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|Oct-23-03|| ||Diggitydawg: FIDE's congress will take place early next month. The delegates from all the federations will meet in Greece to address the current problems in the chess world, including the championship schism. I am not sanguine about their prospects. FIDE has been under a constant state of disorganization and corruption, first under the watch of Florencio Campomanes, then under Kirsan Ilyumzhinov (notice I used "watch" instead of "leadership"). Some people on this site blame Kasparov for throwing the World championship cycle into chaos in 1993. I put the blame on Campomanes. The events in 1993 would not have occurred if Campomanes had not continually made decisions that were harmful to Kasparov's career. First, by scheduling Kasparov's match with Korchnoi in Pasadena (which neither player wanted), Campo angered the Soviets to the point where they refused to let Kasparov play, and the match was forfeited to Korchnoi. Later there was a hastily arranged make-up match in London, organized by Ray Keene, where Kasparov prevailed. Then in the 1984 Karpov-Kasparov match, when Garry was starting to climb back from his deficit, Campo stopped the match. Who was this bozo to decide who was World champion? This was the act that threw the world championship cycle into chaos and earned Campo emnity by Kasparov for the rest of his life. The three-year-cycle was destroyed then, because another world championship match took place in 1985, another in 1986, and yet another in 1987. Then the championship cycle seemed to get back on track. But in 1993, Kasparov and Short formed the PCA. I can tell you that this would never have happened if Campomanes was not still FIDE president. Further evidence of Campomanes' incompetence was how FIDE changed the date and country (even continent!) of its major events. In 1986, Campo allowed the olympiad to be held in the United Arab Emirates, where it was impossible for the Israeli team and some Jewish members of other teams to participate. In 1995, Campomanes announced he would retire if Kirsan Ilyumzhinov became FIDE president after him. But Campomanes wanted a new position as ďchairmanĒ of FIDE. The nerve of that bozo! Kirsan won his bid for the FIDE presidency by giving gifts to the delegates. For those of you who long for the good old days of stability in the chess world, you should know that a huge reason for the instability we are seeing now is that many of the delegates of the chess federations have a limited understanding of the chess world, and that they are mostly political appointees. This differs from the time when the Eastern bloc hegemony ensured that the FIDE Congress was dominated by people who understood the issues in the chess world (Iím not defending this hegemony, merely stating that it consisted of competent chessplayers). So Kirsan became FIDE president by buying off those delegates. Yes he injected his money into FIDE, helping it recover from the financial mismanagement of the Campomanes administration. But he has failed to resolve the problems surrounding the state of the World championship. Kirsanís failure thus far at FIDE is illustrated by Seirawanís letter to FIDE: http://www.gmsquare.com/gmforum/ope... Some other evidence of FIDE under Kirsanís incompetence is given by the organizers of the Dortmund, Linares, and Wijk Aan Zee tournaments: http://www.chessbase.com/events/eve... . So I donít think that FIDE will accomplish anything substantial next month. Two dictators have been at the helm of FIDE. When will another Max Euwe be found?|
I used this article as a source: http://www.chessworks.com/misc/camp...
|Oct-23-03|| ||Paul123: I would believe Campomanes and Ilyumzhinov were corrupt if Kasparov was legit in defending his title, but he is not. Fisher also tried to highjack the crown and FIDE was strong enough to rebuff his attempts, he also made claims similar to the one stated above by Kasparov. When I read Kasparov's memoirs the guy came off like he was a nut! He sees conspiracies behind every corner. Just like Korchnoi and Karpov (e.g. the hypnotist.... what crap!)|
Kasparov highjack the crown when he got that "patsy" Nigel Short to agree to a championship match. As if Short really had a chance. I will never understand why there wasn't a giant outcry from other professionals. I bet they wish they would have stuck by Fide and banished Kasparov, then they would still have a real league/touring circuit in which to play in.
|Oct-23-03|| ||Sylvester: Fide has ruined chess! |
|Oct-23-03|| ||Diggitydawg: <Paul123> As far as Short being a "patsy", I can only say he eliminated both Timman and Karpov legitimately in the FIDE candidate matches.|
In general, I don't believe in conspiracy theories.
