|
< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 2 OF 2 ·
Later Kibitzing> |
| Jun-02-03 | | drukenknight: muayad: funny you should say that, want to see a miniature where the sack is on h7? 1 e4 d6 2 Nf3 g6 3 h4 Bg7 4 Be2 00 5 h5 e5 6 Ng5 Nxh5 7 Nxh7 Kxh7 8 Bxh5 gxh5 9 Qxh5+ 1-0 |
|
| Oct-02-05 | | notyetagm: <muayad ali: The whole idea of Bg5,h4,Nh2 and a piece sacrifice on g4 is now a standard plan against the King's indian.> Wow, so this is the game in which Keres introduced this plan against the King's Indian. |
|
| Dec-29-05 | | KingG: Very instructive game. |
|
| Jun-12-11 | | Breyannis Nektarios: In fact, this is not the stem game.
Keres-Matanovic, Moscow 1963, is the one.
As for the game, I think a competent mythbuster may prove someday that in fact the position is not at all bad for Black after the simple 23...Qd7 (instead of the dreadful 23...Bg6). Indeed, it may even be clearly better for him!
He will exchange rooks on the f-file, has a protected passed pawn, pawn on d5 is weak, white knight (h2) on the rim... |
|
| Mar-21-12 | | Anderssen99: Probably Keres, who strove for artistic moments in his games, planned the fabulous mating position that follows: 36. ...,Kh8. 37.Nf7+,Kg8 (...,Kg7. 38.h6+,Kg8. 39.Nd8+,Kh8. 40.Rxf8+ mating). 38.Nd8+,Kg7. 39.Qf7+!!,Kh8. 41.Qxf8+,Qg8. 42.Rh6+,Bh7. 43.Nf7 mate!! |
|
| Jun-25-17 | | Walter Glattke: 24.-Rxf2 25.Nxh6+ Kh7 26.Qxf2 - no attack, but one pawn. |
|
Jun-25-17
 | | al wazir: I think 28. Ne4 would also have won: 28...Bxf1 29. Qg6+ Kh8 30. Nf6 Bxg2+ 31. Kxg2 Qxf6 32. Qxf6+. Or 28...Bxe4 29. Qxe4+ Kh8 30. Rf7 Bg7 31. Qg6 Qg8 32. h6 Qxf7 33. Qxf7. Or 28...Qc8 29. Nf6+ Kh6 30. Ng8+ Kh7 31. Rf7+ Kh8 32. Qg5 Qc2 (32...Qd8 33. Nf6; 33...Qe8 33. Nh6) 33. Nf6 Bh7 34. Rxh7+ Qxh7 35. Nxh7 Kxh7. |
|
| Jun-25-17 | | AlicesKnight: The opening sequence is not hard to find as there are few other productive options. The problems caused by the Black domination of the h7-b1 line are less easy to resolve and Keres works beautifully to handle them. <al-wazir> may also be right about Ne4. |
|
| Jun-25-17 | | agb2002: White has two knights for the bishop pair.
White seems to have the opportunity of winning a pawn at least with 24.Nxg4 hxg4 (24... Rxf2 25.Nxh6+) 25.Qxg4. For example, 25... Kh7 26.h5 Bd3 27.Rxf8 Bxf8 28.Ne4 Bxf1 29.Qg6+ Kh8 30.Nf6 Qxf6 31.Qxf6+ followed by 32.Qxf1 + - [Q+2P vs r+b]. I don't have time for more. |
|
| Jun-25-17 | | Jambow: 34. Qg5+... Kh8 35. Qf6+...Kh7 36. Qg6+...Kh8 37. Qh7# is about blitz-able imho. Of course the first four or five moves starting at the beginning are pretty obvious as well. I wouldn't put this as a five star solution as too many normal moves are involved and I think I would have seen this OTB. |
|
| Jun-25-17 | | Ariogermano: 27.f8 ?!
