chessgames.com
Members · Prefs · Laboratory · Collections · Openings · Endgames · Sacrifices · History · Search Kibitzing · Kibitzer's Café · Chessforums · Tournament Index · Players · Kibitzing
Itzchak Veinger vs Gennadi Timoshchenko
Seefeld op 9th (1998), rd 8
Sicilian Defense: Lasker-Dunne Attack (B20)  ·  0-1

ANALYSIS [x]

FEN COPIED

explore this opening
find similar games 1,429 more games of Timoshchenko
sac: 31...Bxf3+ PGN: download | view | print Help: general | java-troubleshooting

TIP: To access more information about the players (more games, favorite openings, statistics, sometimes a biography and photograph), click their highlighted names at the top of this page.

PGN Viewer:  What is this?
For help with this chess viewer, please see the Olga Chess Viewer Quickstart Guide.
PREMIUM MEMBERS CAN REQUEST COMPUTER ANALYSIS [more info]

Kibitzer's Corner
< Earlier Kibitzing  · PAGE 4 OF 4 ·  Later Kibitzing>
Dec-17-20  devere: Monday on Thursday?
Dec-17-20  saturn2: 31...Bxf3+†32.†Kxf3†Qb7+† wins pawn and exchange
Dec-17-20
Premium Chessgames Member
  al wazir: This was easier the second time. *Much* easier than yesterday's.
Dec-17-20  Olsonist: I love Mondays.
Dec-17-20  Walter Glattke: 31.-Bxf3+ 32.Kxf3 Qc6+ 33.Kg3 Qxh1 34.Bg2 Bxh4# 34.g5 f4+ 33.Kf2 Bxh4+ 34.Ke2 Qxh1
Dec-17-20  mel gibson: I saw that for the 2nd time. LOL

Stockfish 12 says:

31.... Bxf3+

(31. .. Bxf3+
(♗b7xf3+ ♔e2xf3 ♕d7-c6+ ♔f3-e2 ♕c6xh1 g4-g5 ♕h1xh3 g5xf6 ♖a6-a7 ♗e3-f2 ♖a7-d7 d3-d4 ♕h3-g4+ ♔e2-f1 ♖d7xd4 ♗f2xd4 ♖d8xd4 ♖b3-d3 ♖d4-f4+ ♕c2-f2 ♖f4xf2+ ♔f1xf2 ♕g4xh4+ ♔f2-g2 ♕h4-e4+ ♖d3-f3 ♕e4xf3+ ♔g2xf3 ♔f7xf6 ♔f3-e2 f5-f4 ♔e2-e1 e5-e4 a3-a4 ♔f6-f5 ♔e1-f1 ♔f5-g4 ♔f1-f2 e4-e3+ ♔f2-e2 ♔g4-g3 ♔e2-e1 f4-f3) +9.34/31 114)

score for Black +9.34 depth 31

Dec-17-20  stacase: The f3 Pawn is only defended by White's King. Hmmm what to do? Ha! 31...Bxf3+ attacks White's Rook and sets up the 32...Qc6+ skewer and visions of a rampaging Black Queen not exactly a sugar plum fairy dancing in his head.
Dec-17-20  Brenin: Third time round for this one. The hanging R on h1 and the weakly defended P on f3 make 31 ... Bxf3+ easy to see. Of course, one has to check that after Qc6+ and Qxh1 the Q can't be trapped behind enemy lines by Bg2, which would be embarrassing. It can't, as the P on h4 is also hanging.
Dec-17-20  morfishine: Winter reruns
Dec-17-20
Premium Chessgames Member
  agb2002: Level 2: 7.?
Lasker vs N Miniati, 1890


click for larger view

Dec-17-20  TheaN: I know that I've seen this one before, even though I've yet to post. After <31....Bxf3+ 32.Kxf3 (else Bxh1 at least -+) Qc6/b7+ 33.Ke2 Qxh1 -+>, if White attempts a queen trap with Kg3 he's worse off given the threat of f4+ and if the bishop on h3 moves, Qxh4+.

One could question the transition from Tuesday to Monday to Thursday?!

I get a 2006 Tuesday to become a 2019 Monday. Over the years I do believe the CG puzzle crowd (and most chess players) have become stronger tactically, so it's more in line of what we're able to solve, even a somewhat longer line on Monday than usual. I don't get today though. Did we regress three days further into the week? The only reason I took two minutes is because Bxf3 and Qc6 cannot be enough for a midweek-to-weekend PotD.

