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Ioan Cosma vs Dragoljub Velimirovic
"Cosma Not" (game of the day Aug-19-2013)
Subotica Economy (2002), rd 11, Mar-26
King's Indian Defense: Fianchetto. Simagin Variation (E62)  ·  0-1

ANALYSIS [x]

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sac: 30...Bxf4 PGN: download | view | print Help: general | java-troubleshooting

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Kibitzer's Corner
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Jun-12-06  dakgootje: <it's more confusing than helpful.> But thats of course just because we are used to get the position seen from whites position. If the tradition would be to see it from the point of view of the player to move, then it surely wouldnt matter.
Jun-12-06  apawnandafool: about <breaking tradition>:

<chessgames.com> could implement a 'flip button' in a scorekeeping game like chessbookie.

you could earn chessbucks for the week's puzzles. (monday=low value, sunday= highest value)

the score is incorporated over a season.

(<premium members only> would be able to compete, and check their tactical progress by relative monthly totals.)

(if used, the flip button would penalize the user, subtracting 1/2 the value of the puzzle.)

Jun-12-06  dakgootje: <you could earn chessbucks for the week's puzzles.> and how are you going to check who solved it?
Jun-12-06  apawnandafool: you would input the move.
Jun-12-06  dakgootje: and then how to show you calculated more variations? a special program so you can type in the moves (not by moving the pieces around on a seperate board) and the like *43. bla bla 44. bla <variation 1> 44. ...bla 45 bla bla <variation 2> 44. ...bla 45. bla bla* or something?

ps: This probably doesnt look too intelligent as post =P

Jun-12-06  apawnandafool: <dakgootje> yeah, it's a good question. this idea is just a framework, maybe someone has an idea to solve this other than selecting puzzles without such variations, arbitration by volunteers, or (for example) by accepting 4 moves at once, such that they should fit possible variation.

ps: this probably looks more complex than it would be in practice!

Jun-12-06  YouRang: <dakgootje: If the tradition would be to see it from the point of view of the player to move, then it surely wouldnt matter.>

True, but the tradition is already in place. Sometimes breaking tradition is a good thing (if the tradition has flaws). But then again, sometimes traditions provide a standard where clarity is gained with minimal explanation. I think this is an example of the latter case.

<apawnandafool: you would input the move.> Interesting idea, but it wouldn't work. For some puzzles, you must demonstrate that you know how to deal with 2 or more lines. Anyway, there are lots of problems: No way to prevent cheating (peeking or using a computer), and someone is sure to make a typo in their answer. It sounds like an administrative nightmare that I doubt would be welcomed by chessgames.com.

Besides, chessbucks are too valuable to just give away like that. ;-)

Jun-12-06  Castle In The Sky: The only players who flip chess boards are sore losers.
Jun-12-06  apawnandafool: <YouRang - cheating, typos> it's just a way to keep record of one's tactical progress. i wanted to offer a hand down to someone climbing the ladder. but you're right, someone could fritz themselves into a champion. maybe without group competition, something more personal. like chess golf? <chessgames.com> could create 18-puzzle theme tactical courses, like golf. par = difficulty. a par 2 is 2 points (monday puzzle), a par 5 is 5 points (sunday type puzzle). <premium members> would then play a round and <chessgames.com> would determine the score. it would track of your points and your tactical progress throughout the course that you could view on a graph at your profile page. multiple courses.

ok, i'm just brainstorming now, so i'll have to stop before i say something all too silly!

Jun-12-06
Premium Chessgames Member
  Octavia: <keep record of one's tactical progress> good idea - a la emrald.com! except here we'd get 1-a-day & we could talk about the result the next day. In emrald you often have to put in more than 1 move. Talking about it the next day is good, because i often look at the chat when i can't be bothered to work it out for myself. This would force me to work a wee bit harder.

As in emrald cheating would be eliminated by keeping it to 30 sec at most - this way you can't ask any1 else for help.