I thought 27.f7➕ .... |
|
| Jun-25-17 | | malt: I got 24.N:g4 hg4 25.Q:g4 Kh7 missed 26.h5 |
|
| Jun-25-17 | | morfishine: <AlicesKnight: The opening sequence is not hard to find as there are few other productive options> Ditto ***** |
|
| Jun-25-17 | | patzer2: For today's Sunday puzzle (24. ?), my first inclination was to sacrifice the Knight for two pawns with 24. Nxg4  .However, 24. Rxf8+ Bxf8 25. Nxg4  to looked like a promising alternative. So I plugged in the position (24. ?) to compare 24. Nxg4 and 24. Rxf8+ on Stockfish 8. The program indicated both moves are likely winners, but 24. Nxg4 is clearly stronger. However, 24. Rxf8+ is the program's second choice. Here are the results of the Stockfish 8 analsis of 24. Nxg4 and 24. Rxf8+: [Stockfish 8 64 @ 37 depth:+3.20] 24.Nxg4 hxg4 25.Rxf8+ Bxf8 26.Qxg4 Kh7 27.h5 Bd3 28.Rf3 Qe8 29.Rxd3 Kh6 30.Qe6+ Qxe6 31.dxe6 e4 32.Rd4 Re8 33.Rxe4 Kxh5 34.Nd5 Be7 35.Kg1 Kg6 36.Kf2 Bf6 37.Rg4+ Bg5 38.Kf3 a5 39.b3 Rf8+ 40.Ke4 Kh6 41.Rf4 Bxf4 42.gxf4 Rh8 43.f5 b5 44.f6 Kg6 45.f7 Kg7 46.Nf4 Rh4 47.g3 Rh2 48.Kd5 Rxa2 49.Kxd6 Rd2+ 50.Kc6 [Stockfish 8 64 @ 36 depth: +1.81] 24.Rxf8+ Bxf8 25.Nxg4 Bg7 26.Nf2 Qe7 27.Nfe4 Rf8 28.Rxf8+ Bxf8 29.Ng5 Bh6 30.Ne6 Qh7 31.Qc4 Qe7 32.Ne4 a6 33.Kh2 a5 34.Qc8+ Kf7 35.Qc2 Kg8 36.Qc4 Kh7 37.N4g5+ Bxg5 38.Nxg5+ Kh6 39.Qc8 Kg7 40.g4 hxg4 41.Qxg4 b6 42.g3 Kh6 43.Qf3 Kg7 44.g4 Qf6 45.Ne6+ Kf7 46.Kg3 Qxf3+ 47.Kxf3 Bc2 48.h5 Bd1+ 49.Kg3 |
|
| Jun-25-17 | | Iwer Sonsch: Something I would play positionally. |
|
Jun-25-17
 | | Fusilli: I think some of you guys are confusing the question "solve this puzzle" with "would you play, for whatever reason, the winning move if you had this position?" The former means you have to calculate as far as you can and you only solve the puzzle if your calculations are correct and you reach a winning position. The latter simply means whether you would guess the best move right. I think the beauty and skill of this puzzle are being underrated because the first move is, as others have said, obvious. But it's obvious only because it's a puzzle where someone tells us that white has a winning move. So, it must be Nxg4. In real play, no one tells you you have a winning move, and you know that if you give away that knight, it won't come back, and the black LSB really does look like a mighty defender. (Granted, in this particular position, the present value of that knight is zero, so one might as well sac it intuitively, though.) |
|
| Jun-25-17 | | drollere: i also quickly saw Nxg4, pxg4; Qxg4, Kh7; h4, which means this is not a difficult puzzle. but the maneuvering that follows to avoid the QB on b1/h7, block the back rank with the KB (Rxf8, Bxf8), pin the bishop (Rf7) and annoy the Q into fleeing (Nd6), is orchestrated beautifully. <planned the fabulous mating position ... Nd8+> maybe. walther certainly saw Ng5+ losing the Q and mate soon enough. |
