|
< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 2 OF 2 ·
Later Kibitzing> |
| Jan-03-15 | | gars: "Very difficult" is the right expression! I didn't see a thing until move 52. <An Englishman>, thank you for your explanation. And good morning to you all. |
|
| Jan-03-15 | | scholes: This was more like level of insane |
|
| Jan-03-15 | | Cheapo by the Dozen: As is usual this late in the week, I'm starting out stumped. 43 Rg6 is an appealing sham sacrifice, but I can't see what it really accomplishes. |
|
| Jan-03-15 | | Slim2211: Yes, but what if
51. ...Kh7
52. Qf7 Kh8 ?
I see only
53. Bg6 Rxg6
54. Qxg6
And W wins but it takes more time |
|
| Jan-03-15 | | TheaN: Saturday 3 January 2015 <43.?> Black has endured the painful kingside attack by White and had to give the queen for rook and knight. In the position at hand though, it seems black barricaded his position making use of the quantity advantage to defend the weakspots. The bishop on d1 is not helping in the attack, but bringing it in directly with 43.Bh5 seems not to do a lot, when black can defend with the risky but active 43....g6!?. The long analysis going into 43....g6!? learns us we'd want to prevent g6. <43.Rg6!>. At first side this sham-sac just seems to trade a rook, but it wins white the crucial e6-pawn if black accepts. <43....Kxg6? 44.Bh5+ Kh7 45.Bxf7 Rf8 46.Bxe6! Bxe6 47.Qe7  <>> abusing the material advantage to win back the bishop and dismantling the black defense starting at e6. This means black is best off declining. <43....Rb7 44.Bh5  > white has accomplished avoiding g6 and put the bishop in place. In addition, the rook keeps tabs on e6 and h6. From here however, I'm not sure how white can continue. Yes, the black position is in a chokehold, and eventually the queen will decide. |
|
| Jan-03-15 | | morfishine: As <Once> points out, <43.Rg6> prevents 43...g6, but thats about it. 43...Kxg6 is not forced. Black can play 43...Rb7 and now the White rook really is hanging. Since 44.Qg5 is met by 44...Nf7, White must either re-position the rook or support the rook with 44.Qh5, 44.Qg3 or 44.Bh5. Whats happening is Black is playing positionally, which in turn forces White to play positionally, which by itself, forces White to find a strategic plan. I don't see one
***** |
|
| Jan-03-15 | | TheaN: I'll admit I looked <before> posting the above, but I had it typed out till "in addition, the rook keeps tabs on e6 and h6". I was truly clueless on what white's plan would be if black keeps digging in, and it seems like I'm not the only one. I got the idea right of keeping g7 at bay due to tactical possibilities of Rg6 with an eventually Bxe6 and Qe7. |
|
| Jan-03-15 | | TheaN: I'd say Black erred with 42....Rb2+ which puts the rook out of place. Instead 42....Nf7! questions white's plan to capture on e6, as 43.Qh4 Nh6=. |
|
Jan-03-15
 | | varishnakov: I spent a long time on this. Finally I found 43.R-N6 which prevents black's key defensive move ...P-N3. My line went 43.R-N6 R-N2 (to remove rook from exposed square and get queenside counterplay; 43...KxR 44.B-R5+ and gets the rook back with a strong attack) 44.B-R5 followed by 45.Q-N5 or Q-N3 or something and meanwhile black could be getting counterplay on the queenside. |
|
| Jan-03-15 | | TheaN: <TheaN: I'd say Black erred with 42....Rb2+ which puts the rook out of place. Instead 42....Nf7! questions white's plan to capture on e6, as 43.Qh4 Nh6=.> Of couse I meant move 46, not 42. Not sure how I got to 42... |
|
Jan-03-15
 | | Once: I wonder ...
I've been thinking about the 45. Qg5 move. It might be a cleverer move than I first thought. Here's the position after 44...b4
click for larger viewWhite is doing a good job of infiltrating the black position. He now needs to get his queen onto the g file so he can play the Rxe6-Bxe6-Qg6+ trick. But if he plays 45. Qg3, he blocks his king's access to the third rank. Then the upcoming pawn exchange and Rb2+ could be awkward. The king needs access to g3 and doesn't want to find the Queen's Kardashianesque butt there. So 45. Qg5 Nf7 46. Qg2 (Qg1 might also work).
click for larger viewOkay, so the queen has taken two moves to get to a safe spot on the g file instead of one, but this is a closed position where black has little counterplay. White can afford to be take his time. White now threatens his Rxe6-Qxg6+ trick. He has closed off rook checks from the b2 square. And he has interesting plans like Rg3 and Bg6. Or white could think about a rapid switch to the queenside to gang up on the a pawn. 45. Qg5 looks like a silly move because 45...Nf7 forces it back, but I think it's really a clever two step hop into g2 or g1. White is in no rush. He can afford to carry on probing. Which incidentally, would make for a great comedy film set in Area 51... |
|
| Jan-03-15 | | BOSTER: My opinion that white game was a little bit timid. This is pos. white to play 33.
click for larger view I'd play 33.Qb4 and black have to play h6,<a coffee-house move>,creating the weakness in the black pos. But who'd like to play the pos. like this, where white queen has no mobility.
click for larger view Black to play. |
|
| Jan-03-15 | | M.Hassan: "Very Difficult"
White to play 43.?
