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Valery Atlas vs Ye Jiangchuan
"Atlas Shrugged" (game of the day Feb-16-2009)
Olympiad (1994), Moscow RUS, rd 1, Dec-01
Sicilian Defense: Paulsen. Bastrikov Variation (B48)  ·  0-1



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Kibitzer's Corner
< Earlier Kibitzing  · PAGE 2 OF 2 ·  Later Kibitzing>
Feb-16-09  Jim Bartle: I'd just like to clarify that the article WK links to is a column on the WSJ Editorial Page, not an article in the WSJ itself. There's a big difference.
Feb-16-09  Jim Bartle: "Maybe he kicked sand in his face."

That does happen to 97-pound weaklings.

Feb-16-09  technical draw: <Atlas Shrugged!!! Any Ayn Rand fans out there?> I forced myself to read the whole thick book. (you had to be Atlas just to hold the darn thing!) But alas her philosophy to me is just well, how can I say it without offending, nonsense?

I'll have to agree with <JB> on this one. Rand's idea may work for individuals because of it's pyramidal base but for society at large the pyramid will eventually collapse.

Feb-16-09  GeauxCool: <Jim Bartle> Greenspan went against her philosophy with that one (credit-lending, and free housing - not Ayn Rand).

<TD> The book decomposes after the train crosses the bridge - I thought the story got lost in her crackpipe.

Feb-16-09  nimzo knight: <Jim> I think extrapolating Any's work to economics can be an over-stretch. She did not, for most part,talk in that context. At least in my opinion she is often considered to be promoting "self-interest without any moral obligations". I often found her essays to be promoting "all laws of moral behavior should lead to fulfillment of interests of individual in particular and society in general".

For our current crisis, ya I agree the system erred too much on side of deregulation. But this is easy to say in hindsight. It re-taught us a simple lesson: No simple principle holds true in all places at all times. In fact beliefs that bring most of prosperity are cause of major demise, as we are least willing to relinquish them or even question them.

Feb-16-09  Jim Bartle: nimzo: But that's exactly what Moore is claiming on the WSJ editorial page, that this happened because we didn't follow Rand's prescriptions.

GeauxCool: Again, I'm no expert (but I play one at But as I understand it, Greenspan agreed to deregulate the financial system, particularly one part whose name I can't remember (credit swaps?), saying that what the individuals did would be in the best interest of society? Isn't that following Rand?

Feb-16-09  GeauxCool: <Jim Bartle> Greenspan's decision to drop the need of collateral in order to give someone a free home, so that we may artificially stimulate the economy by default, was not a concrete action that followed Rand's philosophy. He may have voiced an intention or a desire to follow an abstract notion of Rand's by this ation, but I don't find any support that the action itself would have been an action supported by Rand.

Feb-16-09  Jim Bartle: I'll agree with that, GCool.

But Greenspan also said: "Those of us who have looked to the self-interest of lending institutions to protect shareholder’s equity (myself especially) are in a state of shocked disbelief,”

What was he referring to, other than that financial institutions acted out of the self-interest of their managers, looking at huge upsides to risky investments, rather than protecting the interests of the many (the shareholders)?

Feb-16-09  Zzyw: Comments here much more interesting than the game itself.

Could it be that White's 25th and 26th were switched?

Also it looks like time trouble had White defending terribly and playing on way too long.

Feb-16-09  GeauxCool: <Jim Bartle> And in terms of Ayn Rand's Atlas Shrugged, he was shocked that the financial managers acted like moochers instead of 'producers'. That the very people who should have respected the term of 'Money' had forgotten its definitions.

Definitions of Money, from Atlas Shrugged:

Feb-16-09  Jim Bartle: Changing the subject slightly, the WSJ column makes the claim that "Atlas Shrugged" is "the only classic novel of recent decades that was never made into a movie."

That just has to be a totally absurd statement. Limiting myself to my limited knowledge of American authors, very few of the works of Updike, Bellow, Ellison, Mailer, Vidal, Baldwin, Oates, Styron ("Nat Turner"), Pynchon, DeLillo, Morrison or Carver have become movies. Even "A Confederacy of Dunces," which seems screen-ready, has never been filmed.

And those are only the Americans.

Feb-16-09  WeakSquare: Apparently Spassky didn't have enough worries in his life, so he also had to read Ayn Rand's letters...
Feb-16-09  MaxxLange: That's the only novel the WSJ editorial board has read...
Feb-16-09  technical draw: Forget Ayn Rand go to where the real money is, get your bets in at the chessbookie! New bets just posted.
Feb-16-09  goodevans: Amazed to see more kibitzing out there about the book than the game.

The book was recommended to me as a favorite of a friend. I liked the first chapter but got increasingly irritated by it the further I read. I found the philosophy quite offensive in its damning of the ordinary individual and gave up about a third of the way through.

Feb-16-09  Marmot PFL: Money, get away.
Get a good job with good pay and youre okay.
Money, its a gas.
Grab that cash with both hands and make a stash.
New car, caviar, four star daydream,
Think Ill buy me a football team.

Money, get back.
Im all right jack keep your hands off of my stack.
Money, its a hit.
Dont give me that do goody good @#$%*&!#.
Im in the high-fidelity first class traveling set
And I think I need a lear jet.

Money, its a crime.
Share it fairly but dont take a slice of my pie.
Money, so they say
Is the root of all evil today.
But if you ask for a raise its no surprise that theyre Giving none away.

Feb-16-09  WhiteRook48: evidently Atlas didn't check his map properly
Feb-16-09  swarmoflocusts: "Jim Bartle: "Maybe he kicked sand in his face."

That does happen to 97-pound weaklings."

I believe it was 98 pounds, unless you're referencing something else.

Feb-16-09  Jim Bartle: I believe you're right!
Feb-16-09  technical draw: Hey! Weaklings can go on a diet too!
Premium Chessgames Member
  TheTamale: Note: Ayn Rand had a low opinion of professional chess; see her open letter to Boris Spassky.
Feb-16-09  technical draw: Atlas Shrugs is Pamela Geller"s pro-Israel blog:

Feb-17-09  Jim Bartle: Oh man. Pamela Atlas. She is so far right, and so nutty, it becomes pure entertainment. I had so much fun mocking her youtube videos that she banned me.

Go to youtube and type in "atlasshrugs2000." Unending fun.

Premium Chessgames Member
  kevin86: I guess Atlas couldn't shrug this one off-lol
Feb-17-09  technical draw: <kevin86> I think that's a bit, uh, corny.
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