|
| Jun-25-17 | | RandomVisitor: <Breyannis Nektarios><I think a competent mythbuster may prove someday that in fact the position is not at all bad for Black after the simple 23...Qd7 (instead of the dreadful 23...Bg6).> After 23...Qd7
click for larger viewStockfish_17061704_x64_modern: <45 minutes computer time> <-0.52/45 24.Ne4 Bxe4 25.Rxf8+ Rxf8 26.Qxe4 Qh7> 27.Rxf8+ Bxf8 28.Qe2 Qf7 29.Qd3 Be7 30.Nf1 e4 31.Qc4 Qf2 32.Qc8+ Kh7 33.Nd2 e3 34.Ne4 e2 35.Nxf2 e1Q+ 36.Kh2 Qxf2 37.Qe8 Qe2 38.Qxh5+ Kg7 39.Qf5 Qe5 40.Qxg4+ Kf7 41.Qf3+ Ke8 42.Qb3 Bf6 43.Qb5+ Kf8 44.Qxb7 Bxh4 45.Qa8+ Kf7 46.Qxa7+ Kg6 47.Qf2 Bf6 48.Qc2+ Qf5 49.Qxf5+ Kxf5 50.b3 Ke5 51.g4 Kxd5 52.Kg3 Ke4 53.a4 Bc3 54.g5 d5 55.g6 Kf5 56.a5 Be1+ 57.Kf3 -1.00/45 24.Nb5 Bh7 25.Rf6 Rxf6 26.Rxf6 Bg7 27.Re6 Re8 28.Rxe8+ Qxe8 29.Nxd6 Qd7 30.Ne4 Qxd5 31.Ng5 Bd3 32.Qd2 Qc4 33.Nf1 Bxf1 34.Qd7 Bxg2+ 35.Kxg2 Qc6+ 36.Qxc6 bxc6 37.Kf2 Bf6 38.Ne4 Be7 39.Ke2 Kf7 40.Kd3 Ke6 41.Ke3 Bf8 42.Kd3 Bb4 43.Ng5+ Kf5 44.Ne4 Kg6 45.Ng5 Be7 46.Ne4 a5 47.Ke3 Kf5 48.b3 Bb4 49.Kd3 |
|
| Jun-25-17 | | Jack Kerouac: Incremental Chess.
Exploit or create paths into a crack in the wall.28 R-F3 the Master Move. The King is sweating in his lonely isolation against his walled in fortress; Keres dosen't Care.... |
|
Jun-25-17
 | | Jimfromprovidence: I'm curious whether or not 28...Qe8 29 Rxd3 Kh6, below, is any better than the text.
click for larger viewThe threat is 30...Qxh5+, which leaves white slightly ahead. If 30 Qe6+ Qxe6 31 dxe6 Re8 follows, is white that much better off I guess is my question. 
click for larger view |
|
| Jun-25-17 | | tonsillolith: <Fusilli> I completely agree with you. Many users seem to have a mistaken assessment of what it means to solve a puzzle and their ability to do so. |
|
| Jun-25-17 | | Marmot PFL: 24 nxg4 hg4 25 Qxg4 Kh7 26 h5 Bd3 27 Rxf8 Bxf8 28 Rf7 looks like a strong attack but I could not find a decisive line. |
|
| Jun-25-17 | | RandomVisitor: After 23...Bg6
click for larger viewStockfish_17061704_x64_modern: <2 hours computer time> <+4.24/46 24.Nxg4 hxg4 25.Rxf8+ Bxf8 26.Qxg4 Kh7 27.h5 Bd3 28.Rf3 Qe8> 29.Rxd3 Kh6 30.Qe6+ Qxe6 31.dxe6 e4 32.Re3 Re8 33.Rxe4 Kxh5 34.Nd5 Be7 35.Kg1 Kg6 36.Kf2 Kg5 37.Kf3 Kf5 38.b3 a6 39.Re3 Bg5 40.Re1 Be7 41.Re4 Kg5 42.Ke3 Bf6 43.e7 Be5 44.Kf3 b5 45.Rg4+ Kf5 46.Rh4 Kg5 47.Rh7 Kg6 48.Nc7 Rc8 49.Rh1 Kf7 50.e8Q+ Rxe8 51.Nxe8 Kxe8 52.Rh7 Bb2 53.Ra7 b4 54.Rxa6 +2.43/46 24.Rxf8+ Bxf8 25.Nxg4 Bg7 26.Nf2 Qe7 27.Nfe4 a6 28.Ng5 Rf8 29.Rxf8+ Bxf8 30.Kh2 Qe8 31.g4 Be7 32.Ne6 b5 33.Ne4 Qf7 34.g5 Qf5 35.Ng3 Qd3 36.Qxd3 Bxd3 37.Nxh5 Bc4 38.Nc7 Bxa2 39.g4 Bb3 40.Nxa6 Bd1 41.Kg3 Kf7 42.Nc7 Be2 43.Nf6 Bxf6 44.gxf6 Kxf6 45.g5+ Kf7 46.Kf2 Bc4 47.h5 b4 48.Ke3 Bb3 49.Nb5 Bxd5 50.Nxd6+ Ke6 51.Nc8 Bb7 52.Nb6 Kf5 53.g6 Kf6 54.Nd7+ Kg5 |