You wonder why there was not a large outcry from other GMs at 1993? It is because they had no confidence in Campomanes. After the í86 reelection, many GMs joined the GMA (their trade union) because they wanted to protect their rights from any arbitrary decisions from Campomanes and FIDE, and all the dirty politicking that went on among the various federations. Unfortunately, the GMA failed, a large part due to Kasparovís naivete and ego.
What chess really needs now is a FIDE that will 1) respect the players' rights (work to preserve the value of a FIDE title) and 2) Work WITH event organizers to build a real touring circuit, not try to CONTROL organizers as the following illustrates: http://www.chessbase.com/events/eve...
And why is Campomanes and Ilyumzhinov's corruption conditional on anything that Kasparov does? Campomanes was sentenced to 22 months in prison by the Philippine government for the loss of USD 700,000 that was supposed to be held in trust for the '92 Manila Olympiad: http://www.chessnetwork.com/ncn/b/g... And can you deny that Ilyumzhinov gave out expensive gifts to FIDE delegates to ensure their vote for him: http://www.ishipress.com/leong.htm
|Oct-24-03|| ||Sylvester: I don't get all this mindless respect for Fide. What have they ever done to say who is Champion and who is not? |
|Oct-24-03|| ||uponthehill: Campomanes was a dark figure. He was a communist youth organization activist and KGB agent and he did lot of bad during Karpov-Korchnoi championship match in Baguio, 1978. |
|Oct-24-03|| ||drukenknight: Can we strip FIDE from the title? |
|Oct-24-03|| ||Diggitydawg: Campomanes ruined FIDE's credibility as the giver of the World championship title by showing favoritism in his actions. And I don't understand how the the return match clause (taken away at the end of Botvinnik's career because it conferred too much advantage on the incumbent champion) was revived under the Campomanes administration when Kasparov and Karpov had a return match in 1986. You guys know much more about chess history than I do. Does someone have insight into this? Also, I've read that, in '86, the western federations wanted Campomanes' head for stopping the '84 match but Campomanes survived because a)the only other candidate (Lucena) not qualified and b)he made a deal with the Soviet delegation to adopt their agenda. I've read that one item on their agenda was to push forward an adjustment (subsequently adopted) to the women's FIDE ratings so that Maya Chiburdanidze would have a higher rating than Zsusza Polgar. Does anyone have any knowledge about this? |
|Oct-24-03|| ||Paul123: Diggitydawg
I stand corrected! I was unaware of Campomanes being sentenced to 22 months in prison by the Philippine government for the theft of USD 700,000. Yes, I remember Ilyumzhinov's corruption, however I didn't think it out of the norm from every other FIDE president. This was probably due to Campomanes still being fresh in my mind.
All said, I think you hit the nail right on the head with......
"What chess really needs now is a FIDE that will 1) respect the players' rights (work to preserve the value of a FIDE title) and 2) Work WITH event organizers to build a real touring circuit, not try to CONTROL organizers.
The value of the fide title means everything...what good would a grandmaster title be without FIDE.
They have to get away from the rapid knockout tournament crap too. I would like them to go back to the old format with candidate matches etc... If Kasparov is still strong enough to win the crown in this format.... so be it. However make Kasparov stick to the league rules. Strip him of the title or banish him or anyone who assist him, if they attempt to highjack the crown again for their own personal/monetary gains.
I said Nigel Short was a "patsy" because everyone knew he didn't have a chance to win the crown. Yet, he still went on with the match. It would have been different if the match were for the FIDE Championship. But it wasn't. To me the GMA was a farce; Kasparov put his own people in GMA positions of power. Who could take that seriously? That's why the GMA failed. (IMO)
Fisher didn't have a strong "Patsy" like Short to assist him in taking the title. (like Kasparov) Spasky, whom everyone agreed didnít play his best against Fisher, was unwilling to break away from FIDE. Both Karpov and Korchnoi ,the two up comers, where unwilling and strong enough where the outcome of a match with Fisher was still uncertain. (IMO)
I can't say the same for Short, public opinion was Kasparov was going to beat him. And if I remember correctly, he beat him very decisively.
