| Dec-26-07 | | paladin at large: Bogo's play looks inept. What's the plan ?- and his rooks are wimps. Is this the way you get a defense named for you? |
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| Jul-30-08 | | RookFile: Send in the clowns! |
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| Jul-30-08 | | Octal: 18. ... Nb7. I fianchettoed a Knight! |
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| Jul-30-08 | | grasser: Double blunder here.
27...Rd4
28.Rxd4 followed by Nb5 wins a pawn.
28.Ree1 should lose to 28...Nc5 with mate threatened at a6. Forcing White to play 29.Nxa4 losing the Knight. |
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| Jul-30-08 | | grasser: My Fritz 11 gives White a winning advantage
after 50.bxc5??
Anyone know why, seeing as it is a perpetual? |
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| Jul-30-08 | | Boomie: <grasser: My Fritz 11 gives White a winning advantage
after 50.bxc5??
Anyone know why, seeing as it is a perpetual?>You probably have the wrong position set up. There is no perpetual here.
click for larger view |
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| Jul-30-08 | | Helios727: Maybe Fritz doesn't look out for kamikazi stalemate threats. |
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| Jul-30-08 | | Helios727: It is a perpetual because black can keep checking with the rook at all cost and if white takes the rook, the game is a stalemate. |
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| Jul-30-08 | | arsen387: that's why is that 50.g3+, to avoid <Helios>'s mentioned stalemate trap. I've never seen more stupid plan, than black's Ra8-a5-c5 accompanied wih bringing the other R to d4. the only interesting part of this game is that stalemate trap |
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| Jul-30-08 | | whiteshark: After piece clearance on f5 I think Black had a small positional surplus. Maybe <17...Nf7> and after <18.Nd2 Rf8 19.f3 Rh5> 
click for larger view |
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| Jul-30-08 | | Boomie: <Helios727: Maybe Fritz doesn't look out for kamikazi stalemate threats.> Oops. I missed the kamikazi rook. Sigh. |
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| Jul-30-08 | | sallom89: how can the ending be stalemate... even with the rook threats :/ |
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| Jul-30-08 | | bartolome: 50. bxc5 leads to stalemate. nice |
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| Jul-30-08 | | RedStarRising: <grasser: My Fritz 11 gives White a winning advantage after 50.bxc5??
Anyone know why, seeing as it is a perpetual?> and <bartolome: 50. bxc5 leads to stalemate. nice> No, 50. bxc5 does not lead to stalemate. As <sallom89> already points out, how could it be, as Black still retains his rook move options. Why does White have a winning advantage after 50. bxc5? Here’s why: 50... Ra3+ 51. Ke4 Re3+ 52. Kf5 Re5+! 53. Kf6 (53. Kxe5? would be stalemate) Rxd5 54. g3+ Kh3 55. Rg5 Rd4 56. f4 Rc4 57. Ke6 Kh2 58. Kd5 Rc3 59. c6 Kg2 60. Kd6 Kf2 61. Rxh5 Rd3+ 62. Rd5 Rxg3 63. c7 Rg8 64. Rb5 Ra8 65. Rb8 Ra4 66. c8=Q Rxf4 67. Ke5 |
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| Jul-30-08 | | RookFile: <RedStarRising: No, 50. bxc5 does not lead to stalemate. As <sallom89> already points out, how could it be, as Black still retains his rook move options. Why does White have a winning advantage after 50. bxc5? Here’s why: 50... Ra3+ 51. Ke4 Re3+ 52. Kf5 Re5+! 53. Kf6 (53. Kxe5? would be stalemate) Rxd5 54. g3+ Kh3 55. Rg5 Rd4 56. f4 Rc4 57. Ke6 Kh2 58. Kd5 Rc3 59. c6 Kg2 60. Kd6 Kf2 61. Rxh5 Rd3+ 62. Rd5 Rxg3 63. c7 Rg8 64. Rb5 Ra8 65. Rb8 Ra4 66. c8=Q Rxf4 67. Ke5 > I'm afraid you missed the point. Black keeps right on offering the rook, in suicide mode, e.g. 50... Ra3+ 51. Ke4 Re3+ 52. Kf5 Re5+ 53. Kf6 Re6+ 54. Kf7 Rf6+ 55. Kg8 Rf8+ etc. |
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Jul-30-08
 | | Phony Benoni: <grasser: Double blunder here. 27...Rd4 28.Rxd4 followed by Nb5 wins a pawn.> Perhaps; but since White quickly wins a couple of pawns anyway, it doesn't matter very much. Black might get some counterplay after 29.Nb5 d3 30.Nxc7 Nc5. Kupchik's motto in this game is to try and give Black absolutely no chances whatsoever, which was a very good idea againt Bogoljubov at this time. <28.Ree1 should lose to 28...Nc5 with mate threatened at a6. Forcing White to play 29.Nxa4 losing the Knight.> White can avoid the mate with 29.Nb5 or 29.Ne4 as well. I'm surprised that nobody has yet mentioned the hanging rook after 34...bxc5+. Apparently, I'm the only one not to see instantly that the pawn queens after 35.Kxa5 d3. As for the stalemate swindle at the end, whether or not White could escape the checks is totally irrelevant. There was no need to even go into the line and have to worry about it. |
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| Jul-30-08 | | kevin86: White avoids an interesting stalemate trap at the end.If 50 bxc5,black's rook can act like a runaway pig and check until doomsday. Black's king would be stalemate and it would only take a rook sac to effect the draw. With the slight intermezzo 50 g3+,all of the above is water under the bridge. |
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| Jul-30-08 | | Morphyisgod: <phony benoni> he can stop the mate by moving the knight by 29.Nb5 or 29.Ne4, but then white would win the exchange with 30.Nd3+, the best place to put the knight in that variation wood be 29.Ne2, then after 30.Nd3+ 30.Kc3 31.Nxe1 31. Nxd4, white looks better, as the pawn on d4 is weak. sorry if there are any mistakes in my analysis |
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| Jul-30-08 | | Once: Fascinating final position. As several others have pointed out, 50. bxc5 leads to a draw as there is not a single legal square on the board where white's king can avoid a rook check. And if white ever takes the rook, black is stalemated. <Grasser> I guess that Fritz 11 evaluates this is a winning advantage to white because of the horizon effect. Fritz is not analysing sufficient plies to determine that the perpetual is unavoidable. An interesting end to an otherwise uninspiring game. I would probably not have spotted it OTB - with either colour! |
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Jul-30-08
| | Phony Benoni: <Morphyisgod> You're righter than you think. If 28...Nc5 29.Ne2 Nd3+ 30.Kc3 Nxe1 31.Nxd4 exd4+, Black's knight escapes with a piece ahead. But the way my brain is apparently acting today, I probably shouldn't assert this. The upshot is that <grasser> was probably right in the first place. |
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| Jul-31-08 | | sallom89: Lol, you guys were talking about "if" 50. bxc5, I was searching for a stalemate in the final position thats why. Do'h ;o |
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Sep-09-21
 | | mifralu: Bogoljubov - Kupchik (1924) (kibitz #1) |
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