Dec-17-20
Premium Chessgames Member
  chrisowen: Large it nub vilify bxf3+ ghost afford podium vilify abattoir VAB again vilify blubb kast plum post-mort again vilify language vilify quite had daffy owe vilify yew cover vilify jayz its ketchup digest vilify wobble our cliff vilify rb3 fund accommodate vilify maid gxf5 feint ABG again vilify lugs add tot ghost hood edict adour bf3 aka?
Dec-17-20  Mayankk: Easy enough to notice the poor White Rook at h1 and how the Black Queen can skewer it from either c6 or b7 after its Bishop clears the diagonal.

Maybe itís CG tactics to confuse us by disguising puzzles under the wrong difficulty levels. It definitely makes it more interesting when you canít trust the labels any more.

Dec-17-20
Premium Chessgames Member
  drollere: this was straightforward, and the tactic of the discovered skewer is nice to see.

<It definitely makes it more interesting when you canít trust the labels any more.>

yes: and perhaps someday there is less commentary about whether a puzzle fits into the expectation of what a puzzle should be on a particular day, and more interest in the game itself and the tactics it illustrates in a particular position.

Dec-17-20  TheaN: <drollere: and perhaps someday there is less commentary about whether a puzzle fits>

Fair, I've had my share of complaints recently even though they try to keep the PotD relevant. I approach it more from a logical point of view and how it would happen rather than a blatant "bleh stupid puzzle".

Whenever puzzles are repeated though, I do get a bit disappointed. There are enough users willing to assist in picking PotD, and over the spawn of ~16 years we've had about 6000 puzzles, so I don't see how there are others to be picked in the rough million games on the site. Not all are suitable of course, but so far not even 1% has been used.

Dec-17-20  RandomVisitor: If white had tried the innocent-looking 13.a3, black could have responded with 13...Nxd3!? followed by a queen sacrifice, and complications:


click for larger view

Stockfish_20121407_x64_modern:

<52/76 27:27 0.00 13...Nxd3 14.Be3 Nxb2 15.Qxb2 Qd3+ 16.Kg1 Qxe4 17.Nd4 Qxg2+ 18.Kxg2> cxd4 19.Bd2 0-0 20.Rhe1 Rd8 21.Rad1 Rb8 22.h5 h6 23.Qb1 Bf8

51/52 27:27 0.00 13...Na6 14.h5 Qd8 15.Be3 Be6 16.Rd1 Bg4 17.Rh4 Qd7 18.Rxg4 Qxg4 19.Nh4 Qxe2+ 20.Kxe2 Rd8 21.Nf5 Kf7 22.Nxe7 Nxe7 23.Nxc5 Nxc5

Dec-17-20  RandomVisitor: Maybe 17.f4 was better:


click for larger view

Stockfish_20121407_x64_modern:

<51/53 1:11:17 0.00 17...exf4 18.Bxf4 Nbc6> 19.Nf3 Ne6 20.Qd2 Nxf4 21.Qxf4 Qxd3+ 22.Kg1 h5 23.Kh2 Bg4 24.b3 Qd7 25.Rhf1 Rd8 26.Rad1 Qc8 27.Rxd8+ Qxd8

50/71 1:11:17 0.00 17...Nbc6 18.Nf3 exf4 19.Bxf4 Ne6 20.Qd2 Nxf4 21.Qxf4 Qxd3+ 22.Kg1 h5 23.Kh2 Bg4 24.b3 Qd7 25.Rhf1 Rd8 26.Rad1 Qc8 27.Rxd8+ Qxd8

Dec-17-20
Premium Chessgames Member
  Jimfromprovidence: This is an excellent, high level puzzle. Move 37, BLACK to play and win.


click for larger view

Here is the game link.
I Cheparinov vs V Gashimov, 2008

Dec-17-20
Premium Chessgames Member
  Messiah: Hyper easy. Not even a puzzle.
Dec-17-20  moncul36: This was a Thursday puzzle? Looks more like a Monday...
Dec-17-20  RandomVisitor: After 2...d5


click for larger view

Stockfish_20121407_x64_modern:

51/67 1:07:54 0.00 3.d3 Nf6 4.e5 Ng4 5.f4 Nc6 6.Bg2 Nh6 7.Nf3 Nf5 8.g4 Nfd4 9.c3 Nxf3+ 10.Qxf3 h5 11.g5 e6 12.0-0 Ne7 13.c4 Bd7

<50/65 1:07:54 0.00 3.exd5 Qxd5 4.Nf3> Bg4 5.Bg2 Qe6+ 6.Kf1 Nc6 7.h3 Bh5 8.d3 Qd7 9.Na3 Rd8 10.Be3 e6 11.Nc4 Nf6 12.g4 Bg6 13.Nfe5 Nxe5

