfying the requirements for the 7th kingdom, it resulted in a rare situation: Worldwide sympathy for Israel. And out of this came the astounding (and of course controversial) move to restore Israel to their homeland in 1948.

This of course, paves the way for a literal fulfillment of Biblical end times prophecy, which speaks of Israel being in their land.

As you know, worldwide sympathy for Israel has eroded since then. In fact, there are many people who say (or think) that Israel's presence in the Middle East is the main roadblock to world peace. This view is probably more prominent in Europe than it is in the U.S.

Yes, and Revelation speaks of the final kingdom (the eighth, re: Rev 17:11) being characterized by deception and delusion. But military force isn't quite out of vogue yet.

<But before we can pursue that, we have one more Revelation symbol to deal with--the Woman, drunk on the blood of saints and martyrs, who sits atop 7 mountains. What or whom does she represent?>

You're touching on a topic here for which there is quite some disagreement among Christians. But my own view is that there doesn't need to be a conflict between Christianity and the prevailing views of science, if the Bible is understood correctly.

To answer your question, I think that in some sense, the Bible gives an accurate (possibly allegorical) summary of the early universe. But I don't think the strict literal interpretation (i.e. the earth is 6000 years old, etc.) is correct. Many Christians still do.

I lean more toward the interpretaion proposed by Jewish physicist Gerald Schroeder. (I can give you a link to a summary of his views if you like.)

<If the bible is inaccurate or clueless about the origin, then doen't it logically follow that the "prophecies" are meaningless also?>

Well, it's a moot question IMO, because I don't regard the Bible as inaccurate or clueless. *Interpretations* of the Bible are often inaccurate or clueless.

<The "firmament"? Adam supposedly named all the animals, so he supposedly knew and named all the dinosaurs, are they even mentioned in the bible? The leviathan, the behemoth, the dragon, the unicorn, the cockatice (basilisk), etc. are mentioned but these are either real animals such as the hippo, the rhino, the crocodile, etc. or a representation of Satan (dragon). Of four different bible dictionaries that I consulted, none of these are dinosaurs - which were highly numerous and prevalent until their demise. Does the bible even mention this mass extinction event anywhere? (The flood doesn't count because the ark was designed specifically to prevent extinction). Does the bible describe plate tectonics, continental drift, the billions of galaxies? The Himalayas were probably formed by two continents colliding - the evidence is there, but the bible doesn't know any of this. What about ice ages? Fiction? False evidence planted by Satan? I've heard this from some Christians. C'mon, man - let's get real.>

In my view, the Bible doesn't contradict any of the scientific matters you mentioned.

I don't think the Bible was ever intended to be a science book, so anything it does say regarding matters of science are somewhat informal and sparse. For example, it speaks of the sun rising and setting. Does this contradict the heliocentric model of the solar system? I think it is just speaking using a perspective that humans can relate to.

Perhaps the most interesting scientific detail in Genesis is that man is made out of the same stuff as the earth. I would think that is a accurate and insightful detail that is hardly intuitive.

<Mrs. PGP> and I have just had a long talk with the grandmother, who gave us a detailed description of what she suffered--hardly necessary, since she carried the evidence of it on her body, from head to toe. I won't repeat it here: one horrified and nauseated person on this page (me) is enough.

Much of my job consists of tracking the rapid demise of Western civilization. The putrefaction has reached literally to my own doorstep.

How are you/things now, after the police invasion?

Similarly the abuse in mental institutions and for the severe disabled drives you up the wall and over it. Many of the now younger generation will have grown up surrounded not only with a lack of moral and ethical values, but the internet porn and gaming industry induce and promote degradation violence and torture.

As for the attempted murder, that episode is the result of at least 4 generations of fatherless chaos, with each generation a bit more depraved than the preceding one. These women have children by men who are here today and gone tomorrow. But of course a lot of the smartest people in the world say we don't need traditional families, fathers are unnecessary, and the only sacred thing in this world is unrestricted fornication. And they manage to translate their insane ideas into public policy. Better living through wickedness!

Meanwhile, all I could do was fix the beaten woman's glasses. They were a mess, but I put them right (I've had tons of practice). Glasses I can fix. Generations of brownian motion in lieu of an ordered family structure, I can't fix. I suspect these people's bus went off the right road years before I was born.

I wouldn't say that things have necessarily gotten worse. In many respects people are far more civil today that they were in centuries past.

The OT account (from Judges) you've referenced is extremely brutal.

FWIW, there isn't much in Judges that is presented as acceptable behavior to God. In fact, the book of Judges concerns the time after Joshua died, and it is conveniently summarized in chapter 2:

<8 Joshua son of Nun, the servant of the Lord, died at the age of a hundred and ten. 9 And they buried him in the land of his inheritance, at Timnath Heres in the hill country of Ephraim, north of Mount Gaash.

10 After that whole generation had been gathered to their ancestors, another generation grew up who knew neither the Lord nor what he had done for Israel.

11 Then the Israelites did evil in the eyes of the Lord and served the Baals. 12 They forsook the Lord, the God of their ancestors, who had brought them out of Egypt. They followed and worshiped various gods of the peoples around them. They aroused the Lord’s anger 13 because they forsook him and served Baal and the Ashtoreths.

14 In his anger against Israel the Lord gave them into the hands of raiders who plundered them. He sold them into the hands of their enemies all around, whom they were no longer able to resist. 15 Whenever Israel went out to fight, the hand of the Lord was against them to defeat them, just as he had sworn to them. They were in great distress.

16 Then the Lord raised up judges, who saved them out of the hands of these raiders. 17 Yet they would not listen to their judges but prostituted themselves to other gods and worshiped them. They quickly turned from the ways of their ancestors, who had been obedient to the Lord’s commands.