Jun-12-06  RonB52734: I don't know if anybody has mentioned this or not, but if you're using Sjkbase as your viewer within cg.com, you can flip the board. The setting for this is right under the board itself.
Jun-12-06  RonB52734: I have this wild idea for a competition for chessbucks to help us keep track of our tactical progress: it would involve actually playing chess.

Nah, nobody would go for that, right?

Jun-12-06  LIFE Master AJ: This is a good problem ... and about right for a Monday.

It would have made a good problem for Wednesday (or even Thursday) if you had given as "Black to Play" at move thirty. (30...???)

Jun-12-06  dakgootje: <As in emrald cheating would be eliminated by keeping it to 30 sec at most - this way you can't ask any1 else for help.> Problem is that its way too little for harder puzzles. Think those things where people can easily cheat with things like programs wont work if there is a reward of something you can actully use (id est chessbucks)
Jun-12-06  blingice: <RonB52734: I don't know if anybody has mentioned this or not, but if you're using Sjkbase as your viewer within cg.com, you can flip the board. The setting for this is right under the board itself.>

That can be done with MyChess too...

Jun-12-06  Halldor: <dakgootje: <apawnandafool: you could earn chessbucks for the week's puzzles.> and how are you going to check who solved it?> I got an idea not as radical, that this could be similar to "Test your chess" as in the British Chess Magazine, where you go through a game, guess the next move when asked, and sometimes the continuation, then you can find out how many points you get depending on how much you saw in the position, sometimes you even get points for the second or third best move etc. This way you keep your own score and if you cheat, then you are just cheating yourself - nobody cares. When you have answered the questions you could get to the game as usual and read the posts. Just an idea.
Jun-12-06  apawnandafool: <halldor, ron, blingice, dakgootje,octavia, yourang> i think there are a lot of fun ideas available that will log a <premium member>'s tactical progress over a timespan. hopefully someone at <chessgames.com> will put this subject under consideration.
Jun-12-06  Fezzik: Even if chessgames.com were to come up with some way of getting an interactive tactical rating interface, there would still be the problem that already plagues some of the analysis here: what to do about those who use this site to train their computer programs instead of themselves?

While the idea of having chessgames.com keep track of each member's progress may seem appealing, it's much better to keep track of the progress yourself!

Jun-12-06  Paladin88doug: I got it! I knew the rook had to be the right piece to move, so I investigated. I think this was the sixth move I looked at and knew it was it.
Jun-13-06  dakgootje: <This way you keep your own score and if you cheat, then you are just cheating yourself - nobody cares.> Well yes that is mainly the situation for now as most people even at monday/tuesday puzzles post they got it, even though little people care for it, especcially for a day that early in the week. BUT, as suggested above, giving a reward in the form of chessbucks, is in my opinion not good as chessbucks arent totally worthless, as you can of course use them for the chessbookie game and some people mind how high they are there. and i think that game must solemn depend on your betting skills instead of let your problem solving skills combine.

Then an other thing is: <where you go through a game, guess the next move when asked>, here they show you the chessboard after the move played you previously typed in. This isnt really fair as that way you dont learn calculating as good as without a board, tha way its now, and after all we are here to learn things. Solution, a situation which i tried to show about 15 posts above this one, but i dont think it would be sufficient for more complex problems.

Dont get me wrong, im not a total opponent of the idea, just think there are some major weaknesses in it ;-)

Jun-21-06
Premium Chessgames Member
  patzer2: How can a move that looks and feels so right be so wrong? Well, that's the case with 30. f4??

After the surprising sham sacrifice 30...Bxf4!, Black has a mating attack. Note that the overworked White Knight is helpless against Black's multiple mate threats after 34...Re2!

Aug-19-13
Premium Chessgames Member
  kevin86: Mate will come soonest...
Aug-19-13  Conrad93: Why is this game of the day?
Aug-19-13
Premium Chessgames Member
  takchess: This is a good example of replacing defenders through trades weakening the position. Ending in a nice rook on the second rank overload of the defense.
Aug-20-13
Premium Chessgames Member
  morfishine: <Castle In The Sky: The only players who flip chess boards are sore losers> Sounds like a sore loser
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