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< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 3 OF 3 ·
Later Kibitzing> |
Jan-11-12
 | | FSR: 9.g3 wins in 18 moves, A Kiseleva vs T Elizarova, 2009, unless Black finds 9...Ng4! with large advantage. |
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| Jan-11-12 | | Garech: Ha! Sorry guys, my mistake. Glad to see Petrosian winning in his usual style, a great game!! -Garech |
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Jan-11-12
 | | maxi: I agree with <FSR> that 19...Ng4 is a great move. (But, does White really win otherwise...?) It has the ugly positional threat of blocking in the dark-squares Bishop. It is to avoid this possibility that White was lead to weaken his position. |
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| Jan-11-12 | | SuperPatzer77: <srag> <1) White's first mistake is 5)Qxd8+: "Thou shalt not exchange Queens in the opening with Tigran Petrosian!"...> <srag> Yeah, that's exactly right! we chessfolks should add this one to the Ten Commandments. (Just kidding - LOL LOL). Tigran Petrosian was an excellent endgame player when no Queens were on the board. SuperPatzer77 |
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| Jan-11-12 | | LoveThatJoker: <superpatzer77 and srag> Here's a famous example where Petrosian wins with and without his Q. Petrosian vs Spassky, 1966
;) LTJ |
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| Jan-11-12 | | bischopper: tigran petrosian and your book how to be on the top? very good |
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| Jan-11-12 | | SuperPatzer77: < LoveThatJoker: <superpatzer77 and srag> Here's a famous example where Petrosian wins with and without his Q.
Petrosian vs Spassky, 1966...>
<LoveTheJoker> Yeah, I love the game between Petrosian and Spassky. Many thanks!! SuperPatzer77 |
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| Jan-11-12 | | LoveThatJoker: <superpatzer77> My pleasure, man! It's a classic! LTJ |
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Jan-11-12
 | | eternaloptimist: This game really demonstrated petrosian's mastery of the old indian. I've always liked the old indian but a lot of people don't like it b/c they think it's passive, cramped & boring. I think patient is a better word to use than passive. It might be cramped (for a while) but if u understand the themes of the old indian, u can eventually change that much of the time to give your pieces more scope. Petrosian also proved that it's not boring. It also is an opening that requires good understanding of pawn structures & understanding of which pawns to push & when. This is how he he beat his opponents much of the time. Timing & patience were 2 things that petrosian definitely had & his ingenious games will always hold a special place in our hearts! |
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Jan-12-12
| | maxi: <eternaloptimist> I have always heard that the Q exchange variation of the OID is no good for White. Agree? |
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Jan-12-12
| | eternaloptimist: <maxi> yes I would agree. MCO-15 (2008) only gives 1 line of the exchange variation in it & it leads to equality. I'm willing to bet that GM de Firmian only put 1 line in the book b/c he doesn't think that it's a good line for white. What petrosian played transposes into this MCO line.: 6...♘d7 7 ♘f3 c6 8 0-0-0 ♔c7=. The exchange variation leads to easy equality for black. Yes black can't castle but the ♕s r off the board & white can't whip up a quick attack to take advantage of black's uncastled ♔. Petrosian was definitely the king of the old indian w/ a record of 9 wins, 8 draws & only 1 loss in the chessgames database but lothar schmid was also a very good old indian player w/ a record of 12 wins, 24 draws & only 3 losses in the chessgames database. |
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Jan-12-12
| | eternaloptimist: Here r some links for petrosian's & schmid's old indian games as black.:
http://www.chessgames.com/perl/ches...
http://www.chessgames.com/perl/ches... |
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Jan-12-12
| | maxi: Very interesting. |
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Jan-12-12
| | eternaloptimist: Thx! I strive to make my kibitzes interesting. |
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| Jan-14-12 | | Tigranny: Nice game by my favorite player, Tigran. |
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| Feb-08-12 | | screwdriver: A very valuable instructive game by Tigran Petrosian. He shows you don't always have to be sacking everything for a checkmate to win games. |
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| Feb-08-12 | | drukenknight: it is a very nice game and very worthy of study. Did Petrosian say anything about white's 30th and 33rd moves? Exchanging Rooks at that pt has to be bad and walking into a pin is almost never good. |
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| Aug-17-12 | | backrank: 'Whenever you can castle with check, do it!' Seirawan once recommended. But in the game above, 7 0-0-0+ seems to achieve next to nothing:
click for larger viewIt could only have achieved something if Black were tempted to play 8 Nf3 Ng4??
Then he would have been punished by 9 Bd8#.
click for larger view(Maybe this guy Aganalian has dreamed of this?)
Therefore, Tigran plays 8 ... Nbd7 not only to cover the e-pawn, but also in preparation of Ng4. After White's 21th move, Tigran has not a single piece developed (in the classical sense), and yet he has a vastly superior game: 
click for larger viewAnd only 5 moves later, all of his pieces are not only developed, but they occupy squares where they are safe and effective at the same time: 
click for larger viewAnd White has almost run out of moves yet.
Petrosian was 16 when he played this game in 1945. Maybe it's the earliest example of his typical style. A pity for us that White didn't play on in the final position: 
click for larger viewA few more moves would have been quite instructive. |
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Aug-17-12
 | | Phony Benoni: Castling with check is not always to recommended; for example, take this position:
click for larger view1.Rd1+ is a very good move. 1.0-0-0+ doesn't have quite the same oomph. |
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| Aug-18-12 | | backrank: <Phony Benoni> Nice example! Did you compose it yourself? 0-0-0+ Nd3#! is painful indeed :)
But remember it was Seirawan who made the recommendation, not me! |
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Aug-18-12
| | Phony Benoni: <backrank> Just threw it together. Tongue-in-cheek, as was Seirawan's comment. |
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| Dec-28-12 | | estrick: This is game #25 in Irving Chernev's "The Most Instructive Games Ever Played -62 Masterpieces of Chess Strategy" Chernev gives an exclamation mark for Petrosian's 16th, 19th, 28th and 31st moves. For 16 ... Nde4! Chernev explains, "The Knight invades enemy territory with two threats:
(1) 17 ...Nxc3 ruining White's Pawn position on the Queen side
(2) Nxg3 saddling White with an isolated e-Pawn"
for 19 ...h5! Chernev says, "A valuable zwishenzug. The threat of winning a Pawn by 20 ... hxg4 forces White to capture first, and opens a file for Black's Rook. The Bishop will not run away, as Nimzovich used to say." After 20 ...Nxg3, Black has the two bishops, which dominate much of the board, and combined with his control of the h-file, create the opportunity for the decisive exchange sacrifice which leads to Petrosian's acquisition of two connected passed pawns marching up the e & f-files. |
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Mar-10-15
 | | yiotta: This game, played at the age of 16, already has the elements of a typical Petrosian game. As <backrank> noted, after W's 21st move, his pieces are all on their original squares except the King, who has had a nice walk. It won't be long now before he finds an opportunity to sac the exchange. There is truly a lot to learn from this little gem. |
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Jan-05-22
 | | GrahamClayton: 23. b3 a4 24. Kb2 ab3 25. Kb3 b5 winning a pawn. |
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| Jan-06-22 | | Dionysius1: 28.g4...oh NO!!! Aganalian poked the bear!
And was never seen again! |
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Kibitzing
sac: 28...Rxh3