| Mar-06-04 | | Imbecil: If ....... Kg8
Rg3 Rh7
And then what? |
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| Mar-06-04 | | Brian Watson: 25.Qf5+ Kg8 26.fxg7 and black can avoid mate only at the cost of a rook. (If 25.fxg7 immediately, 25..Rf4) |
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| Mar-06-04 | | Kenkaku: 25...Kg8 26. fxg7 and black cannot save the game. For example 26...Rh7 27. Qxf7#, 26...Kxg7 27. Qxf7#, 26...Qe8 27. gxh8+ Kxh8 28. Rxh6+ Kg8 (28...Kg7 29. Qf6+ Kf8 40. Rh8#) 29. Qf6 and black cannot stop Rh8# for long. 25...Kg8 26. fxg7 Rf4 27. gxh8+ Kxg8 28. Qc8+ Kh7 29. Rxf4 exf4 30. Qf5+ Kg8 31. Qxf4 and it appears that mate will soon follow as well. |
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| Mar-07-04 | | Bitzovich: What about 15... Rxc3? |
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| Mar-07-04 | | Benjamin Lau: 15...Rxc3!? is an interesting shot but how about 16. Qxc3 Bxe4 17. Qg3! Kh7 18. Qh4 Qa8! 19. Rg3 Ng8 20. Qg4 g5 21. Qh5 Bxf5 22. Bxg5! Bxg5 23. Rxg5 Nf6 24. Qh4 Qe4 and I think white stands better chances in the endgame. I think that white at least holds a draw though after 16. Qxc3 Bxe4 17. Rg3 Kh7 18. Qe3 Qc8 19. Rxg7 with a perpetual. |
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| Mar-07-04 | | Brian Watson: <Bitzovich> your suggestion seems very strong to me. 15..Rxc3 16.Nxe4 (in contrast to Benjamin Lau's suggestion; this threatens Nf2+ and attacks the g3 square) 17.Qe1 Bg5. Now white can't avoid exchanging off his dangerous dark-square bishop, and black has an aggressive position.
<morphyvsfischer> I see you have this in your game collection -- any comment? |
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| Mar-07-04 | | Benjamin Lau: Watson: it doesn't really matter in any case to me. I think that the sacrifice is unsound and that a technician and strong defender like Fischer would have refuted it. Perhaps 15...Rxc3!? 16. Qxc3 Nxe4 17. Qe1 Bg5 17. Rh5!? Nf6 (I don't think it's good for black to exchange when down material; he must keep everything and attack IMO, but if you have a concrete attacking line, I would like to see it) 18. Bxg5 Bxg2! 19. Kg1! (16. Kxg2? Qa8+! 17. Kf2 Nxh5) Bf3 20. Rh3 Be4 21. Qh4! h5 with a double edged position that favors white in the long run IMO. You point out that white can't avoid exchanging his dangerous dark square bishop, but I don't see why black would want to exchange so much, already down the exchange. I think the continuation I have is better. I guess it has to do with personality perhaps. |
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| Mar-07-04 | | Benjamin Lau: That's 20...e4, not Be4. |
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| Nov-17-10 | | GeraldEK: B×h6 cool |
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| Mar-05-12 | | darshandatta: What about 23. Qg5 ? |
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Mar-05-12
 | | Sastre: 23.Qg5 Rhg8 forces the White queen to retreat because of the threat of 24...Qxh3. |
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| Mar-05-12 | | reilouco: This is my line, it seems all forced: 25... Kg8 26. fxg7 Rc7 27. gxh8Q+ Kxh8 28. Rxh6+ Kg8 29. Qh7+ Kf8 30. Qh8+ Ke7 31. Re6+ fxe6 32. Qf8+ Kd7 33. Rf7# If instead of 26... Rc7 black plays 26... Qe8, then:
27. gxh8Q+ Kxh8 28. Rxh6+ Kg8 29. Qg5+ Kf8 30. Rh8#
And if 28... Kg7 29. Qf6+ Kg8 30. Rh8#
I think I covered every possibilities. |
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| Mar-05-12 | | qqdos: <15...Rxc3!? exchange sac.> seems to be Black's best route to equality or more, leaving aside the wisdom of provoking a Fischer on the other side of the board! The following line seems promising if not conclusive: 15...Rxc3!? 16.Qxc3 Qd7 17.Bxh6 Nxe4 18.Qf3 Bg5 19.Re1 d5 20.Bxg7 Kxg7 21.f6+ Kg6 22. Qh5+ Kxf6 23.Rf3+ Ke7 24.Rxe4 dxe4 25.Qxg5+ f6 26.Qg7+ Ke8 26.Qxd7+ Kxd7 with material equal and Bishops of the same colour. Not easy for White to make progress. |
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| Mar-10-12 | | LoveThatJoker: GUESS-THE-MOVE FINAL SCORE:
Fischer vs J Kupper, 1959.