Dec-17-20  Brenin: If you are happy to stop analysing after 33 ... Qxh1, and to leave your best piece in the corner, then this is indeed an easy puzzle, Tuesday level at most. However, the Q will soon need to return home, and a safe route has to be found after each of White's three possible 33rd moves, including 33 Ke2 (avoiding losing a tempo to a check from f4 or h4). I reckon that this consideration adds at least a day to the level.
Dec-17-20
Premium Chessgames Member
  Messiah: <Brenin: If you are happy to stop analysing after 33 ... Qxh1, and to leave your best piece in the corner, then this is indeed an easy puzzle, Tuesday level at most. However, the Q will soon need to return home, and a safe route has to be found after each of White's three possible 33rd moves, including 33 Ke2 (avoiding losing a tempo to a check from f4 or h4). I reckon that this consideration adds at least a day to the level.>

I don't see any plans for White that would make escorting the Queen from h1 difficult.

Dec-17-20  Brenin: <Messiah>: The point is not whether White can trap the Q on h1 (clearly he can't), but whether one has truly solved the puzzle without checking that he can't. Black has a duty of care to his Q, and it would be negligent to leave her there without doing a risk assessment first, rather than after the event.
Dec-17-20
Premium Chessgames Member
  Messiah: <Brenin: <Messiah>: The point is not whether White can trap the Q on h1 (clearly he can't), but whether one has truly solved the puzzle without checking that he can't. Black has a duty of care to his Q, and it would be negligent to leave her there without doing a risk assessment first, rather than after the event.>

I totally agree; you found where we have misunderstood eachothers. Post-tactics assessment is very important, indeed!

Jump to page #    (enter # from 1 to 4)
search thread:   
< Earlier Kibitzing  · PAGE 4 OF 4 ·  Later Kibitzing>

NOTE: Create an account today to post replies and access other powerful features which are available only to registered users. Becoming a member is free, anonymous, and takes less than 1 minute! If you already have a username, then simply login login under your username now to join the discussion.

Please observe our posting guidelines:

  1. No obscene, racist, sexist, or profane language.
  2. No spamming, advertising, duplicate, or gibberish posts.
  3. No vitriolic or systematic personal attacks against other members.
  4. Nothing in violation of United States law.
  5. No cyberstalking or malicious posting of negative or private information (doxing/doxxing) of members.
  6. No trolling.
  7. The use of "sock puppet" accounts to circumvent disciplinary action taken by moderators, create a false impression of consensus or support, or stage conversations, is prohibited.

Please try to maintain a semblance of civility at all times.

Blow the Whistle

See something that violates our rules? Blow the whistle and inform a moderator.


NOTE: Please keep all discussion on-topic. This forum is for this specific game only. To discuss chess or this site in general, visit the Kibitzer's Café.

Messages posted by Chessgames members do not necessarily represent the views of Chessgames.com, its employees, or sponsors.
All moderator actions taken are ultimately at the sole discretion of the administration.

This game is type: CLASSICAL. Please report incorrect or missing information by submitting a correction slip to help us improve the quality of our content.

Featured in the Following Game Collections[what is this?]
31...? (Tuesday, July 25)
from Puzzle of the Day 2006 by Phony Benoni
fork leads to skewer-nets black a rook+pawn for bishop
from pins and needles-knives and forks. by kevin86
31...? (Thursday, December 17)
from Puzzle of the Day 2020 by Phony Benoni
31...? (Tuesday, July 25)
from POTD Sicilian Defense 1 by takchess
31...? (Monday, February 25)
from Puzzle of the Day, 2019 by Vassileskii
fork leads to skewer-nets black a rook+pawn for bishop
from pins and needles-knives and forks. by trh6upsz
PUZZLE 25/07/2006 BLACK TO PLAY 31...?
from puzzles from18/7/2006 by vuchamchi
31...Bxf3+!
from Skewer by patzer2
Short Tactical Shots
by LRLeighton

Home | About | Login | Logout | F.A.Q. | Profile | Preferences | Premium Membership | Kibitzer's Café | Biographer's Bistro | New Kibitzing | Chessforums | Tournament Index | Player Directory | Notable Games | World Chess Championships | Opening Explorer | Guess the Move | Game Collections | ChessBookie Game | Chessgames Challenge | Store | Privacy Notice | Contact Us

Copyright 2001-2021, Chessgames Services LLC