Anyway your right, Professional Chess needed a strong FIDE like a wounded man needs medical attention
|Oct-24-03|| ||Diggitydawg: : <Paul123> I think this is difficult because Kirsan often imposes his own vision of what professional chess should be without getting the support of the players and fans, e.g. rapid knockout world championship, shortening time controls. One big problem is that the players do not have a direct say in how professional chess is to be molded. They have to trust that the delegates of their federations will represent them properly and this is oftentimes not the case. Anyway, a third agenda is obviously to reunify the World title. To fail to do so is unfair to the players and the fans. A strong FIDE does not mean a FIDE that imposes its will on the players and the fans. A strong FIDE is one that will work fairly and responsibly WITH the players and the event organizers to promote the enjoyment of the game. |
|Nov-08-03|| ||talmax: I think that the future for chess lies in the balance between a strong but respected FIDE (a la Max Euwe's presidency) and an organisation that is truly representative of chess players - hopefully the Association of Chess Professionals (ACP; http://www.chess-players.org/eng/) or a similar body. Only with power-sharing will the game evolve on a world stage. |
|Mar-19-04|| ||Bears092: http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tm...|
Looks like it may happen after all.
|Mar-19-04|| ||square dance: i still say kasparov will eat him alive. btw why do they refer to pono as the official world number one? being fide champ does not make you the official world number one does it? i dont see how being any sort of champion makes you number one. fischer was #1 in 1970 before he won the title, kasparov had, i believe, passed up karpov on the ratings list before he became world champion, and now kramnik has been 2nd or 3rd while being the world champion. is this an honest mistake in the reporting or is it just fide propaganda? |
|Mar-19-04|| ||Drstrangelove: I doubt this will happen, The FIDE is very upset with Pono and has already found funding for their own knock out terny in Libya. |
|Mar-19-04|| ||MoonlitKnight: News journalists generally don't know much about chess. Ponomariov is neither world number 1 nor Kasparov's countryman.|
An amusing thing about this page is the year of the match, 2003. Also "Sorry, no games." on the top. That sort of sums up the current situation.
|Mar-19-04|| ||vonKrolock: the difference between Fischer and Kasparov is that one refused to defend his title AND dont played serious games since 1972, and the other actually crushed the OFFICIAL challenger in 1993, and continued to play against the strongest opposition... By the way, the title off Absolute World Champion is not property of FIDE , nor of anybody else - it belongs to the Highest Chess Elite |
|Mar-20-04|| ||square dance: <vonkrolok> i made those same points in one of my first discussions in the kibitzers cafe. these points define the reasons why kramnik is the world champion, not pono or fide's next paper champ. |
|Mar-20-04|| ||vonKrolock: d'accord, square dance... Kramnik is the 14th Champ... FIDE cycles 1994-96 and 98 demonstrated that in those days Karpov would be the proper challenger to Kasparov, whith Anand and Kamsky whith third and fourth names, but Kramnik was always the name whith more future, and future arrived |
|Mar-20-04|| ||square dance: <vonkrolok> i think kramnik was even #2 by the time the 2000 london match came off, if not he was #3 behind anand who refused a match with kasparov from what i have read. |
|Mar-20-04|| ||vonKrolock: correct... 'till 98' as I said, but "PCA and FIDE cycles", OK? From 1999 on, is another page, FIDE beasts are triyng to destroy Chess, but we shall resist and Kramnik is our leader in this fight |
|Jun-22-04|| ||pawn52: I wonder why the match was canceled? It would not have mattered anyway. The rankings b/t the two players was way too far apart. |
|Jun-23-04|| ||tomh72000: lol why is there a kibitzing page for a cancelled match? |
|Jun-19-05|| ||superiorNOshow: It is very interesting to just skim through the pages and see the progression alter from anticipation to disapointment. Also Chessgames on page 5 makes an interesting comment that this is the most kibitzed match they ever had. Wow, just look at how the website has progressed in just under 2 years!|
But yet it is very strange to see that this match was even considered. A tremendous insult to Kramnik and the foundations of the World Championship.
|Jun-19-05|| ||superiorNOshow: Was this an FIDE oragnized event?|
|May-02-08|| ||positionalgenius: Too bad this was cancelled... there would have been some really good games here.|
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