White has a Queen for a Rook+Knight
43.Rg6 Kxg6
44.Bh5+ Kh7
45.Bxf7
White sacked a Rook, got a Rook and now attacking the Rook on g8, Knight on h6 is pinned and can not capture Bishop 45...Rh8
<if 45...Rf8 46.Bxe6 Bxe6 47.Qe7 Rf7 48.Qxe6 and White can capture majority if not all of the pawns from centre to Queenside of the board.> 46.Qe7 a4
47.Bxe6 Bxe6
48.Qxe6
And White is no doubt better
If Black King refrains from taking the Rook:
43.Rg6 Rc7
44.Bh6 Kh8
45.Rxh6+ gxh6
46.Qf6+ Kh7
47.Bf7 Rg7
48.Bxe6 Bxe6
49.Qxe6 Rcf7
50.Qxd5
White is going to get more pawns and with a passed pawn that he has now should be swinging towards a win! |
|
| Jan-03-15 | | TheaN: <Once> interesting points with the Qg2/Qg1 idea. Maybe that was Gufeld's idea all along. Typically, even at a bit higher ply the evaluations for Rg6, Qg5 or Qg2/g1 don't go through the roof and are considered worse for white. Might be that indeed the engines recognize white's material advantage and thus claim that even waiting moves win, but I'm not that sure. |
|
| Jan-03-15 | | Steve.Patzer: I am stumped on how this move wins. |
|
| Jan-03-15 | | Cheapo by the Dozen: Looks like a lot of us are in the same boat -- we saw that Rg6 is poisoned, but we're not seeing how that equates to a win against stolid defense. |
|
| Jan-03-15 | | patzer2: <al wazir: And why did Huebner give up his ♕? I don't see the point of 37...Qg7. If instead 37...Rg8 38. gxh6 gxh6 39. Rg5 Rxg5 40. fxg5 Qg7 41. Rg1 Rg8, black looks OK.> Strong GMs in general seem to have a strong aversion to defending passive positions, such as is likely to follow with 37...Rg8. However, in this case, I think you're right about 37...Rg8 offering Black the last best chance of holding. After 37... Rg8, Fritz gives the strongest response as 38. Rfg1, when play might continue 38...Rd8
39. Qh5 Bd7 40. gxh6 g6 41. Qg5 Be8 42. Qf6 Bf7 43. h4 Rdf8 44. Bc2 b4 45. Kh3 Qd8 46. Qg5 Qxg5 47. hxg5 Rb8 48. Rc1 to (+1.50 @ 21/43 depth). Despite the evaluation favoring White, winning this position will be very difficult even for the computer. Black seems to have excellent practical drawing chances with 37...Rg8, especially against a human opponent. |
|
| Jan-03-15 | | CHESSTTCAMPS: White has the material advantage of Q for R+N in addition to the advantage of the better bishop. But with the center closed, and the black rooks guarding against a queen entry, where can white find a breakthrough? Perhaps if white squeezes some more, good things will happen. 43.Bh5 g6 just gives black more space to operate. Preventing g6 will keep the black pieces in a very tight box. Therefore, 43.Rg6!! Increases pressure on h6. The rook can't be taken without additional and decisive material loss: A) 43... Kxg6? 44.Bh5+ Kh7 45.Bxf7 Rf8 (Rh8? 47.Qh5 followed by Qg6#) 46.Bxe6! (a move that took me a while to find) Bxe6 47.Qe7 Rc8 (Rf7 48.Qxe6 and black's d-pawn falls next) 48.Qxe6 Rd8 49.Qb6 wins another pawn with an easy win. B) 43... Rc8 44.Bh5! Bd7 45.Rxh6+! gxh6 (Kxh6 46.Bf7#) 46.Qe7+ wins B.1) 44... Rd8 45.Rxh6+! gxh6 46.Qf6+ Kh7 47.Bg6+! Rxg6 48.Qxd8 wins. C) 43... Rb7 44.Bh5 b4 (Nf7 45.Rxe6! g5 46.Bg6+) 45.Qg3! (the point is to keep control of g6, not stop the b-pawn) bc 46.bc! Rb2+ 47.Kg1 Rxa2 48.Rg5! a4 49.Bg6+ Kh8 50.Rh5 Bd7 51.Qg5 and black can't stop Rxh6+ forcing mate. Looks crazy and somewhat incomplete, but I'm going to review it now... |
|
| Jan-03-15 | | CHESSTTCAMPS: Wow - pretty close - I didn't see how white could culminate the attack with the queen on g5. |
|
| Jan-03-15 | | CHESSTTCAMPS: I was very tempted by agb2002's line, but thought it would lead to a position where white could not make progress. |
|
| Jan-03-15 | | CHESSTTCAMPS: Those who want to play the puzzle position against Crafty can use the following link: http://www.chessvideos.tv/endgame-t... |
|
| Jan-03-15 | | CHESSTTCAMPS: My Qg3 line was only good enough to draw against Crafty. |
|
| Jan-04-15 | | stst: got a long sequence but time for the 3rd day of 2015 running out... 43.Bh5 g6
44.Bxg6 Rxg6
45.Rxg6 Kxg6
46.Qg5+ Kh7
47.Qg3 Rg7
48.Qf2 Ng4+
49.hxg4 fxg4
50.Qh4+ Kg8
51.Kg3 (stopping the P) later Qd8+ but there does not appear any forcing in sight.... |
|
| Jan-04-15 | | Slim2211: IMPROVEMENT/CORRECTION:
After
51. ... Kh7
52. Qf7 Rg7
white attack is over and black has free pc4.
So, Gufeld was lucky dog. |
|
| Apr-01-16 | | ozmikey: <Slim2211> White's attack is indeed over after 53. Bg6+ Kh8 54. Qf8+ Rg8 55. Qxh6 mate. |
|
 |
|
< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 2 OF 2 ·
Later Kibitzing> |
Kibitzing
sac: 35.Nxh7