|
| Jun-25-17 | | patzer2: I let the position after 23...Bg6 run for over 10 hours on Stockfish 8 to 48 depth with the following result: [Stockfish 8 64] 48:+3.72] 24.Nxg4 hxg4 25.Rxf8+ Bxf8 26.Qxg4 Kh7 27.h5 Bd3 28.Rf3 Qc8 29.Qg5 Bc2 30.Qd2 Qg4 31.Qxc2+ Kg8 32.Qf5 Qxf5 33.Rxf5 Rc8 34.Kh2 b5 35.g4 Rc4 36.Rg5+ Kh8 37.Nxb5 Rb4 38.Nxa7 Rxb2 39.Rg6 Rd2 40.a4 Rxd5 41.Nb5 Rd2 42.Kg3 Ra2 43.Nxd6 Ra3+ 44.Kh4 Rxa4 45.Nf7+ Kh7 46.Nxe5 Be7+ 47.Kh3 Ra5 48.Nd7 Bg5 49.Nf6+ Bxf6 50.Rxf6 Kg7 51.Rg6+ Kh7 52.Re6 Kg7 53.Re7+ Kf6 54.Rc7 Ra3+ 55.Kh4 Ra2 56.g5+ Kf5 (position at end of analysis below) 
click for larger viewStockfish 8 analysis of above position: Mate in 15 after 57. g4+ Ke6 58. Ke6 g6
[Stockfish 8 64] 48:+2.19} 24.Rxf8+ Bxf8 25.Nxg4 Bg7 26.Nf2 Qe7 27.Nfe4 Rf8 28.Rxf8+ Bxf8 29.Ng5 Bh6 30.Ne6 a6 31.Ne4 Bf7 32.Qc4 Bg6 33.Kh2 Kh7 34.Qb4 b5 35.Qxd6 Qxd6 36.Nxd6 e4 37.Kg1 e3 38.Kf1 Bb1 39.a3 Ba2 40.Nf4 Bxf4 41.gxf4 Bxd5 42.g3 Bf3 43.Nf5 Kg6 44.Nxe3 Be4 45.Ke2 a5 46.Kd2 b4 47.Nc4 bxa3 48.bxa3 Bd5 49.Ne3 Ba2 50.Kc3 Be6 51.Kd4 Bd7 52.Ke5 (position at end of analysis below) 
click for larger viewStockfish 8 evaluation of above position: 52...Kg7 53. f5 (+56.58 @ 39 depth) P.S.: So it appears both 24. Nxg4 and 24. Rxf8+ win for White. However, I'm not sure why the evaluations given by Stockfish 8 are so low -- especially since the final positions for the analysis of both moves are clearly decisive wins for White. |
|
| Jun-26-17 | | Jambow: <I think the beauty and skill of this puzzle are being underrated because the first move is, as others have said, obvious. But it's obvious only because it's a puzzle where someone tells us that white has a winning move.> Not in my case at least and I think this applies to others. I stated clearly this is something I would probably have found during a game, it is a normal theme at a normal juncture. Most of the moves play themselves after that, there are a few branches in the middle and then the mate can be applied various ways, but again the moves are quite natural. Not a bad puzzle, a good example of sacking a piece to get an attack on the king, but the knight was dead otherwise anyway. You start by getting two pawns in front of the enemy king with an attack? That is the kind of thing quickly found in blitz games.So maybe 5 stars for some but probably 3 for most attacking players... |
|
 |
|
< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 2 OF 2 ·
Later Kibitzing> |
Kibitzing
sac: 24.Nxg4
icon.