YOU ARE PLAYING THE ROLE OF FISCHER.
Your score: 31 (par = 20)
LTJ |
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| Apr-11-12 | | RodeOrm: Going for fun through old Fischergames, dont really understand why Benjamin claims the sacrifice is unsound based on 17.Qe1 variation, to start with black should not respond with 17.-Bg5 but instead 17.-d5! then follows 18.c3,Bc5 19.Be3,d4, with at least counterplay, however, 16.-Bxe4! 17.Qg3,Kh7 18.Bxh6,gxh6 19.Qh4,h5! And winning, also 19.-Bxg2+ 20.Kxg2, Rg8+ 21.Kf1,Ng4 followed by Qa8 fills it means. another intresting variation might be the 13.-Rc8!? 14.Bg5,Rxc3!?, Black get a pawn, and the black MO, a strong center.
Benjamin claim the sacrifice is unsound, but whatabout whites immature queenrook? Further on, the c1 bishop is only involved in the game because of the "sac"threat on h6, you can look at it this way, white is trying to run black over with badly developed pieces and a center that is not secured. Therefor the Lxb4 needs to be tried. Black probablly stood better after 14.Rf3?! but 2 bad investments after eachother, (Kh7 and Qd7) was enough to bankrupt blacks position. Both were way to passive in a razorsharp position, when white is making the Rf3 move he aint bringing any flowers! The game is instructive to illustrate how to defend against a flankattack with an counterattack in the center. Regards |
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| Apr-11-12 | | RodeOrm: PS: In all fairness to Benjamin it has to be said that his commentary is more then 8 years old, i didnt pay attention to that fact when i wrote the respond. |
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| Apr-11-12 | | RodeOrm: PPS: Missed one variation, if, according to Benjamin 18.Qh4,then Bxf5, followed by -Ng4 seem to leave white in despair. |
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| Apr-11-12 | | RodeOrm: PPPS. Further on...if 17.Rg3, then 17.-Bxf5 kills the perpetual, and the position is unclear. |
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| Sep-04-18 | | jabinjikanza: Excellent dispensention by Bob. |
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Mar-09-21
 | | kingscrusher: Blimey it seems a big wrinkle in an otherwise very smooth looking game. Black misses a key exchange sacrifice opportunity it seems at move 15: Robert James Fischer - Josef Kupper 1-0 4.0, Zurich Zurich SUI 1959
click for larger viewAnalysis by Stockfish 13:
1. -+ (-1.87): 16.bxc3 Nxe4 17.Be3 d5 18.Bg1 Qd6 19.Rd1 Qc7 20.Qe3 Bc5 21.Qe1 Rd8 22.Rhd3 Nf6 23.Qg3 Kf8 24.Bxc5+ bxc5 25.c4 Ne4 26.Qh4 d4 27.Re1 Nf6 28.Qg3 Re8 29.Ba4 Re7 30.Ra3 a5 31.Rb3 Be4 32.Rxe4 Nxe4 2. -+ (-2.34): 16.Qxc3 Nxe4 17.Qe1 d5 18.c3 Qd7 19.Rf3 Bf6 20.Bc2 Nd6 21.Qg3 e4 22.Rf1 Bc8 23.Ba4 Qe7 24.Qh3 Rd8 25.Be3 Nc4 26.Bb5 Nxb2 27.Bd4 Bxd4 28.cxd4 Qf6 29.Qe3 Bd7 30.Bxd7 Rxd7 31.Qf2 Nc4 32.Rac1 e3 33.Qg3 e2
Black is clearly better
(Gavriel, 09.03.2021)
So maybe the absolute truth is, White was taking some sort of risk with the rook lift. Early at move 14 instead of the optimistic Rf3 perhaps Nd5 is more solid and being content with a small advantage. If the Knight is not on c3 then no exchange sac with Rxc3 is possible :) |
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Kibitzing
sac: 20.Bxh6